For Your Consideration

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‘Experts on the Eighth’

From Dublin-based Pondering Media.

Karen Healy writes:

The first of three sketches we will release over the coming weeks, sees the return of Bríde O’Bríde (Karen Healy) and another self-proclaimed expert (Blaise Reid) discussing their much deeper connection to “life” than those of the pro-choice community…

Pondering Media

72 thoughts on “For Your Consideration

  1. Tom

    Great way to win the hearts and minds. I’m looking forward to seeing a Brexit/Trump style kick to the goolies for Ireland’s smug moral elite.

    1. mildred st. meadowlark

      That’s a great reason to hope the referendum fails. Really shows what kind of a stellar individual you are.

      1. Tom

        I couldn’t give a fup to be honest as I have full abortion where i live. Ireland gets what it deserves.

        1. Andyourpointiswhatexactly?

          Sometimes we do: like when certain types emigrate. That’s nice for us.

        2. filly buster

          Tom, i think you meant ‘lobotomy’ .. you have full lobotomy where you live. Seems like you took advantage of the service. They’ve replaced your brain with a pound of pig poo and a few AA batteries stickin in it.

        3. mildred st. meadowlark

          Well then chicken, I guess what you have to say means sfa seeing as you don’t live hear and you don’t really care anyway. So, irrelevant.

          1. Janet, I ate my Avatar

            Tom is sooooo edgy
            What’s the opposite of moral elite
            morally defunct?

        1. DaithiG

          Don’t paint all us lads out forin’ like Tom,

          Dizzgracing us emigrants,
          I know the sort, probably tells all the narrow-back lads down in O’Shaughnessy’s Irish Tavern he won county medals at underage yet couldn’t solo the ball to save his (pro-)life.

      1. Tom

        I only care about the nauseating commentary which follows me around. If I lived in Ireland i’d want abortion for my own benefit. Get it now?

        1. DaithiG

          You want to be aborted?

          Sorry to break it to you, but it’s a bit late for that.

          Unless you are some magical fetus of some kind.

    2. Nigel

      You’re hoping the side that you think are in the right lose, because they’re in the right? Well, that IS Brexit/Trump logic, but I still can’t quite fathom the attraction.

      1. Tom

        Its the very same situation. The less informed and more backward elements of a country reacting to their moralising superiors in the city. So many Brexit voters didn’t even want to leave but they wanted to stick one to the media/politicians. Trump was the wrong candidate but the people didn’t care. They wanted to destroy everything so that they felt their voice was heard.
        I’m not on their side but I can see something similar happening here.

        1. DaithiG

          As someone who lives in a State that went for Trump, let me tell you, any Trump supporter I’ve met didn’t do so out of some protest vote, they genuinely were ignorant enough to think he was the better choice, in fact, most still do, because they’re ignorant racist imbeciles.

        2. Nigel

          Well thanks for lecturing us about how horrible we are even though you’re the one making the other side sound like orcs out of Lord Of The Rings

    1. SOQ

      Yes it could have been a lot more nuanced. God knows, there is plenty of material out there.

  2. TheRealJane

    I don’t like this kind of thing. I fundamentally disagree with the no side on almost every single point, but this kind of mocking isn’t an adequate way to argue against them.

    1. theo kretschmar schuldorff

      I agree.
      Further misguidement: Two days ago the some fairly pedestrian NO posters appeared in my bit of D7 (we chalked little ‘YES’s on the posts under them), but some fanatic cut the all down last night.

    2. mildred st. meadowlark

      Agreed Jane. This adds nothing to an argument that’s descending into a snitshow already.

      1. wellness

        Dear Mildred,

        This is only the first of three sketches. The second will be analogous in terms of artistic maturity to Citizen Kane.

        *tilts head*
        *chews pen*
        *ponders* .

        Besties & LOLS

        Blaise

  3. Shane Duffy

    No one is discussing the grey area; why is the term limit 3 months (12 weeks), lots of people I speak to have no issue whatever with 2 months, but 3 months seems to be a bridge too far for them so will be voting No. And if Yes is to lose it’ll be down to this.

    1. Daisy Chainsaw

      All sealioning aside, sometimes it takes 2 months for a woman to realise she’s pregnant. Three months is nothing close to viability.

      1. Anon

        In a few very rare cases some women dont even realise they are pregnant until their water breaks and the baby arrives soon after.

        Too weird but sooner or later anything that can happen does happen.

      1. postmanpat

        Dude, you’d be voting no/ no show if they said 2 months. because you “could only go up to 6 weeks”. and if they said 6 weeks you’d say “only if it was a month.” If they said 4 months you would be “completely onboard if it was 3 months” . the excuses people make to not dirty their hand with this because they are good little god fearing plebs is laughable.

        1. Holden MaGroin

          Not at all condescending or mean. Well done Pat. This reminds me of the smugness Tom is talking about above. And Tom seems a bit mean to be honest.

          1. postmanpat

            I’m just calling out these old fashioned Christian brainwashed types like chimpy who we are expected to believe are undecided but we all know are getting out to vote No no matter what. Undecided? give me a break. everyone has made there mind up at this stage. Now they are justifying their decision to cowardly stay at home or vote No in a few weeks time because they are afraid to go to hell.

        2. chimpy

          Christian brainwashed? Ha… now thats laughable. My choice yes or no has nothing to do with religion and all to do with experience.

          1. postmanpat

            What specific experience do you have that is unique to all the other churchy No voters?

          2. Chimpy

            Lost a child and have seen first hand how psychology traumatising an abortion can be. Its not as black and white as just labelling someone who is undecided as brainwashed.

          3. postmanpat

            You didn’t get an abortion , so how do you know “first hand” how psychology traumatizing it is? And what if it was psychologically traumatizing? Women are traveling for abortions anyway. And its more likely that the abortion will take place over your 2 month time limit by the time the decision and arrangements are made due to the hassle of dropping work and traveling, So if you are squeamish about the size of the child before termination, then know that women will be getting crisis pregnancies terminated a lot sooner with minimal stress if it was available here. But I’m sure your mind with hop on to next excuse. you have already changed your mind from “If it was 2 months I’d be completely on board” to “seen first hand how psychology traumatizing an abortion can be”. So if we are to believe you are actually undecided , you would be completely on board and have no concerns of the woman’s psychological well being if she had an abortion under 2 months? If might sound like I’m talking you out of voting Yes, but we all know you had no intention in the first place.

      2. Calerz

        What i didnt realise until last year when I became pregnant was that your pregnancy start date in weeks goes back to your last day of last period. The earliest you can find out your pregnant is at 4 weeks. However if its unplanned and you miss a period you may not know until week 5 or 6. If you say it should be two months then really that only leaves around 2 weeks to decide what to do. Very restrictive and could cause more panic on patients/doctors

    2. ReproBertie (SCU)

      Here’s an article from the journal which tries to explain the 12 weeks limit, which is actually 10 weeks since conception.
      http://www.thejournal.ie/12-weeks-abortion-ireland-3988241-May2018/

      ‘Speaking about why the 12-week limit was chosen, the Institute of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists noted that 12 weeks is “one of three major milestones in pregnancy”.

      In a statement, the Institute explained: “The period up to 12 weeks is termed early pregnancy. The other major milestones are viability – or the possibility of survival outside the womb – at approximately 23 to 24 weeks, and term at 37 to 42 weeks when foetal development has been completed.”

      The Institute noted that 12 weeks is a milestone because most miscarriages occur during this period, adding that this is “in fact usually 10 weeks after conception since pregnancy is dated from the first day of the last menstrual period and conception usually occurs two weeks after this date”.

      “Up to 50% of pregnancies miscarry in the first four weeks, typically before a woman is aware that she has conceived. Of the 50% that progress beyond four weeks, there is a significant further rate of miscarriage heavily influenced by the age of the woman.”
      […]
      Some 3,265 females travelled from Ireland to the UK for abortions in 2016, the latest year for which statistics are available.

      Some 85% of these terminations took place within 12 weeks of gestation, with the majority of these (2,256) taking place within the first nine weeks.’

    3. Cian

      A few things:
      It shall be necessary for 72 hours to elapse between the time of the certification referred to in subhead (1) and the termination of pregnancy being carried out.
      This means there is a 3 day wait imposed…. but the abortion has to be done before the 12 weeks; so the woman has to be in the doctor within 11½ weeks;

      12 weeks of pregnancy‖ shall be construed in accordance with the medical principle that pregnancy is dated from the first day of a woman’s last menstrual period.
      the 12 weeks is not based on conception (i.e. foetal age); Conception usually happens between 1 and three weeks after LMP;

      This means that if a woman waits until the last moment of proposed limit (of 12 weeks) the foetal age will be somewhere between 8½ – 10½ weeks old.

      If you were to drop this to 2 months, then you are talking 4½ – 6½ weeks after conception. If it takes at least 2 weeks 9if not more) for the woman to realise she is pregnant, and to have time to reflect on this, and to make a decision.

    4. cupofteaanyone

      I think up to 12 weeks you can get a safe medically induced abortion. Also women are at a higher risk of miscarriage in this timeframe. So the abortion would be a medically induced miscarriage. That’s why people wait till the 12 week scan to tell others they are pregnant.

    5. TheRealJane

      Normally, you don’t even tell people you’re pregnant before the 12 week mark because the risks of miscarriage are so high. This is generally considered to be the most straightforward thing to do. A miscarriage at eight weeks, even if you’ve known you’re pregnant for 2-3 weeks, isn’t something that you really tell people.

      It’s that close to the edge.

    6. rotide

      I agree, no one is discussing it but no one really should be discussing that term limit as it’s legislation and can be amended and repealed and extended at will , as many times as we like.

      People should be talking and voting about getting this ridiculous piece of text out of our constituition where it does not belong. That’s what we’re voting for.

      1. Andyourpointiswhatexactly?

        That’s not emotive enough, rotide. Better to stretch the debate out and drive people bananas rather than a cool “take it out of the Constitution” chat.

  4. johnny

    Iowa just passed a law using the heartbeat criteria !

    “I believe that all innocent life is precious and sacred, and as governor, I pledged to do everything in my power to protect it. That is what I am doing today. I understand that not everyone will agree with this decision. But if death is determined when a heart stops beating, then doesn’t a beating heart indicate life? For me, it is immoral to stop an innocent beating heart. For me, it is sickening to sell fetal body parts. For me, my faith leads me to protect every Iowan, no matter how small.”

    https://governor.iowa.gov/2018/05/gov-reynolds-releases-statement-after-signing-heartbeat-bill

    1. ReproBertie (SCU)

      Why throw in the comment on selling foetal body parts? Why bother telling us what is happening in another jurisdiction at all? It’s utterly irrelevant to this debate. I don’t know many Irish women who are left with no option but to travel to Iowa for an abortion.

        1. ReproBertie (SCU)

          The yanks may be interfering here but they can’t pass laws in this jurisdiction so the law in one of their 50 states is irrelevant.

          You chose to include the selling body parts comment when there was no need. Why? Trying to stir up a little fear?

    2. Cian

      Hmmm… so are heart transplants now illegal in Iowa? Because the surgeon will stop the patient’s old heart and remove it. Is that murder?

    3. Anon

      The higher courts will strike that down in a … err, very quickly.

      I’m not even convinced American politicians put forward these laws for any reason other than to look busy and appeal to their own base as they know full well the federal courts will prevent them coming into force.

  5. Anomanomanom

    I’ve found the best way to talk to pro-life people is to explain that everyone is pro-life. I’ve yet to meet anyone the was pro-death. They never seem able to comprehend that your voting Yes but call your self pro-life.

  6. AssPants

    I fubb’n sick and tired of national radio stations, printed media and digital platforms constantly pouring out garbage from both yes and no sides on the forthcoming referendum.

    I am thinking, this sort of referendum maybe best served outside of the media; being that the media in all forms should not be permitted to report on the forthcoming referendum.

    1. Janet, I ate my Avatar

      maybe we are all married to the cat in our own way
      watches the rain

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