Back In The Fold

Conservative MEP Daniel Hannan writes:

Yet, almost overnight, the old antagonisms have been wiped away. The euro crisis pushed the two kindred nations together, and the Queen’s visit sealed their alliance. At dinner in Dublin at the weekend, most of the people I spoke to started from the premise that the EU was a disaster, and that Britain and Ireland should forge a closer relationship within the Anglosphere. One questioner asked about joining sterling, another about forging a joint foreign policy. A man who described himself as a lifelong republican wondered whether, if Alex Salmond succeeded in securing a ‘devo max’ settlement, it might not become the basis of a confederation throughout the British Isles.

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Ireland And The United Kingdom Have Never Been Closer (Daniel Hannan, Telegraph)

Previously: How We Differ

83 thoughts on “Back In The Fold”

  2. Sadly Europe does seem to resemble a Stalinist Authority (only without the gulags) – Maybe in future naughty people will be sent to Greece!

  3. There is a concerted effort behind the scenes to reunite Ireland and Britain. Many in FG would favour the union of course as their blood runs blue.

    I’ve always been a republican (in the true sense of the word). And I couldn’t stomach a union with a monarchy as it is utterly outdated and undemocratic to have an unelected head of state.

    But if England, Scotland and Wales became republics and Ireland united as a republic, then the is real argument for a federation of all four.

    A capital territory would have to be established somewhere. Or it could move every 10-15 years between the islands.

    The major downside in my opinion though would be foreign policy. The Irish are very sympathetic to the underdog and the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan is not something we could support. or any other military intervention for that matter.

    • Agreed – which would be the same stance as most of the Irish in this country I’d imagine.

    • Where do you get this from? “Concerted effort behind the scenes?”

      Did you find the minutes from one of these meetings in a bin on Kildare St or something?

      Talking through your hoop!

      • I read books and newspapers.
        I’m not an idiot.
        I notice patterns.
        I’m not an idiot.
        I’ve a general interest in politics.
        I’m not an idiot.

        • “The Irish are very sympathetic to the underdog and the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan is not something we could support. or any other military intervention for that matter.” …eh, we did support the invasions and continue to do so plus the israeli massacres.

        • No one claimed you were an idiot.

          To me it seems like some serious mental gymnastics to think that this is a possibility.

          Take the example of the Queen’s visit. To me, it showed that we are all moving on and slowly putting the past behind us. That we have an international relationship based on mutual respect. That is a huge leap from reunification.

          I too read newspaper, booked, and have more than a general interest in politics. Would be interested to hear more about your thoughts.

          • +1

            You know that scene in Forrst Gump where he takes off running with the ball and doesn’t stop? That, right there, is what Jockstrap did.

    • the recent royal wedding proves there is still overwhelming support for the monarchy… unelected they might be, but they arent behaving like dictators. And I would guess half the ladies in ireland were tuned into that same wedding, they love it really.

      Your own politicians and bankers have taken much more off the tax payer than any foreign monarchy so maybe have a think about that.

    • What is your source for the “concerted effort”? Or was it just that game of Risk / Supremacy 1914 / COD at the weekend?

      • It’s a fake “debate” put out there like the creationists vs. darwinists…a lot of closet rose-tinted british unionists now coming out of the, eh, closet.
        Our national self-esteem is not that low, I have little or no contact with the UK, never had, why would I want to be just another piss-ant region of England? How many Icelanders are baying to get back with Denmark? None.
        We need a second Republic declared. Wiping of the slate, ridding of the gombeen/seónín culture. It’s a thoroughly shameful proposition going back under a war mongering Empire, it’s BS.

    • There is. The visit of QE2 wasn’t a random act. Note how it only came to pass under an FG led government.

  5. cockneywideboy
    6 minutes ago

    Can’t wait to get rid of the Jocks (hopefully followed quickly by the Taffs).
    Why would we want the Paddies back sponging off our new-found wealth?

    lol

  6. I wonder if this is the only way we would get a United Ireland? I expect that if we were to voluntarily join the union, the NI Unionists would insist that their little statelet stays as a separate entity to the 26 county one. btw, I would rather see the Scots and Welsh become independent than Ireland joining the Brits!

    • It’s worth a debate though.

      Take it even further and include Denmark, Norway and Sweden. A union of Northern European states could be interesting.

      The ethics and social responsibility of the nordics mixed with our strong links to the US would be a good economic balance.

      • Yeah and bring in The Canary Islands. Nice and hot and sure they are in the Atlantic too.

      • I would much perfer to develop ties with Scandanavian countries than the British, or even the U.S. They’re more into sustainability and social justice. I’ve always said we should have followed Iceland in the economic cricis.
        Just look at the global democracy index. Always in the top 5 with New Zealand are Denmark, Norway, Iceland, Sweden. But then most of them are Constitutional MONARCHYS!!!

    • as someone who grew up in the north and on the unionist side, I would guess they probably wouldnt be too bothered as long as they werent being directly governed from the south, in the same way the south wouldnt like to be told what to do by the north… you could call the new state a United Northern Ireland to keep everyone happy! lol

    • Of course. The British royals renounce their status as heads of state. A modernised Magna Carta becomes the English constitution and allows them become a republic. Wales and Scotland follow suit. Even NI could become a Republic on her own if not joined with the ROI.

      Each state retains it’s own army and it’s own foreign policy. The will of people carries it from there on. Who knows what would happen 100 years from now.

  8. Hmmm. I’ve always thought we should be less cantankerous towards our eastern neighbours and allow expressions of the British heritage of many people living in the Republic in the same effortless way they manage it in Rossnowlagh. Co. Donegal every Twelfth of July.

    But a confederation with them? I’ve been described as a West Brit and even I’d need to think about that.

  9. At last a Tory sexual fantasy that doesn’t involve two wetsuits, a ball gag and a dominatrix.

  10. There is far too much soft talk here. Our history was fighting for our own political freedom and when we got it we might have let ourselves be governed by idiots in government and opposition. But that does not mean we should start considering joining the f***ing stirling. Have some pride people

    • I dunno, a lot of our recent history involved one bunch of people born in Ireland killing another bunch of people born in Ireland so that they could be more Irish than they thought they were. Sometimes a person born in England was killed, but not many really.

      Not really illustrious but yes, a lot of fighting.

      • dude you totally missed the point and our history goes back alot longer then the last 40 years. im not glorifying a cause.

        • It goes back to 1916, when most of the soldiers the rebels fought were Irish too. Even the one successful “operation” in 1916, when the rebels stole a load of gun from Ashbourne RIC station, involved Irish men killing Irish policemen, most from Co. Meath actually.

          There was a lack of English soldiers on account of there being a war at the time; the same war that delayed home rule and allowed a few nutcases to take over a few buildings and be mad yokes for a little while.

          • Don’t be an idiot the world didn’t start in 1916 our history goes back a long way from there. But i do find it worrying that your badmouthing the founding fathers of our country. Do you not like democracy? You seem to have some anti repubiclan buzz going on in yer head and i dont understand why you keep bringing all this stuff up with me, did your family fight for the other side in the war of independence or something.

    • +1000.
      The clowns in charge here for the past 90 years should inspire us to be better at governing ourselves into the future, not just throwing our hands up and running back to the gombeen cover of the british empire, have some pride in yourselves.

    • if you had any pride you would be out on your streets right now doing something about it… your enemy is closer than you think.

      • Dude my enemy is unemployment and i fight it every day by going to F***ING work not by being a hippy out shouting on the streets about how unfair life is because i was stupidly loaned lots of money for an overpriced house or that my union says im going to have to work an extra day a year to save the country.

        • Union eh – So you are a civil servant or work in one of the semi states?

          Nice work if you can get it – Don’t rub it in peoples face though!

          • no i dont work as a civil servant i was making a point that there there one of the groups that are the problem always wanting more money for less work where as i work ridiculous long hours for an average wage so dont have the time to be out protesting on the streets. so i wasnt rubbing it in peoples faces and if you read my previous comment properly you would have got that instead of jumping straight on my back

          • firstly marxism or communism whatever you want to call it failed as an idea. i believe in capitalism as a system, but the irish system failed because its not truly capitalist its had too many socialists medaling with it. but i digress so by your hippy thinking i should leave my job and go out and fight for the collectives cause because i only work for some innate need for more material goods, ha. what is wrong with that i work hard so i can supply my family with a better life i dont think i deserve the government to give me a better life i make it for myself. also i understand that the system is shit but out shouting on the streets will never change anything, violent protest that would culminate in the abolition of our governmental system and the creation of a new streamlined democratic system might change how things are run but we all no that will never happen because lefties are non violent and capitalists are too busy making money

  11. On the map bit: Are NI, Wales and Scotland actually countries or nations? I would have assumed Wales was a principality. Not sure about the other two. They are not listed as sovereign states anyway.

    • That stuff gives me a headache; no other places in the English-speaking world calls themselves countries and yet aren’t eligible to join the UN (my personal definition for a country) except Wales and Scotland.

      • The British Isles [a geographical, not political term] are divided between two countries which are independent states in international law, namely 1) the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland (so called since 1927) and 2) the Republic of Ireland. Unlike the states of the USA or Germany, or the provinces of Canada, the constituent parts of the UK (England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland) do not have legislatures with their own areas of exclusive jurisdiction, and England has no legislature at all. England, Wales, Scotland and Ireland have all been regarded for centuries as nations, and are still correctly referred to as such. This has nothing to do with legal status.

    • Some rugby twat must have drawn that map. Wales is arguably not even a country, never mind a Nation

  12. Oh my god, mad conservatives, mad republicans, little Irelanders, southern unionists, reconstructed Fianna Failers, crazy socialists,loony libertarians National Socialist shinners, blue shirts, maoists…… whatever next?

    Broadsheet what have you unleashed? You’re beginning to attract the craziest people from politics.ie!!!!!

    • Broadsheet is attracting the crazy people from politics.ie!?

      Time to go back to – The things that look like other stuff; When kittens go wild on youtube; Bad sign writing; Pure randomness; Where’s this place? Answer at X-time (but rarely given); And of course, nice sunrises :)

      • before anyone panics ask yourself this; how does “this person” know that those sorts hang out on politics.ie unless (drum roll) they are one of them

        • Hah! True.
          Is this URL-dropping activity here on Broadsheet some sort of new snobbery??

  13. I would like to see 5 independant nations forming that are as friendly as can be and work together to a mutually beneficial goal rather than Ireland joining the UK.

  16. You people have no vision. No vision, at all.

    I say, we negotiate with the Brits to give them back Northern Ireland (oh, you thought they had it, did you?). In exchange, they give us Montserrat in the Caribbean.

    For the people of Montserrat, they’re re-united with their ancestors, we make it a fully-fledged part of Ireland so they’re in the EU (mixed blessing, I grant you) with access to EU structural funds and partial-schengen. We offer them all the same terms as the rest of us get (which ain’t much), but others seem to like our apparent high rates of welfare and free education.

    For our part, we finally get a decent climate. Lord knows we deserve it. We’d all admit austerity and whathaveyou wouldn’t be half as bad if the fecking sun shone a bit more. Plus, Montserrat was devastated by a volcano. Guess what, lads! We have around 250,000 unemployed builders, plasterers, carpenters, electricians and project managers.

    I, for one, would vote YES on that referendum.