140 thoughts on “Meanwhile, In Mohill”

  2. Mr. T.

    Big deal. One of my neighbours did a black-face because she was dressing up as a person who happens to be black.

    It’s not racist FFS. Only apologetic white middle class people who have no black friends think it is.

    1. Nially

      What about apologetic middle-class white people who do have black friends, and whose black friends have said “Oh yeah, totes racist”? Are we allowed to think it’s racist?

        1. MajorThrill

          Can do!
          It is considered racist because blackface was used as a tool to appropriate desired elements of black culture into mainstream white culture while excluding black people from it all the while presenting them as harmless caricatures of servile, good willed, bumbling idiots.

          Now explain to me how presenting all Irish people as criminals with slightly above animal intelligence and a near sexual fetishisation of the potato (who may or may not be descended from a crossbreeding experiment between a pig and a turkey) isn’t just a *smidgen* offensive.

          (See also yellow paint and squinting when presenting asians as ridiculously tight fisted and sneaky)

          1. joj

            Well thats your reasoning for not dressing in black face. Other people are free to dress based on their decisions not yours.

            Its hard for your ego to accept that I know

          2. Prop Joe

            The thing is this person isn’t painted as a minstrel which is what you refer to above.

            Your argument falls pretty flat immediately the moment that becomes apparent.

          5. Anomanomanom

            Your irish example is nowhere near racist, it’s just rambling stupidity and nonsensical slurs. Blackface done on TV and all media in general is racist if IF we still lived in the same world when blackface was the only way to have a black face in entertainment. It’s in no way racist, If any of my friends thought it was then they’d just uppty sensitive.

          6. Nially

            God, I wish the casual racists on here would even pretend to be consistent for a few posts at a time. Like, the exchange above basically goes:

            “This doesn’t matter, because black people don’t find this racist”
            “Yes they do”
            “OK, well, that doesn’t matter because no one has explained to me personally why it’s racist”
            “Here’s an explanation”
            “OK, well, that doesn’t matter because I don’t agree with that explanation, and also freedom of choice!”

            Honestly, if you want to know whether something is racist, look around and see whether many, many people of that race are writing and talking about it being racist. In the case of blackface (and not just minstrel costumes, all blackface), they are. And yet people get absolutely *outraged* in the fact of any questioning of the right of some Mohill knob-end to dress up as “Black Mumba”, because….well, that’s the question.

            The way I see it, it’s relatively unlikely that you’re all just DEEPLY PASSIONATE about the right to wear whatever Halloween costume you like. This is about more than that, which is why it was posted in the first place and why we’re all bothering to comment. This is about the wider question of whether people (in general) should check or restrict what they do if it’s likely to cause offense or upset to someone else.

            Like, there’s literally no downside to “Black Mumba” up above dressing up as something different. There are countless Halloween costumes that no one (about from internet trolls getting their whataboutery rocks off) would ever call ‘racist’. But this Mohill knob-end does what he wants and doesn’t care about no internet SJWs (cause, like, he’s *such* a rebel), and crowds of casual internet racists row in behind him, talking over and diminishing the very real voices of loads of non-white people who’ve said, repeatedly and loudly, for years, that it’s not cool for us to dress up like them for the laughs. And the only reason I can think of for that is that you’re horrified at the very thought that you might personally ever have to go even the slightest bit out of your way in order to avoid doing something racist, and that idea of minimal interference with your life is so abhorrent to you that it’s preferable to spend your afternoon shouting down anyone who has a problem with this and saying “Well *I* don’t think it’s racist, and clearly *I’m* the only one who matters, so everyone else can jog on”.

          8. munkifisht

            It’s actually not inherently racist. In fact you’re misunderstanding what racist means.

            There’s nothing racist about painting your face a certain colour, it’s the beliefs of the person who does this that are racist. Let me give you the two examples I oft quote when it comes to this. One is the kid in the states who caused a furore when he painted his face black when dressing up as his favorite Marvel character, Nick Fury. The kid isn’t racist, in fact the opposite is the case. His hero is a black man. Ok, there’s racial insensitivity, but that’s different.

            Lets take a second example. in 2013 there was outrage because an Italian team Rioveggio blacked up, however the reason is anything but racist. One of their team mates who was black was being harassed by their fans with racist chants. To show solidarity and convey that the players skin colour does not matter, the team pout on black make up and said no to racism. In this case it’s way different. We might look at that and see it as perhaps not racist but racially insensitive, but that’s us looking from a US influenced perspective. This possibly (and I am not Italian, I don’t know) is not even racially insensitive.

            I’m not going to comment on the picture. I don’t know the background. It looks like a stupid costume. I don’t know if the guy’s a racist. What I am going to say though is so called black face is not in itself a racist thing.

          9. Jess

            Fair play Nially.

            The only people on the planet it seems that don’t realise blackface is racist is some Irish people and maybe a UKIP conference

          10. MajorThrill

            @munkifisht – that’s actually food for thought.
            I doubt the guy in the photograph was honouring anyone or putting himself out there to support a friend but I’ll accept that there can be exceptions to the rule.

      2. Neilo

        If hypothetical Afro-Irish compatriots are saying things like ‘Totes racist’ then we have achieved total integration, roysh?

    2. Neilo

      Is he meant to be the Trading Places character on the train to Chicago played by Eddie Murphy. You know: the Merry New Year guy?

        2. scottser

          wait till mohill gets ‘scarface’. it’ll be full of lads going round saying ‘i want you to meet my little friend..’

      1. Neilo

        I’d say that’ attitude typifies a significant tranche of Ulster opinion but I wouldn’t want to be accused of racism :)

    2. Jess

      It’s not racist because the white people explained that it’s not. Its their feelings on the subject that matters

  6. Frilly Keane

    Back in the day
    At an Old Christians Christmas Fancy Dress do
    86ish
    One’a the lads went as Sammy Davis Jr
    I thought t’was a savage get up
    And still do

    Get over yerselves ffs

    1. Starina

      awww, white people upset at being told they can’t do something? you poor thing. tis a terrible life of repression.

      1. Frilly Keane

        Wha’
        Having a laugh?
        Socialising in the true meaning of healthy social interaction?

        Is ignorant?

        You need to get off the tinternet lov’
        And go out
        And say hello to someone
        Reach out
        And not just point and click
        Your head will be the better for it

  7. Starina

    I was very surprised at the amount of people dressed as Native Americans on Halloween in Dublin this year, considering it’s common knowledge that that’s an unbelievably ignorant thing to do.

        1. Vote Rep #1

          According to the internet, a white male is now the most oppressed group around. Next I will go as that.

        3. munkifisht

          Irish people were pretty oppressed by most nations at least since Roman times. Should we be offended when someone puts on a paddy hat?

      2. Grouse

        No. Equating “Native American” with “cowboy” is illustrative of a limited understanding. If your first point of reference when Native Americans come up is Westerns, then I can certainly understand why you might not understand how dressing as one could be offensive.

        1. rotide

          If it were a conversation about indiginous people then i would equate it with something very different.

          It’s hallowe’en , therefore I know starina is referring to Cowboys and Indians. Because you know, 6 year olds.

          1. Grouse

            I think that’s the essential difference in perspective there: the people who are doing it are mostly thinking cowboys and Indians, but the people offended are a persecuted indigenous people. The question is whether the person who wants to dress up as an Indian should take heed of the feelings of long-suffering indigenous peoples. It’s up to them whether they do, of course. I personally would, as it’s not that difficult to come up with another costume.

          2. rotide

            The people being offended are the persecuted people?

            Know many native americans chilling around dublin then?

          4. Grouse

            So your position is that, even if the act becomes largely recognised as inappropriate and callous in the Americas, Ireland should be able to maintain is own clique of Native American dressing up because Native Americans won’t see it in the street? I dunno. Most of us see more photos of costumes on social media sites than we see in real life. I have a lot of American friends on the Internet. If I had decided to dress up as an Indian, and put photos of it on Facebook as most people do, there is a large chance someone with Native American heritage would see it. And it not someone who is directly Native American, then Americans cognisant of their history of oppression and persecution, and sensitive to such depictions. There aren’t a lot of degrees of separation these days.

            And even if no one directly affected sees the costume, it’s possible for a thing to be so tremendously sad (the genocide and of the Native American people followed by the appropriation of their customs for amusement) that people outside the direct sphere of influence could see an Indian costume as just kind of a bad thing, and understand why Native Americans might not want it. Any Dubliner is capable of disapproving of an Indian costume, why wouldn’t they be? Why shouldn’t I? Do you have to personally know the victim to by outraged by a murder?

            I wouldn’t get pissed off at a German for finding a Irish famine victim costume tasteless. Everyone has a right to empathy.

          5. rotide

            That’s the difference between you and me. I’d happily dress up as a famine era irishman or a coffin ship passenger and tell anyone who was ‘offended’ by it to PFO. I wouldn’t find it offensive in the slightest.

            Native americans probably have more things to worry about than 6 year olds dressed up as pocahontas and those things are not 26 year olds dressed up as sitting bull 6000 miles away.

          6. ReproBertie

            There is another group of people caricatured at Hallowe’en, heavily oppressed by the christian churches in the past and still oppressed today in parts of Africa and Asia but nobody runs around shouting at children for dressing up as witches.

            I look forward to St. Patrick’s day when all those people who dress in green are internet-shamed for being insensitive to the historical suffering of the Irish. Maybe we can rework that old song “they’re hanging men and women for the wearing of the green.”

      3. rotide

        So it’s not even blackface? It’s the act of wearing clothes suggestive of a particular group of people at a time where people where clothes suggestive of a particular group of people?

        Is it offensive to wear a liverpool shirt because of hillsborough?

          1. Neilo

            Hey, it’s offensive for any grown-up to wear ANY jersey unless they’re playing for the team emblazoned on the chest.

          2. Neilo

            Hey Frilly, do whatever you want, baby! I thought I’d deployed ‘offensive’ in a jocular way and I would never go agin the Rebel Horde!

        1. Neilo

          So, it would seem. Caucasian actor Odette Annable played a contemporary Native American gangster in the outrageously enjoyable TV series Banshee in 2015. Get me buzzfeed.com on the line!

          1. Stewart Curry

            “Odette’s father was born in Bogotá, Colombia, of French and Italian descent; he was raised in Nicaragua. Odette’s mother is Cuban. Odette was raised in a Latin household, thereby making her fluent in Spanish.”

          3. Frilly Keane

            Where does this leave the Village People
            Or the rest of us
            Whyyyyyyyyyy
            Mmmmmmmmm
            Seeeeeeeeeeeee
            Àaaaaaaayyyyying
            And doing the In Da’Navyyyyyyy

  8. rotide

    Took your time with this one, thought Aaron would be dredging twitter for some blackface outrage machines.

    I still don’t get why it’s racist.

      2. kellma

        Hmmmm whose line is where… I am going to dress up as Kim Kardashian for Halloween. I’m pretty pale so I will need to wallop on some fake tan to get as near to looking like her as possible. Is that racist? I am Irish, she is not (she is American with the expected mixed heritage)
        I appreciate the native American comment in relation to it being a race of people and not just a person but then if I want to emulate Bishop Desmond Tutu/ and not the entire African race and I am a pasty Irishman/woman, is it unacceptable to change my skin colour to match his more?

        1. Totoro

          Yes, it is unacceptable to change your skin colour for a costume. If your costume is good enough people will be able to tell who you are – I saw plenty of little girls of colour this year dressed up as Elsa from Frozen and I knew who they were supposed to be without them covering themselves in white facepaint.

  9. MoyestWithExcitement

    It’s definitely racist. It’s just not a big deal. ‘Hey look at me everybody! I’m a black man!’

  10. Janet, I ate my avatar

    Men dressing up as blonds with big breasts…”hey look everyone, breasts are hilarious ” please discuss

  11. Frilly Keane

    A lad here dressed up as a good boy

    Can I get the list of PC offences for him, please.
    So he can call me something more than “ignorant”
    Ta

  12. Owen

    This is a great oul post. I love a good ‘black face is racist’ argument!

    I’m getting a coffee and will come back here at lunch. By then I will have picked a side to defend, strongly. I’m leaning towards not racist. Mainly cause those saying it racist sound annoying.

        1. Frilly Keane

          One’a them snakes, yer man
          The nut job on Snakes in the City
          Goes mad for

          I think
          He’s got a mad accent

  14. Bort

    I wouldn’t personally dress up as black face, if i was dressing up as NWA, I’d dress up as NWA with all the other accompaniments but I wouldn’t “black up” my face. But to accuse this guy of being racist is unfair, it might be offensive but racist, I don’t think so. Will I throw “White Chicks” into the debate? Have the Mohill Immigrant Council or Mohill Society of Sub Saharan Africans made a comment?

    1. All the good ones fly south for winter

      White Chicks was different, they were trying to solve a crime and help society, not win a pig for best costume!

    1. Murtles

      That’s racist. Everyone know Leitrim people are the most oppressed race of people on this island since the Germans started buying up cottages all over the place and began shouting at their farm animals. Mohillians are the most oppressed people in Leitrim. They don’t even have water metres due to some GPS anomaly and no one can find the place.

  16. Joe

    PaddyMac tries to make a point about prejudice and completely undermines it with

    “I know it’s Mohill but jaysus!!”

    I’m sure there are plently of people in Mohill who think that’s not on, just as there are many in cities who think blackface is ok.

  17. MoyestWithExcitement

    “it might be offensive but racist, I don’t think so.”

    So if it’s offensive but not racist, why is it offensive? It *is* racist. Just because the word can also be used to describe burning crosses in people’s front gardens doesn’t mean it’s not racist. But. It isn’t burning crosses in people’s front garden. There’s no malice in it. It’s fooking stupid but not worth getting annoyed about.

    “Will I throw “White Chicks” into the debate?”

    If white people had been enslaved and oppressed by black people for a few centuries, that might work.

  18. Owen

    Right… I’m back.. Early lunch…

    Tell me this, if black face is racist is ‘Orange Face’ also racist to the Asians or Mexicans or something? Cause if it is most of the north side women between 16 and 60 are racist.

      1. rotide

        They’ll more than likely just respond with a similar racial ephitet seeing as they’re massively racist themselves judging by most of the chinese lads i know.

        anecdotal blah blah blah.

    2. rotide

      Is it not appropriation for white people to wear jewelery and clothes in imitation of people from black american ghettoes?

      1. Owen

        Indeed, one may find this ironic. But, my well red friend, please take caution on your implication that ghettos are inherently black, as one may deem this as passive racism.

        (see what I did there with the use of ‘red’ instead of ‘read’?? Spelling mistakes make people racist)

  19. jack johnson

    Oh noes commenters on the interweb says it’s racist so it must be ….taking offence for offence sake – sometimes it’s just dressing up !!

    1. Anomanomanom

      Well if a newspaper says so then it has to be true. It’s in no way offensive in the context it was done in. It’s like call a black person n*****, very racist. Black person to black person it’s not racist, why? Context. If you can’t understand context you should stop living.

        1. Clo

          Well, obviously if a considered and well argued article in a reputable newspaper isn’t your kind of thing…
          And surely the context that matters is that large numbers of people find blackface very upsetting and offensive. The fact that among other racists racist behaviour is ‘in context’ does not in any way make it legitimate!

          1. Anomanomanom

            Oh sorry yeah i forgot all true fact and opinions are only in reputable newspapers. Because the journalists who write for it are god. People like you just throw the “your racist” bit around to much. How about actually dealing with what I said.

  23. Jess

    You guys should totally write an open letter to black people explaining to them that blackface isn’t racist and they’re getting upset over nothing. You’d fix racism.

    1. Deluded

      “Racism doesn’t affect me, what’s your problem?”
      *sticks fingers in ears
      “NO, CAN’T HEAR YOU.”

  24. Kieran NYC

    It boils down to people defending blackface being told it’s offensive and hurtful to black people and not caring.

    *claps*

    G’wan. Show your kids how to be an uncaring bully. THAT’LL show the liberals!

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