Amnesty Ireland is holding a protest calling for a repeal of the 8th amendment.
The organisation tweetz:
Since 1971 over 177,000 women and girls have left Ireland to have an abortion. She is not a criminal. Repeal the 8th…Ireland needs to stop the hypocrisy – Irish women have abortions, just not in their homeland.
Previously: A Deliberate Denial Of Care
Pics: Amnesty Ireland
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oh ABMMMMMMM… ?
Where aaaare youuuuu?
we pine for your gloriously wacky return
I’ll stand in for now.
“ARREST THOSE SLUTS. PUT THEM IN PRISON UNIFORMS. SEND ME THEIR UNDERCLOTHES IN A JIFFY BAG”
donkey kong does it much better below..
thanks….I think….
hey don’t thank me.
no, really – don’t.
You’ve been donkeyed!
Nice collection of suitcases, in fairness.
ah amnesty jumping on a new bangwagon.
have they grown tired of tinpot dictators or the US empire to rage against….
They forget that a sizeable number of people don’t want a society with abortion.
There is right-on brigade liberalism being forced on people or there is respecting the will of the people.
Democracy? oh right…its’ amnesty what do they care about democracy?
And the opinion polls in Ireland show how out of the loop you are
opinion poll me hole.
only 3 months ago lord kenny was as teflon as john gotti now after sunday’s latest installment he is in the doldrums and clinging on to power….
I’ve as much faith in them as I do in the integrity of Michael Lowry TD.
I’ll accept the votes in a referendum , even if I don’t like the result. I’m pro -life but not anti democracy.
But do we need a referendum every decade to sort this out – I think not.
I’m talking about polls of abortion, not politics which may shift more than social norms so I’m not sure why you are changing the subject to something irrelevant. Nearly 70% of Irish people support abortion albeit in certain circumstances.
Social norms change so why not have a referendum to change things that need updating? Thats democracy!
You brought up opinion polls…I merely commented that they were fickle and used the most recent example to prove a point.
I don’t accept your view that socital one and political ones are different. People changed their view a lot.
As for limited abortion , I don’t argue that some may be needed. But these protesting groups don’t want that , they want abortion on demand (as is the current wording). The opinion poll for that is a lot lower than 70%.
have all the referendums you want…I just don’t see the need to revisit the usual suspects every 10 or so years.
It hasn’t been revisited since 1983.
So not one woman of childbearing age in this country has ever had a say on the matter.
That’s a strong argument for the 8th amendment to go back on the ballot by my reckoning considering how blatantly obvious it is that times have changed.
You may not accept it but they are different. Political opinion polls tend to be about one of issues which fluctuate depending on things like the economy. Social norms take much much longer to change and generally do so as each new generation comes though.
You said people don’t want a society with abortion but Irish people do, even if that is limited. These people protesting aren’t idiots, they know they won’t get something through on abortion outside of foetal abnormalities or rape. But they will get it through eventually and then Irish women will have full access to health and medical care for themselves, not that which is deemed to be the “best” treatment for their foetus. Be on the right side of history.
Like Don pointed out Donkey, there’s a big difference between social opinion polls and political opinion polls.
But I’d bet you knew that, and just wanted to stir it up.
What were the initial poll numbers on the gay marriage referendum?
Polls are unreliable, stop turning that simple fact into a point scoring rhetoric borefest.
Those polls said yes as well. I love polls, they are super interesting but thank you for your comment, helpful as ever. Polls vary yes but they are a quick and easy way of working out the public mood. Otherwise you have to have a, you guessed it, a referendum!!
What if a majority didn’t want a society that gave chemo to lung cancer sufferers, or kidney transplants to alcohol drinkers? What if society didn’t want to see fat people get treatment for heart disease?
Medical and health issues should not be subject to the whims of “society”. Women have been killed by the 8th amendment because their cancer wasn’t cancerous enough under legislation to permit an abortion. Treatment has been delayed and denied and as a result women (and their unborn babies) have died. No man or child would ever be told they’d have to wait until their illness threatened their life, instead of just their health, yet it happens to our sisters, daughters, mothers, partners every day.
Repeal the 8th. “Society” should have no say in a woman’s health.
I disagree , the people who live here should set the standards we live by.
Who else decides? the mantra of the chattering class of the day?
As for women dying from this – were the woman denied cancer treatments or abortions?
Because in my limited (but existing) knowledge on this , an abortion won’t treat cancer.
nonetheless these group don’t want limited abortion , they want abortion for all – it’s in the “choice” they campaign for.
I’m not against medical treatment for any aliment , if the baby dies as a result that is sad but unavoidable but that is not an abortion.
Michelle Harte was deemed not cancerous enough for an abortion. She had to go to the UK for one and didn’t survive subsequent treatment because of the delay. The government settled a lawsuit with indecent haste.
Sheila Hodgers had her cancer treatment and pain relief stopped when she was found out to be pregnant. She died in agony 2 days after her baby was stillborn.
So next time you go to a doctor and are diagnosed with something that affects only your health, but isn’t bad enough to affect your life, you’ll be happy to wait for treatment until your life is at risk. That’s what your version of society demands of pregnant women. If it’s good enough for them, why isn’t it good enough for you?
What if the treatment is far more efficacious if the the woman is no longer pregnant? And she then decides that she wants an abortion?
“Who else decides? the mantra of the chattering class of the day?”
The principle of bodily autonomy. That an individual has a right to control what happens with their body and make their own medical decisions. A man has this right, but that right for women has an asterix beside it.
Forcing any woman to continue an unwanted pregnancy against her will is abhorrent, forcing a woman to carry their rapists or father’s child is indescribable. Forcing only POORER women who can’t afford England is the icing on the cake, the really sick part. You’re not stopping many abortions, you’re levying a fine.
“….the people who live here should set the standards we live by.
Who else decides? the mantra of the chattering class of the day?”
The chattering classes are the religious gossiping curtain twitchers of the RCC, you do realise that, don’t you? Hate filled gossip mongers.
And they have had that “mantra” for long enough, and have helped avoid proper abortion laws and held back this country long enough.
I really cannot wait till your ilk is silenced on this issue.
I can’t believe this lasted 20 or so (good) posts before the first bit of mud slinging.
“your ilk”. Listen tto yourself.
I can’t answer you all.
But if medical treatment was denied on teh basis a person was pregnant that is wrong. In fact that is a stricter interpretation of the RCC’s view.
As for bodily autonomy ? Drug taking is forbidden, is that not the same concept. I’d love drugs to be legalised.
As for you clampers – where is your democratic spirit? .
But the chattering class you describe has been replaced with neo liberal types who ram doctrine down peoples throats and call people labels is their view is against the accepted view. Hate filled twitterites.
I’m glad I’m of neither camp?
The rest of you – I tip my hat to you all and say “have a nice day”
Banning drugs isn’t the right comparison.
Forcing you to take drugs against your will is closer to it.
donkey kong – in law the taking of drugs is not illegal. the posession, the supply, the manufacture etc is but the taking of a substance falls under medical definitions and policies.
‘I can’t believe this lasted 20 or so (good) posts before the first bit of mud slinging.’
You glided right past the little broadside at Amnesty, did you?
‘Medical and health issues should not be subject to the whims of “society”. ‘
I agree with you, Daisy C, but inevitably rights are interpreted according to the mores & opinions of the day. There is a reason that Roe v Wade happened when it did and not 5 decades previously.
Reeling in the Years 1983 was on telly last night – featuring the bitter battle over the 8th amendment.
It cannot be denied that an enormous amount has changed in Irish society since then -we have a much more open, inclusive and accepting society in 2015. We should not be forced to meekly accept our parents and grandparents take on such a major social issue. If that was applied to other areas, we would not have divorce or gay rights.
As someone else mentions in the comments, anyone who voted in 1983 would be 49 now – it’s absurd to think that NO-ONE (least of all women of childbearing age) in Ireland has had their say on this issue since then. Another vote is long overdue, and should be a major election issue.
The argument that liberalism is being forced on the people is usually trotted out by people that are entirely happy to force their own views and laws down others’ throats.
If the pro-life groups are so cock sure that the numbers are on their side then they should welcome a referendum.
I’m not pro-life groups.. Ask them . i’m a member of no group on this matter.
I wasn’t addressing my post at you mr. persecution complex. I was merely making a statement designed to cast doubt on the faith that pro-life groups have in their support.
sorry. I’ll read your mind better next time.
Are you aiming that at me? I don’t advocate mind-reading. Ask Irish Psychics Live.
No mind reading required. It’s really straight forward. If I had posted it as a reply to something you said you could have interpreted it as a reply to something you had said but I didn’t.
Is this an app thing? Maybe you can’t see the indents correctly on the app or something.
And lest we forget, the current “Irish Solution” to abortion only really helps middle-class and better people, the ones who can afford to travel. The poor, asylum seekers and anyone else who doesn’t have the cash is just boned.
And then they have to find €100k for 18 years as further punishment for having sex to raise a child they weren’t in a position to afford in the first place.
http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/euro100000-cost-of-raising-a-child-up-to-college-age-342978.html
Where is the logic in punishing a woman who doesn’t feel she can carry, give birth and raise a child with a child?
Because she’s a trollop, of course. A fallen woman who must live with her shame as an object lesson to any other uppity wombs thinking they’re all that.
+8(th)
Tbf (and I am pro-choice) if you genuinely believe that a foetus is merely a very young person (I don’t), the decision becomes much harder.
Rather than kill that person, they think, why can’t you just carry it to term & give it up to adoption.
terrible