A Chip off The Old Block

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90419957charlesmurphy

From top: Brian Murphy and Kevin Vickers Brian’s grandfather : Charles Murphy

Further to yesterday’s incident at Grangeorman Military cemetery involving the Canadian ambassador and a protestor.

Sean O’Driscoll in The Times ireland edition writes:

Brian Murphy was detained at Blanchardstown garda station and charged with using abusive or threatening behavior in a public place.

Mr Murphy told The Times Ireland edition that he did not know who the man was at the time.

I just saw this huge bloke coming at me. He complicated things in the middle of my protest. Down at the station the gardai were joking that I was lucky they rescued mefrom the Canadian Ambassador because he had quite a history,” he said.

Mr Murphy, the manager of the state funded St John Bosco centre in Drimnagh, Dublin is a grandson of Charles Murphy who fought in the 1916 Rising.

This entitled him to apply for an invite to the event through the Department of Foreign Affairs.

“I knew they would take me down, I just didn’t know how much time I would have to make the protest. The Canadian ambassador got a hold of me before the gardai did.”

Mr Murphy added that he carried out his protest because he felt that the two men convicted of killing Stephen Carroll, a PSNI officer did not get a fair trial. He also objected to the Irish government’s “apologetic” attitude toward the 1916 Rising…

Hero Ambassador Tackles Rising protestor (Sean O’Driscoll, The Times Ireland edition)

Yesterday: We Will Remember Them

Thanks Richard

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157 thoughts on “A Chip off The Old Block

  1. Bacchus

    Kevin Vickers is actually a very polite mild mannered man. He would use just enough force and no more. I suspect many others would have been rougher with Murphy.

    1. Digs

      In my mind he should be given the freedom of Dublin .Managing decorum at a civil ceremony is incumbent upon us all. That Murphy creature should be given a sweeping brush and a sandwich board.

    2. ForFecksSake

      We think so little of ourselves as a nation that we are applauding the assault of an Irish citizen by a foreign ambassador. If an Irish ambassador had done this in Canada we’d be talking about damage to our international reputation and he would be heavily criticised by Irish people. Vickers needs to realise he’s not a cop anymore and the Canadians should remove him from his position.

      1. Harry Molloy

        The alternative to someone “assaulting” him would have been for everyone to stand by and watch him prevent a solemn ceremony from occurring.

        And make no mistake, he was trying to prevent rather than protest, something he had no right to do.

        1. dan

          A solemn ceremony? A Ceremonial event to remember the British soldiers who died during the Easter Rising, 1916.
          Do the Brits commemorate the Germans who died in WW2?

        2. ForFecksSake

          No the alternative would have been for the ambassador to stay out of it and allow the gardaí present to deal with the situation.

    3. M

      People should be very wary of this Vickers character. There is a lot more to that Ottawa shooting than the narrative of him as a ‘hero’. Look into it.

      As for Murphy, if his job was to alert people like me to the Craigavon 2 then he succeeded brilliantly. I didn’t even know who the Craigavon 2 were – and I follow this stuff closely. Turns out they were framed. Which provides one possible rationale for why we never heard anything about their trial in the media when it was happening. Like, zero.

      I know which of the two I’m supporting this morning.

    1. Andyourpointiswhatexactly?

      Aye. I’m kind of conflicted. The other guy was a bit of a tool as I don’t think that was a particularly dignified protest but on the other hand it’s not massively ambassadorial to physically wrestle with someone. He should have fired Ferrero Rochers at him.

    2. Howard Schultz

      The rozzers certainly had their act together, didn’t they. This clown was able to run out and make his moronic ‘protest’ without being taken down. Sure what if he had a knife, or a gun, a grenade or two? This kind of crap has happened on this island before.

      You probably would have given this cretin a podium to explain why two convicted cop-killers were treated unfairly, bless ’em.

    3. Bacchus

      I imagine Owen, after a long career as a mountie and then Sergeant at Arms, his reaction was instinctive and measured.

      1. newsjustin

        The protestor has rings on his middle and index fingers. RED ALERT right there.

  2. Dόn 'The Unstoppable Force' Pídgéόní

    “He complicated things in the middle of my protest.”

    This is kinda cute really

  3. brownbull

    Is anyone else concerned that an apologist for Real IRA murderers is indoctrinating children at a state-funded youth centre? also why are descendants of people who participated in the rising one hundred years ago given preferential treatment by the republic?

      1. Declan

        Yes but he’s a community activist. That’s completely different.

        Does anyone know his actual bee with the prosecution and appeal?

        1. MoyestWithExcitement

          He’s a 21st century Dubliner who gets emotional about nationalism. Who cares what his bee is? He’s just some clown.

    1. Howard Schultz

      Correct – if this lad was wearing a thawb & keffiyeh and ran across the graveyard pitch screaming about justice for Osama, you can bet there would have been an inquiry as to what the fock he is doing near any kids.

  4. newsjustin

    He should be thanking the ambassador for making his attention grabbing far more impactful than he could have ever dreamed.

  5. ahjayzis

    Is opposition to hereditary privilege not a tenet of republicanism?

    Why are distant descendants of the characters afforded both a special say in the commemorations and special invites based on bloodline?

    1. Nigel

      Er, don’t relatives and descendants of the deceased usually get invited to memorials for their family members? It’d be odder if they didn’t.

      1. ahjayzis

        Their kids maybe. Grand-nephews? Will the same be the case in another 100 years?

        The bereaved is one thing, the third, fourth, fifth generation of descent is hereditary privilege.

        1. Nigel

          That seems unnecessarily strict and a bit arbitrary. Involving direct descendants isn’t hereditary privilege, it’s involving the family of the people you’re commemorating. And yes, as time goes on, having direct descendants becomes more difficult but it remains worth ding if you can manage it to provide a living connection to the past. Clamper’s argument about granting them too much of a say in the 1916 commemorations is well taken, though, I’d actually forgotten we’d discussed that before.

          1. ahjayzis

            I just don’t see why in a Republic which by definition belongs to us as all, at a commemoration that belongs to us all, some of us by dint of bloodline skip the queue. The connection to the past are the places concerned, the government that grew out of that movement, the army that grew out of that movement.

            If you were born 60 years after the person concerned died you get a seat by the president at any and all commemoration of the state’s foundation? That rubs me up the wrong way. It’s not Republican.

    2. Harry Molloy

      I also completely agree, was especially pronounced when the families of 1916 demanded a greater say in the ceremonies, it’s actually an affront to republicanism

    3. Martina

      How you can compare royals living on millions of state supported benefits with a seat up the front of an event is beyond me.

      1. ahjayzis

        Well you see Martina, the Royals attained their position by virtue of being born into a certain family. And the relatives in this case get special involvement by virtue of being born into a certain family. Merit plays no part in either, so in that way they are comparable. Do you see it now?

        The pride of place they’re afforded, in a Republic based on merit and equality, would be better given to citizens who’ve made particular contributions to their community, society, not some randomer who’s great-great uncle was a great man.

    1. Cowenwatch

      Im sure Francis and her sidekick, Noirin, have nearly everything under control! Just keep them away from people who ask questions and everything will be rosey!

  6. Vote Rep #1

    I am in two minds about this, in one way what the hell are we doing having an official memorial for British soldiers? That is weird. They were an occupying force for gods sake. On the other hand, they were having the memorial so don’t be a dick and interrupted for something not even related to it.

      1. JohnJoeMahockey

        That doesn’t make it any less weird. It’s a commemoration of an oppressive occupying force. I’m not being radical in calling it that. That’s what it was. The fact that a percentage of them were Irish makes it no less wrong.

        1. ahjayzis

          It’s a commemoration for the young men, practically kids, who lost their lives. You can commemorate the losses and reflect on the tragedy without validating the cause.

          Young working class boys from Dublin or Manchester sent to die in French trenches or on Dublin bridges, what’s the difference?

          1. Cian

            They weren’t opposing the existence of the state that’s commemorating them.

            But yeah – I wouldn’t mind if this was explicitly a memorial that accepted the moral bankrupty of their cause, while commemorating the young men sent to die so that King could keep Ireland in his title. I somewhat suspect that this wasn’t that kind of memorial though – if it was, you’d be rather less likely to see commonwealth ambassadors there.

          2. ahjayzis

            They weren’t opposing the existence of the state that’s commemorating them.

            They thought they were in France FFS.

            They were uneducated, working class kids either conscripted or trying to feed their families.

            WWI commemorations in general aren’t about the cause, it’s explicitly downplayed because it was a crazy war – they’re about the tragedies and the needless loss of life.

        2. Kieran NYC

          It’s a sign that we’ve moved on enough to live and let live and mourn the needless loss of human life together.

          1. Shayna

            I agree that that was probably the intention, however the tv pictures of a huge looking ex-cop (Mountie – they always get their man) man-handling a scrawny (by comparison) guy to the floor didn’t particularly invoke decorum, as one would expect from a diplomat? Following his esprit de corps in Canada, he was rewarded with a posting in Ireland, I wonder where next for the former Sgt. At Arms?

      1. Ultach

        Not to mention the armed paramiltary colour party who were marching around with flags at the time glorifying colonial deathlust.

    1. JohnJoeMahockey

      So he can assault an Irish citizen if he wants? That’s what it was. He has no authority here. He has therefore assaulted him.

        1. ForFecksSake

          Of course he assaulted him. He has no authority to use physical force against another person other than self defence. This was not self defence. The man was not violent and backed away as Vickers charged at him.

          1. Harry Molloy

            And if a garda moved him that would have been assault too? Yes, but thankfully common sense takes some discretion in the most obvious of cases

          2. ForFecksSake

            No it would not have been assault if the Gardaí removed him because they have the authority to use force against a member of the public when necessary. Ambassadors do not.

          3. Harry Molloy

            People do to prevent a crime or breach of the peace. it’s provided for in legislation. It’s how bouncers can work for example.

  7. Eoin

    I don’t know who’s idea it was to place the names of British soldiers on any monuments here. Now obviously they WILL get defaced and destroyed by somebody. Something a bit more modest and sensitive to the people who died DEFENDING us from British rule and her military would have been appropriate. There’s a minority here who won’t stand for this. This whole thing has been an example of ultra politically correct bull. This neo liberal political correctness that nobody wants apart from an extreme few hard left fascist types, who seem to be making all the decisions. People generally aren’t on board with it. If our political class payed more attention to people here instead of their masters in Europe they’d have known that. Now they will have to learn the hard way. Is anyone taking odds on how long before these get defaced? I’m reckon within six months.

    1. Clampers Outside!

      “There’s a minority here who won’t stand for this.” We can’t be mature about our history because of some few tools? Feck the deluded morons out there, just feck them!

      Here’s an excerpt from a conversation I had on Feckbook with some Shinnerbot yesterday…. get a tissue, you may cry laughing. This is the level of stupidity out there….

      “Actually, they were heavily involved. Executed leaders Pádraig Pearse and Michael O’Hanrahan were both founding members of Sinn Féin, as was Constance Markievicz. Executed leader Seán MacDiarmada was Sinn Féin National Organiser while Sinn Féin Councillors W. T. Cosgrave and Seán T. O’Kelly also commanded units during the Rising.”

      Constance Markievicz founded Sinn Fein Ted….. Some man for one man Ted! Where’s Griffith, eh? That guy is a big SF supporter…. they are so deluded they don’t even know what they support.

      1. Tony

        Why is it mature to move on and ignore history?? You hate the Shinners and love the Brits. Stockholm syndrome much?

        1. Clampers Outside!

          That’s completely moronic nonsense.

          Moving on is not ignoring you numpty. Moving on is encouraged in ALL walks of life in ALL matters dealing with getting oneself over difficulties, whether individually or as a group. It is a recognized the world over as an integral part to a “healthy” step in any trauma recovery. Moving on is a basic step in acceptance of the truth of any difficult situation.

          You can show massive respect and still move on.

          The idea that you cannot ‘move on’ and show respect is just a snide petty move to shut down conversation.

          Grow up Tony.

        2. Tony

          Sorry Clamps, I have to disagree. Your deep (and admitted) hatred of Sinn Féin is colouring your whole view of Republicanism. As a republican I abhor what the Brits did here and abroad for many centuries. It was Imperial and should be condemned for centuries to come. Frankly, a lot of those who want to move on are just modern day unionists in denial. I have no problem with unionists, but they should just admit it rather than beat up on those who want to remember and respect those who dies for our independence. Move on yourself, Ill stay here a while and give thanks.

          1. Tony

            Ill let you have the last word as you seem to like that when you get into one of your hateful strops :-0

          2. Clampers Outside!

            I dislike SF for their constant lies and spinning of the truth. And more so, my dislike of the fools that lap up the spin and lies as absolute fact. I have no problem being called out for disliking the nonsense that comes out of the mouths of the unthinking drone supporters of a disgusting party.

            The rest of your spiel is the same ol’ clap trap I’ve become accustomed to hearing.

            ———————————
            As for your little dig a comment or so back, Hah! pathetic…. ‘Stockholm syndrome’ ….I know exactly why you through that in there.

            Go suck yo own willy, willy.

          3. Tony

            Clamps, you are totally entitled to hate who you wish (and that list is long!).. But you will be called out when you twist history or truth to justify your hatred. Accuracy doesn’t seem to bother you, but your untruths have consequences so therefore they must be challenged. Opinion is not fact my friend. A fact lost on many posters on here.

          4. Tony

            . But why were they given the privilege to dictate who could and could not attend the commemorations?

            They weren’t. Fact.

          5. Tony

            You can’t prove it can you. Like I said, you are twisting and inventing facts to suit your agenda. But thats ok, cos at least you admit you have an agenda. Just try and not ruin anyones name with untruths as you chase it. Good man.

          6. Tony

            A sorry attempt Im afraid. being against something is not having the power to dictate events. Its like opinion and fact. Different. Not the same.

            Don’t worry, its a common mistake on here. thanks anyway.

    2. A Certain Ratio

      Tony, you know those “paramilitary” funerals up north where some scumbag IRA/SF pill dealer has been murderised? All the lads are out in their mirror shades and dunnes stores white shirts?

      What would happen if someone were to have a little protest against say, drug dealers, the IRA, or general criminality?

  8. fluffybiscuits

    Its conflicting for me , created a crisis of conscience.

    Canada are a nation that went into Afghanistan in the first wave in 2001, these are monuments to imperialism

    Ahjayzis summed it up nicely –

    “Is opposition to hereditary privilege not a tenet of republicanism?”

    Frankly why create a lot of PR about the British memorial to those who died in 1916? Let it be a quiet ceremony

    1. MoyestWithExcitement

      Because we have to show we’re a confident and modern society that doesn’t hold petty grudges against Britain over things that happened 100 years ago.

      1. Tony

        You’re right. We are over the 700 years of famine, forced emigration, rape, robbery, pillage, torture, language and religious discrimination. Move on everyone. We are modern now. Mind what the neighbours think. Fupp the Brits. They need to be constantly reminded of the human suffering they caused over continents and centuries.

        1. ahjayzis

          Which Brits? Were 90% of the population of England living lives of luxury during all that time?

          What personal memories do you or your granny have of the famine? Which Brits alive are responsible?

          Have you so little in your life you need to resurrect centuries old grievances to get yourself riled up? Grow up soldier boy.

          1. Tony

            Move on. Nothing to see here. Thats sad actually that you run from your history. The whole point of commemorations and anniversaries is to confront, reflect on and learn from the past. You need some intellectual courage to do that. Only cowards run away.

          2. ahjayzis

            I think it’s tragic you’re play-fighting a war that’s so long over with your big victim badge and mournful reflections.,

            You’re not confronting or reassessing anything, you’re playing soldier-boy in a conflict past it’s sell-by. Jewish Israelis don’t talk about Germans like there’s an SS officer around every corner.

            You’re like the auld fella who lectures a child ad nauseum on the injustices committed by it’s dead great granddad against your dad.

          3. Tony

            “I think it’s tragic you’re play-fighting a war that’s so long over with your big victim badge and mournful reflections”

            Are you talking about the marref anniversary commemorations?

          4. Tony

            As i celebrate the memory and bravery of those who died fighting imperialism so that you could have your ref.

          5. ahjayzis

            Ummm, sticky wicket citing independent Ireland’s treatment of the gays versus the UK…

            But once again your reading comprehension has failed you spectacularly – nowhere did I suggest we shouldn’t commemorate any soldiers.

    2. Clampers Outside!

      All and any republican who condoned such privileges at Easter is a hypocrite, and dishonored those who died by going along with a tenet of monarchy in the commemorations. I tolerate it, that’s the kind of society we live in, strive for, a tolerant fair one, but I still see it as hypocrisy of the descendants.

      1. Tony

        I think it is possible to recognise the relatives without necessarily condoning privilege. Its in our nature to respect families and their descendants. Being republican doesnt strip us of our basic humanity.

        1. Clampers Outside!

          Of course it is. But why were they given the privilege to dictate who could and could not attend the commemorations? That was wrong, that should have been a people’s choice. Among other privileges received that one most certainly should not have been given, especially if they say they believe that privilege by birth is wrong, which is what those men and women died for.

          1. Tony

            You are clearly overstating their “privilege” to make your point, but you are wrong. They made they voices heard, they had a couple of splits, they were acknowledged rather than privileged. They had no veto on anything except their own meetings. And the more radical of them were publicly ignored on more than a few occasions. But dont let that get in the way of your truth!

          2. Clampers Outside!

            Look it up Tony. they had far more say than you believe.

            I’ve had this conversation out before. The proof they had a big say has been given, I’m not going down this route again. Look it up, if you are so inclined, but I’m not debating this again, the proof is there.

          3. Tony

            My dear man, you are making the claim, its up to you to prove it. I happen to know it is false. I happen to know the whole sorry saga of the relatives sense of entitlement and how they were refused their privileges. So please, prove it- or is it just another piece of your obsessive loathing of Shinners and Catholics. Confirmation Bias methinks.

      1. ahjayzis

        What’s the difference between saying what you think is a good idea that would help people – and ‘virtue signalling’. Other than it being something you disagree with?

        If you help your granny out of her seat are you doing what you think is right or showing off that you’re so virtuous?

          1. ahjayzis

            So things you disagree with, gotcha.

            Quit your virtue signalling over virtue signalling, it’s just virtue signalling.

          2. Kieran NYC

            But women were at some of those ceremonies, Sad and Lonely Feminist Tony!

            Women! In public! Imagine!

  9. some old queen

    Civil disobedience is clearly a thing now. I like it.

    Seriously, this was one civilian assaulting another. It was up to the guards to bring that guy down. I don’t think it should be in anyway lauded because others doing likewise could end up in serious trouble.

    What was he protesting about anyways?

    1. Harry Molloy

      He was justified though, anyone is justified in using force to prevent a crime or a breach of the peace. This was a breach of the peace.

      I think, and of course this is just my opinion, that it was just hugely distasteful to disturb an event that was commemorating the dead, it’s similar to making noise at a funeral.
      Protesting is good but your methods will determine the level of public sympathy you get.

      1. Gorev Mahagut

        The fact that he chose to stage his protest in opposition to this commemoration suggests that Mr Murphy’s motivation is grounded more in hostility to a perceived enemy, than a disinterested concern for the observance of justice in the Northern Ireland legal system.

        As for Mr Vickers, I can only say that if I had diplomatic immunity, I’d probably punch everyone within reach.

    2. rotide

      “What was he protesting about anyways?”
      It helps to read the actual post sometimes.

      He was protesting about 2 murderers in another country.

    1. Nigel

      Funnily enough I had family on both sides – that is who traditionally joined the British army and who were supporters of the IRA. The appalling misery of history aside, I have decided that this is cool.

      1. Tony

        How come you didn’t call Clampers on his use of the word retard? Seems to be a bugbear of yours.

          1. Tony

            All hypocrites are bugbears of mine Clamps! I patrol the internet looking for them so I can slay them with my truth gun.

  10. Kolmo

    It’s all to do with current British-Irish maneuverings and positioning, absolutely nothing to do with the deaths of British soldiers 100 years ago, there is definitely a sense of “sorry Ma’am” about the whole thing though, like apologising to a violently abusive unhinged parent for leaving the lid off the toothpaste. The hatred for anyone making a protest (undignified or otherwise) is depressing.

    Wait till they come for you.

    1. Harry Molloy

      There wasn’t too much “hatred” towards the ladies protesting the eight outside Leinster house yesterday, and a very effective protest it was.
      Protestors need to think a little harder about the manner and the tone.

      1. some old queen

        Oh come on. The guy pulled a peaceful media stunt and it worked. It is all over the papers today and people are asking what it was all about. Result.

        What will be more interesting is if the Canadian ambassador will be recalled now. If an Irish one behaved like that in a foreign country, he (or she) would be recalled double quick.

        1. Harry Molloy

          Oh I’m not saying he didn’t get a result, just stating that I and plenty others found it distasteful and that I don’t find protests distasteful in general

  11. Tish Mahorey

    All the Fine Gael bluebloods coming out as Royal apologists, acting like subservient subjects, showing their true colours as pro-union propagandists.

    Can you imagine the British commemorating German soldiers who bombed and killed civilians? No. So why should we go out of our way to doff the cap to an imperial army who hated our guts.

    This is Ireland under Fine Gael – undermining our culture, history and heritage. They want us back in the Union.

    1. Gorev Mahagut

      I was at a commemoration for German soldiers of both World Wars, the British Ambassador was present and laid a wreath. Magnanimity behoves the victor. (Of course I understand those of Mr Murphy’s persuasion believe themselves losers of the War of Independence, on account of the six counties, but they are too hard on themselves. They won that war; they lost the Civil War).

    2. Clampers Outside!

      Yes, I can imagine the Brits doing that, and I can imagine them going further… oh wait, that’s a memory…. where they all headed off to France and were doing it there too with a bunch of not just Germans, but French, of course, and Dutch, Polish and whole load of others.

      Why do you ask?

      Oh… and here… have a look see how other countries do it. Denmark, for example, “Germans
      and their former allies are explicitly invited to attend this commemoration. The Danish people believe that all victims should be remembered on this day, so there is no controversy about including Germans in the commemoration. ”
      http://www.4en5mei.nl/documenten/Onderzoek/after_the_war_-_total.pdf

  12. Declan

    Any chance our modern day nationalism can be be built on something like being better than everyone else (health service, housing, an odd rugby/football World Cup final wins) rather than what those across the water did?

    1. Harry Molloy

      Good idea!
      I think we should aim to have the best, most natural, farm produce in the world sought after globally for it’s flavour and purity!

    2. Tony

      I like that. However, any such endeavour just being with the belief that we are worth loving and that we have greatness inside us. The effect of colonisation, as expressed by so many on here, is to make us believe we are a worthless, feckless race who don’t deserve no sunshine. Obvs I totes disagree and find so much to be proud of that could form the basis for a new nationalism.

      1. Harry Molloy

        It’s an interesting discussion. The only thing I can think of where it is widely held that we are the best in the world, and optimistic and proud of it, is horse racing.

        That’s obviously not something we can hang our collective hat on but I admire the pride and success that those involved have.

        It would be amazing, in line with your comments, if that energy and feeling and success could be attached to something more social and universal.

        I’m waffling but it is Friday…

      2. Kieran NYC

        Speak for yourself, Tony.

        Actually, that does speak volumes about you… Is it because the Queen is a woman?

  13. Rowsdower

    Well said Tony, Martina, jack johnson, dan, JohnJoe Mahockey, Eoin and ForFeckSake. It’s a relief that not everyone is still bending over for the brits

    Ahjazis, get on with your life in England, concentrate on Brexit, give the English forums some welly and clap-trap, enough poop-talk on here for one day

  14. Rowsdower

    @ Clampers

    I thought you shower were on commission? Wouldn’t like to be depending on you to whack your wad in the counter at the end of the week with the amount of time you spend on BS brown-nosing the turn-coats and brits.

  15. Stan Squires

    I am from Vancouver,Canada and I wanted to say that I supports Brian Murphy in his protest against the reactionary,imperialist British army.Kevin Vickers should be deported from Ireland because of this attack on Brian Murphy.The British Army was a problem in Ireland in 1916 and it is still a problem in Northern Ireland today. Like Bobby Sands said:England Get Out Of Ireland..The British Army got what it deserved in 1916 and they should be condemned in Ireland not supported.I’m sure Brian Murphy got lots of support in Ireland. Keep up the good work.

  16. Peter Dempsey

    The big question

    Does Brian Murphy support the Omagh bombing?

    And if the answer is no, then why not?

Comments are closed.

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