Cause And Effect

at

Last Tuesday.

Falsk, Strokestown, Co Roscommon

The forced evicton of two elderly brothers and sister and repossession of a farmhouse by security guards working on behalf of US vulture Cabot, which purchased the loan from KBC Bank. An unnamed retired Garda (above) assisting the siblings was among those injured.

On Wednesday, a day after the eviction.

During a debate concerning the Anti-Evictions Bill…

Independent TD for Roscommon-Galway Michael Fitzmaurice said:

“I welcome the opportunity to speak on this Bill, parts of which are a no-brainer. Many people in this country are receiving notice to quit letters from banks which are moving to sell buy-to-let properties. We need to introduce a law in this country so that this does not continue to happen.

“In my opinion, many of the banks involved are scum.

“Yesterday in County Roscommon a group of 20 or 30 men with dogs came from the North, aided and abetted by An Garda Síochána who blocked off two roads. The group of men pegged three people, two of whom were elderly, out of a house and left them on the side of the road. They were aided and abetted by An Garda Síochána, which is disgraceful.

“Irish people need to wake up, especially if people are coming from the North. We must take them on and stop what is happening.”

Sunday morning.

Falsk, Strokestown, Co Roscommon.

The attack took place at around 5.30am this morning at a recently repossessed house and farm in Falsk near Strokestown.

Security personnel were at the scene when a large number of men in high-viz jackets arrived and attacked them with baseball bats.

The eight people who were injured are all security personnel and the dog that was killed was a security dog.

The farm and house have been sealed off as a crime scene and gardaí have begun a criminal investigation.

Investigation into attack at repossessed farm in Roscommon (RTÉ)

Previously: Eviction Notice

174 thoughts on “Cause And Effect

  1. Tom

    The people involved in the violent retribution are a very bad sort. I follow a few on Facebook.

    Everyone on about the loyalist thugs and terrorists. What makes them loyalists? If they were operating illegally then the gardai would have got involved. Clearly the real owners of the property did everything by the book to secure their property.

      1. Shane Conneely

        It’s not how it works in evictions, there’s a court order to vacate the premises, then agents of the person who got the court order can use necessary force to see it carried out, if someone is still at the location in contravention of the order. They were allowed to do what they did, it was legal, that’s the system we have

        1. GiggidyGoo

          I read elsewhere that the guys doing the eviction had a letter from the financial company but not a court order. How true I don’t know.
          However are you saying that a Garda can stand by looking on as 3-4 thugs descend on one person and assault him as in the video? Now what, for instance, if the man being assaulted ended up dead (at the hands of someone from outside the state). Still ok in your book?

      2. LeopoldGloom

        It’s a civil matter. The gardai won’t get involved in an eviction. It’s one for the sheriff/Bailliffs or whatever.

        1. SOQ

          I would think that a charge of GBH would turn it into a criminal matter. If for example one of the tenants received a broken limb or was badly bruised. They are only civilians after all.

          Also, what if that dog had to have bitten someone?

        1. david

          I’m banned from Broadsheet but I’m Very rude and persistent. It’s actually a form of harassment at this point.

    1. Murtles

      Well done Ollie for bending over and licking the holes of the corporates . If it was that simple wouldn’t life be grand. It’s rare that people default on the mortgages on purpose but let’s sweep under the carpet the fact that the Irish taxpayer bailed out the banks to the tune of €64 billion just 10 years ago. Talk about a default. Evictions are for the dark ages and should be left there.

      1. Rob_G

        If banks weren’t allowed to evict people who weren’t paying their mortgages, no-one would ever get a loan for a house, or for anything else, ever again.

        1. SOQ

          And once more for Jesus. What is the point in making three people homeless when the house is going to just sit there because of a boycott by the local community?

          1. Rob_G

            Should the €8m house at Gorse Hill not been repossessed because the people who used to live there would be technically homeless afterwards?

            “… the house is going to just sit there because of a boycott by the local community”

            That’s very unfortunate; ideally the bank would sell the house and 3 other people that currently don’t have a home would be able to move into it. It’s hardly the bank’s fault that people are going to lead a boycott against this property; you seem to be suggesting that if someone has a big enough bunch of bullyboy mates, that the rule of law should no longer apply to them. I don’t know about you, but I’d rather live in a country where the rule of law applies, and people can seek redress for personal disputes through the courts, rather than some sort of Mad Max hellscape where the mob gets to decide who is right and who is wrong.

          2. SOQ

            There are homes and other buildings lying empty all over this country because the debtor objects to the sale because of the way they were treated and, the local community supports them.

            That is how it works in rural Ireland and the banks never see one cent of what they are owed. It is not as simple as not paying a mortgage because banks regularly make new arrangements with borrowers, the difference is, this is not a bank.

          3. Rob_G

            “…the local community supports them.

            – so, again – if you have a big enough gang of mates, you get to pick and choose which rules apply to you(?) These ‘locals’ may not mind paying an extra 1% interest on their mortgages that results from these type of actions, but I imagine that a lot of people with mortgages do indeed mind.

          4. SOQ

            Twist it all you want but that house will sit there until it falls down now and it’s not the only one

            You clearly have no idea how rural communities work, people have each others backs.

            That debt will be written off.

          5. Rep

            So what is your argument here exactly? Evictions should only happen in built up areas? People in rural areas shouldn’t face any consequences to not paying back their mortgage?

          6. Spaghetti Hoop

            @SOQ. It’s because of people like you saying ‘That debt will be written off’ that results in wily debtors deciding not to pay their mortgage. This whole myth of debt write-off on mortgages permeated right through the recession.Anyone using that as a tactic deserves to be evicted. I don’t want one law in ‘rural Ireland’ with rent-a-thug mentality and another law for the rest of us who pay our mortgages.

          7. SOQ

            This is about recouping a debt, there is right or wrong, as anybody who has gone bankrupt will tell you.

            The potential for resale should always be a consideration and in cases like these, it is zero.

      1. Cian

        It depends. The ‘heavies’ are allowed to respond with with equal force if necessary. So if the occupier pushed the ‘heavy’ first – the ‘heavy’ is entitled to push back.

          1. Cian

            If I push you – you are entitled to push me back.
            If I try to hit you, you are entitled to defend yourself and use reasonable force to restrain me.

            Same is true for the ‘heavies’. They are entitled to defend themselves.

  2. Eoin

    Although KBC is being bandied about, with respect to the eviction last Tuesday, it looks to me that it was actually US vulture Cabot that bought the loan and got a judgement from the Circuit Court.

    “In January this year, a judgment mortgage was secured against the man in the Midland Circuit Court by Cabot Asset Purchases (Ireland).

    In 2004, the farmer had secured a mortgage from IIB Homeloans, the Belgian-owned lender that rebranded as KBC in 2009. In 2017, it emerged KBC Bank Ireland sold a chunk of loans to credit-servicing and debt-collection firm Cabot Financial Ireland, a unit of the US-based Cabot group.

    A spokesperson for KBC last night said: “We are aware of the situation in Roscommon and that the matter is being dealt with by An Garda Síochána. Unfortunately, we cannot provide comment on individual cases.””
    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/garda-investigate-dissident-links-to-predawn-attack-at-repossessed-house-37632029.html

    It’s confusing because KBC is not commenting, but its involvement with the eviction may be limited to selling the loan to Cabot in 2017.

      1. Rep

        “If Cabot bought the loan then KBC had no right to be involved
        So why were the heavies working on behalf of KBC allowed to evict”

        Are KBC even involved other then through the fact the original loan was from KBC? Did the heavies specifically say they were from KBC?

          1. Owen C

            Cabot can operate as both debt owners (vulture fund) and as debt servicing agents (ie pepper). It is very confusing as to what role they are acting in for this case.

        1. johnny

          Eoin-here is some background on “Cabot”-Flowers the guys who were everywhere in Irl. except the closing table were investors-its owned by Encore out a San Diego.

          Indeed-how’s that customer experience working out !

          “Encore and Cabot are completely aligned in our focus on consumer-centric approaches, which is not only the right thing to do but also leads to sustained improvements in business performance,” said Masih. “As Cabot has grown, it has maintained its regulatory and compliance leadership, as well as its focus on the consumer experience, which continues to make the company an attractive partner to banks and drives growth in its debt servicing business.”

          https://www.encorecapital.com/?press-release=encore-announces-agreement-to-acquire-the-remaining-interest-in-cabot

          Here is a list of the senior US executives at Encore who wholly owns Cabot and their latest earnings call.
          ‘Ken Stannard, the CEO of Cabot Credit Management, our subsidiary based in the UK.”

          https://seekingalpha.com/article/4196860-encore-capital-group-inc-ecpg-ceo-ashish-masih-q2-2018-results-earnings-call-transcript

    1. johnny

      Eoin-some skinny on Encore/Cabot they settled with the NY AG not that long ago-maybe broadsheet do a post on Cabot and I can put some bits/pieces together-if the trolls give me allow me a minute or two around here…

      “New York has laws in place to ensure no one can prey on consumers, and debt collectors are required to follow those rules,” said Attorney General Schneiderman. “Today’s settlement ensures that thousands of New Yorkers will see millions in relief from debts that were not enforceable in the first place. We will continue to take action against any company that abuses the power of the court system at the expense of hardworking families.”

      Encore is a debt buyer that purchases unpaid consumer debts such as credit card debts from the original creditor or from other debt buyers at deeply discounted prices. Encore’s subsidiaries, which include Midland Credit Management, then attempt to collect on the debt. Through its subsidiaries, Encore is one of the most active debt collection plaintiffs in New York State, filing tens of thousands of debt collection actions each year.”

      https://ag.ny.gov/press-release/ag-schneiderman-obtains-settlement-major-debt-buyer-who-filed-thousands-time-barred

      Encore owns Cabot.
      “Today the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau (CFPB) took action against the nation’s two largest debt buyers and collectors for using deceptive tactics to collect bad debts. The Bureau found that Encore Capital Group and Portfolio Recovery Associates bought debts that were potentially inaccurate, lacking documentation, or unenforceable. Without verifying the debt, the companies collected payments by pressuring consumers with false statements and churning out lawsuits using robo-signed court documents. The CFPB has ordered the companies to overhaul their debt collection and litigation practices and to stop reselling debts to third parties. Encore must pay up to $42 million in consumer refunds and a $10 million penalty, and stop collection on over $125 million worth of debts. Portfolio Recovery Associates must pay $19 million in consumer refunds and an $8 million penalty, and stop collecting on over $3 million worth of debts.”

      https://www.consumerfinance.gov/about-us/newsroom/cfpb-takes-action-against-the-two-largest-debt-buyers-for-using-deceptive-tactics-to-collect-bad-debts/

      1. Eoin

        Thanks Johnny

        Cabot is one of the most vicious vultures operating in Ireland. It has sued in its own right as an owner of loans, 100s (literally) of borrowers in the courts this year.

        It’s still not exactly clear who was behind the repossession last week, with some sources like Sinn Fein insisting it was KBC. It’s not even clear if there was a valid possession order in favour of anyone, KBC or Cabot. It’s a bit confused and the borrowers are understandably traumatised and seeking privacy.

        Lots of spin and inaccurate reporting in mainstream Irish media, it’s almost as if they don’t want to reveal what is happening on a near daily basis right across the country.

        1. johnny

          They were going have run at gentleman Paddy Kelly over a Ulster Bank loan to Red Quartz-can probably get the inside dope for broadsheet:)
          Agreed lets see how it plays out,they no alter boys-intensely disliked over here.

  3. Cian

    If a bank isn’t allowed to evict people who don’t pay their mortgages, then they should not be able to use a home as collateral. Which means that banks shouldn’t be able to give out mortgages unless people have assets[1] worth more than the houses they want to buy.

    [1] that aren’t houses

    1. GiggidyGoo

      And the point you’re conveniently missing is the eviction and the assaults on the people being evicted under the watchful eye of the Garda Síochána.
      If those being evicted were breaking the law, then wouldn’t it be up to the Gardai to remove them? Not a herd of non nationals?

      1. rotide

        The gardai are there to make sure noone uses basball bats and burns the place down.

        Which, you know, can happen.

        1. GiggidyGoo

          No baseball bats or burning cars during the eviction. Why were the Gardai not there during the attacking later on?

    2. Johnny

      Can you try that again Cian,what are you trying say,lol.
      It’s simplistic and illogical,what’s your point?
      Are you financially illiterate.

      1. Cian

        Johnny, you seem to be a bit sore bottomed about being challenged yesterday. Let me spell it out.

        If I make a statement as fact, I should either provide evidence or retract the statement. So if I had said, for example, “has the NTMA/NAMA as bondholders in Digicel a view on all these shenanigans” (sic) you would be within your rights to query if NAMA is, in fact, a bondholder in Digicel. And if I couldn’t back this up with evidence I should retract the statement.

        But I wouldn’t make that statement because I don’t have evidence for it.

        1. johnny

          Not at all Cian,you throw shade on every one my posts,you have a childlike grasp of finance, but instead engaging and learning,you slink away and move on to attack another post.

          What exactly are you trying say here, what relevance does it have, what does it mean in this context ?

          “Which means that banks shouldn’t be able to give out mortgages unless people have assets[1] worth more than the houses they want to buy.

          [1] that aren’t houses”

          Are you suggesting that mortgage holders/borrowers should be accredited investors as per Rule 506 of Regulation D under federal securities laws,also know as ‘qualifying investors’ ?

          What exactly is the point of your mumblings and nonsense,how will this address the housing crisis,WTF does it even mean Cian !

          Why bother posting on topics you have no understanding off and constantly asking for back up’s/links when you haven’t a clue,its just noise and distractions, there is nothing there,nothing just BS.

          The NTMA is a bondholder in Digicel,all NAMA employees are employees of the NTMA,its run by the NTMA who does the hiring,rents NAMA office space etc etc….

          ” It also assigns staff and provides business and support services and systems to the National Asset Management Agency ”

          http://www.ntma.ie

          1. Cian

            We have a winner!

            So ISIF have an investment in Digicel. and ISIF is part of NTMA.
            NAMA, however, is a separate entity, (although it gets HR and IT and office space through NTMA).

            But you know this, and were conflagrating the two entities to score cheap points?
            Or perhaps you should run off and read Namaland more thoroughly?

          2. Owen C

            ….and ISIF have outsourced management of their global portfolio to a set of international investment managers…

          3. Cian

            As to my point. If we cannot evict a mortgage holder for non-payment of said mortgage then all mortgages become non-secured loans. Banks won’t lend that sort of money unsecured.

            currently:
            Me: “hello AIB, I would like to borrow €300,000 to buy this house (worth €400,000). If I fail to repay this money, you can have the house”
            AIB: “Okay, but we will take your house if you default”
            Me: “deal”

            future
            Me: “hello AIB, I would like to borrow €300,000 to buy this house (worth €400,000). If I fail to repay this money, you can,… whistle?”
            AIB: [LOL] “I will not lend you any money unless you can provide some other asset that we can keep if you default”
            Me: LOL

          4. johnny

            -a winner the bonds have lost over 30 % off their value, why are they investing in Digicel and Dennis O’Brien?
            -is it a FG strategy to prop up the prices of Digicel bonds ?
            -some winner Cian,hate see a loser, oh is that a mirror take a look.
            -your celebrating another disastrous investment by the NTMA/NAMA/ISIF on behalf of the state and FG in a dodgy third world telco,owend by Dennis O’Brien?

          5. johnny

            You’re using sing song to try make a point on Irish mortgages and making up future or imaginary exchanges between yourself and AIB ?
            And you wonder why I try not engage……

    3. Johnny

      Who said this,do you have a link oh you said it !

      ‘If a bank isn’t allowed to evict people who don’t pay their mortgages, then they should not be able to use a home as collateral. ‘

      No one has suggested changing the laws preventing repossession or evictions,so why are you claiming they are ?

      You made that up again.

      Why use ‘mean’ as in this context it’s incorrect,this is childlike statement and financially illiterate.

      ‘Which means that banks shouldn’t be able to give out mortgages unless people have assets[1] worth more than the houses they want to buy.

      [1] that aren’t houses‘

      -shouldn’t-WTF is that a word – duh !
      What are you trying say Cian and why.
      You haven’t a clue about mortgages and finance,no one is suggesting a non asset backed lending environment,why introduce completely irrelevant nonsense,it’s rubbish,total garbage,the mumblings of a idiot.

      1. rotide

        You should try typing more coherent posts and less insults.

        You would look less like an obsessive paranoid then.

        1. Johnny

          Ro-I throw you a sympathy response every know and then as I feel sorry for you,I was having a nice stroll on the boardwalk yesterday in my new kicks.Stepped in dog poo,despite my best efforts to clean the dirt off the smell just lingered and lingered,it followed me around from post to post,lingering and lingering.
          Stop hounding me it’s unbecoming,your lingering for a long time like a bad smell.

          1. Gertrude

            He’s been my +1 many’s a time, beautiful person outside and in. Save your personal insults honey, they say more about you than your target.

    4. Rob_G

      To anyone paying a mortgage – this is why your interest rates are higher than almost anywhere else in the Eurozone – you’re welcome.

        1. Bruce_Wee

          No, Rob-G has a valid point. One of the the main reasons for Higher rates of Interest than our European counterparts is that repossession in Ireland are so difficult, Due the fact that the power is with the Mortgage holder and not the bank when the loan becomes defunct.

          The issue here isn’t the repossession but the matter in which it has been carried out. Uniformed Guards looking on to the rough treatment of the tenants and not intervening.

          Expect more of it in the coming months. Too much money to be made on valuable land and no mortgage being paid. This won’t be the last of it.

          1. Eoin

            The president of the ECB Mario Draghi told the Oireachtas finance committee last month

            “I am aware lending rates by banks to users, be they consumers or
            mortgage holders, are high. However, one should ask why they are high. The evidence seems to say it is because the banking market is not competitive and there are monopoly or quasi-monopoly situations here. ”
            https://data.oireachtas.ie/ie/oireachtas/debateRecord/joint_committee_on_finance_public_expenditure_and_reform_and_taoiseach/2018-11-08/debate/mul@/main.pdf

            Mario didn’t say anything at all about difficulties in enforcing loan agreements against the attached security.

            What appears to have happened in this ugly case in Roscommon is, KBC sold the loan to US vulture Cabot which obtained a judgement at the Midland Circuit Court in January, and it then employed this Northern Ireland security business to evict the occupants of the home last Tuesday.

          2. Mickey Twopints

            Burgess is an opinionated narrow minded blueshirt windbag who is dragged out by Irish Media every time this subject rears its head. If his comments carry some weight with you then you have a very shallow grasp of reality.

            The eviction was carried out at the behest of the vulture fund Cabot. KBC have already written off their losses, sold the loan to Cabot, and this mortgage default will not make one scintilla of difference to interest rates.

          3. Cian

            “KBC have already written off their losses, sold the loan to Cabot, and this mortgage default will not make one scintilla of difference to interest rates.”

            “KBC have already written off their losses” – so they need to recoup those losses somehow. How could a bank make more money to cover a loss? Charge a higher interest rate on those that do pay.

          4. Mickey Twopints

            The losses have been written off. There will be no “recoup”. The losses have been dealt with and are off the books. It is over as far as the banks are concerned. The only money to be made here is that which the vulture fund hopes to make by taking possession of the farm and selling it on.

          5. Owen C

            @ Eoin

            losses made on legacy mortgages have a direct impact on capital requirements for new mortgages. So, the greater the losses in the past, the greater the amount of capital required against new mortgages. The greater the amount of capital on a mortgages (or any loan), the higher the interest rate required to make a ‘hurdle’ rate of return on that loan (Return on Capital/Return on Equity). And thats ultimately how banks and bank investors judge these things.

            Slide 41 (page 43) of this presentation is the easiest way to graphically present this – Irish banks have to put up to 10x as much capital against an Irish mortgage when compared with some other countries in Europe.

            https://investorrelations.bankofireland.com/app/uploads/Bank-of-Ireland-Investor-Presentation-June-2018-1.pdf

  4. ollie

    The property owner doesn’t pay the mortgage and the elderly tenants get evicted. Awful to happen but let’s call out whose fault this really is. Property owner

    1. Col

      Oh they are tenants? I heard they were born there, so I assumed they were the children of the original owners who maybe inherited it along with the mortgage? Details are sketchy and confusing.

    1. Chucky R. Law

      Who are the scum bags?
      The scum bag tax dodgers who didn’t pay their mortgage?
      The scum bag bank who sold the loan to vultures?
      The scum bag vultures?
      The scum bag nordies and brits who did the eviction?
      The scum bag Guards who stood by while excess force was used?
      The scum bag “supporters” who attacked the scum bag nordies?
      The scum bag mainstream media for not reporting “the truth”?
      Or the whole bleeding lot of them?

      1. Shane Conneely

        The lads who knocked on the front door with the chainsaws got pounced on by the dog, they were hardly looking to harm the dog.

          1. Shane Conneely

            And a Garda shot and killed a dog in Longford last week, allegedly. The security lads violently evicted the locals, and the locals reacted. When the loyalists evicted the students from Frederick Street they went in with chain saws and put the people inside in hospital.

            The person who is willing to take that kind of job, where they’ll team up five on one to beat up pensioners, are prepared to be in violent situations. That’s why they are paid so well for what they do, and this kind of situation is an occupational hazard for people like that. It’s a shame they brought the dog into it. They knew the risks, the dog didn’t

          2. Scundered

            Shane can you provide any link to how much they’re paid and what proof you have that these are loyalist paramilitaries?

          3. anne

            What sorts of lads do you think are stupid enough to do that job?

            Just have a think about it.

            Do you want names? They’re floating about. You won’t be reading about them on the Irish Times..

            But anyway, they won’t be back. They’re not completely dense.

        1. rotide

          Yeah, those lads with chainsaws and baseball bats were just there collecting for charity and handing out free hugs.

          The loaylist dog was asking for it.

          1. Shane Conneely

            I didn’t say the locals were peaceably there, but until they burnt out the vans, thet didn’t use a level of violence which is outside of the usual level of violence that’s used in executing an eviction order.

            There’s often broken bones involved in evicting people. The security firm isn’t going to hire nice peaceable people, those lads are there to literally crack skulls. That’s what happens in evictions. They’re not nice boys, they do bad work for good money and they miscalculated the risk in this instance.

            That they are trash doesn’t necessarily make the locals good lads, but just because they got a hiding diesbt make them respectable.

  5. scundered

    Is there any evidence that the men in that video are loyalists or is it just a desperate attempt at stirring the pot a bit more? Unless you know their names then it is quite a jump.

    1. Col

      Even if they are, I don’t understand the relevance. Unless they are known loyalist paramilitaries with a clear criminal past.
      Also, what age is “elderly”? I heard the men were in their 50s & 60s.

      1. scundered

        I doubt they would accept such a job knowing they would be easy targets, especially in border counties. Sound more like an angle thrown in to distract from the lynch mob.

        Would anyone even employ them anyway?

        1. Shane Conneely

          You’ve a lot of faith in the loyalists of you think they’ve cop on. It was a security firm, staffed by lads from Northern Ireland who said that they weren’t Irish, they were British. And that’s their own words in the video.

          Yep it was pretty stupid to make themselves such soft targets in that part of the world, but people are often stupid. And, it’s not like they’d have known the area they were going into. They’ve a long history of rent strikes, and bad reactions to evictions, around Strokestown

          1. Scundered

            So if someone says they’re British that means they’re a loyalist paramilitary? Is that the basis of your evidence?

          2. Rob_G

            “… staffed by lads from Northern Ireland who said that they weren’t Irish, they were British”

            – and you managed to extrapolate that they were Loyalist paramilitaries from that short utterance? Well done, Inspector Poirot.

            “Yep it was pretty stupid to make themselves such soft targets in that part of the world…” – given the level of violence and intimidation that they could find themselves subjected to, I am not surprised that they had to go outside the state to find someone willing to do the job.

            “They’ve a long history of rent strikes, and bad reactions to evictions, around Strokestown” – that’s fine – the banks will just have to stop lending money to people in Strokestown, so, given that any agreement on collateral is unenforceable.

          3. Shane Conneely

            I said that the member of staff was a loyalist, now not all loyalists are paramilitaries. He’s someone from northern Ireland who said he’s not Irish, but is British. That’s a loyalist.

            Re: paramilitary involvement. The whole reason why we have a certified security system was to get the Republican paramilitaries out if the security game. That’s not a process that has happened in Northern Ireland. Perhaps you’re unaware of that, in which case consider today a learning opportunity.

            You asked earlier who’d employ a loyalist paramilitary security outfit, anyone who would want to enforce an eviction. They’re pretty much the only people who’ll take that work (the only other outfit is run by a former Garda down in Cork).

            Regarding Strokestown and mortgages, if a bank was doing good due diligence they probably wouldn’t lend half a million to farmers around there. And vulture funds definitely wouldn’t buy defaulted loans there. Their proudest historical moment was when the locals murdered a landlord who evicted remnants from land where the tenants had defaulted on their rent. Mahon bought the licence to take rent from a Townland where the tenants weren’t paying rent. He evicted them. They murdered him.

          4. Owen C

            “He’s someone from northern Ireland who said he’s not Irish, but is British. That’s a loyalist.”

            This is a fantastic addition to understanding the complexities of Northern Irish politics.

          5. Scundered

            Shane you’re still avoiding the topic of showing evidence that these men are loyalist paramilitaries. Unless you know who they are then you’re just letting your imagination run away with you.

            By the way, just because someone is British does not make them loyalist, in the same way being Irish doesn’t make one a Republican. What a nutjob assumption to make.

          6. Shane Conneely

            Ah here, I spent two years working up north, there’s a very particular kind of person who comes from Northern Ireland and refuses to call themselves Irish. And that’s a loyalist. Unionists are grand with calling themselves Irish, or at least they don’t deny an Irish component to their identity. The gross simplification of a British identifying Northern Irish lad is the hallmark of a certain community.

            Sad to see how ignorant you are of life up north. You should go do a vox pop out in east Belfast about their sense of identity, it’ll be enlightening for you

          7. Scundered

            Shane I spent 27 years living the north, I grew up there but live in Dublin, am well aware of the demographics, behaviour and language used. This is why I find your assumptions desperate.

            Now, are you going to provide any evidence for your claims or still play the distraction routine?

    2. rotide

      One of them said he was British, not Irish.

      Clearly identifying like this, while being completely reasonable and legal is a hanging offence now.

        1. rotide

          Imagine if identifying as Irish in the British Territory of Northern Ireland marked you out for civil rights abuses? Surely that wouldn’t happen.

          The reaction to this story actually terrifies me.

      1. david

        I am banned from this site and have been asked to stop changing my username to comment, but am being very rude and persistent.

    3. Oj

      Being from the north I have no doubt they are UDA gangs rebranded as a security firm.
      Plus for the supporters for the banks does nobody know where the bank gets the money to give to borrowers. If you take out a 300k mortgage the bank funds your account by creating a 300k balance out of thin air. You then pay back around double that amount out of your hard earned real money. When banks write off a debt all they do is remove the fake balance they created to fund the mortage in the first place. On top of all that the banks got bailed out by the tax payer to protect profits. Most people apparently don’t have a clue how fractional reserve banking operates

      1. Cian

        Do you know how supermarkets work?

        They get a can of coke for 30c (on credit). They then create a price of 90c – out of thin air. You pay them 90c out of your hard earned real money. The supermarket then pays the supplier 30c and keeps your 60c as profit!

        1. Oscar j

          Poor analogy. The supermarket doesn’t create the can of coke out of thin air then in order for you to to own the can of coke you dont have to pay them back 2 cans of coke.

  6. RuilleBuille

    Nice to see the loyalist paramilitaries get a taste of their own medicine.

    They are handy enough beating students and pensioners but ran when faced with grown men.

      1. reddit

        I know right, they’re clearly just some folk dancing troupe from Donegal who do violent evictions on the weekends.

          1. Rep

            So in the North, you can only possibly be a loyalist or a republican. Amazing that people in the south have such an insight into North.

          2. SOQ

            I am from the north? Pretty sure I know a bit more about the type of people who would whore themselves out to do something like this than you think.

    1. rotide

      “They are handy enough beating students and pensioners but ran when faced with grown men armed with baseball bats intent on hospitalising or killing them and burning property’

      Fixed that for you.

      1. Jeffrey

        You suggest handing them lollypops? That will get them to think twice about doing this as a Weekend nixer now.

    1. Manta Rae

      They had it in Co Meath earlier, then it was changed to Longford.

      I think this is an example of an unfunny joke that the so-called millennial types are so fond of…

  7. Junkface

    Crazy stuff! Just goes to show the underlying hatred that a lot of people have for the modern banking culture, and the vulture funds. They are intent on destroying communities all over the world for short term gains, they own our Governments and dictate to them. People have had enough it seems. Everything is rigged in favour of the super rich.

    1. Rob_G

      “Just goes to show the underlying hatred that a lot of people have for the modern banking culture… “

      – though apparently not enough to stop borrowing money from them.

  8. Rob_G

    If you borrow money and don’t make the repayments, the bank is going to come at some stage and take your house. This is explained very clearly when you take out a mortgage, you have to sign several pieces of paper acknowledging this fact. If people aren’t satisfied with this, they shouldn’t take out a mortgage.

    1. anne

      We have to function as a society, not as a bank.

      If people fall on hard times, loans can and should be restructured.
      It should be a case of ‘miss a payment”, we get the lot’.

      People need roofs over their heads, & the taxpayer has to foot the bill to house people if banks are going to be unscrupulous.

      Hopefully these Vulture banks hiring these heavies from the North will continue to be told to fupp off.

      It’s a very troubling thing to see, these fuppers in their balaclavas turfing families out. And the Gardai helping them..

      You start treating people like this you’re asking for trouble. It’s not how stuff gets done, not down here anyway.

      1. Spaghetti Hoop

        Loans are already restructured with banks when people fall on hard times. You would have to have missed a lot of payments or failed to negotiate before a court order to evict is granted.
        We do not know the facts of the mortgage arrears in this story or the willingness or otherwise of the borrowers to address their debt.
        Yes, people need roofs over their heads. People are also obliged to earn a living and pay for that roof. Or are you the ‘free gaff for everyone’ brigade?

          1. Spaghetti Hoop

            The terms and conditions of your loan agreement are unchanged, no matter who the lender is. You hear this for every mortgage product out there; ‘If you don’t keep up the repayments, you will lose your home’. Likewise for a car, or anything you are paying for in installments. Have you ever lent anyone money and were not paid back?

    2. Junkface

      Hey Rob_G, so when average joes get evicted from their homes because they cannot make payments on a Mortgage it is their fault, fair enough, but what about when a vulture fund takes over their mortgage without them knowing, and then decides to extort the hell out of the them? This has happened a lot all over the world. It is really cold hearted and cruel.
      You seem to taking the view that some home owners are irresponsible in their actions and have taken risks stupidly, but when large Banks take insane risks, sell junk mortgages to each other, gamble on the stock markets, commit fraud, but then get bailed out by Governments by basically holding a gun to their heads, who do you think is more irresponsible? What we have is croney capitalism, or Socialism for the rich. No matter how much they gamble or destroy the lives of millions of people around the world by crashing the economy, they get bailed out, and get to keep their pensions AND within a few years they have their bonuses back for risky gambling on the Stock market. They continue to behave the same way as before.
      Everyday people seem to be held to account far more than the super rich banking class, and they are sick of the hypocracy. The banking culture, and the culture of greed, has created this hostile atmosphere that may incite violence. A lot of people are at breaking point.

      I don’t condone violence, but on a human level I can understand their anger.

      1. Rob_G

        @ JF –

        I don’t know what part of the world you are referring to; in Ireland, a private homeowner would need to have not made payments for several years before a bank gets a court order to repossess their home (there have been cases of 5 years, sometimes 7 years of no repayments on a mortgage before banks are granted repossession orders).

        “…vulture fund takes over their mortgage… then decides to extort the hell out of the them?”

        If you are making payments on your mortgage, it doesn’t matter if the lender is a vulture fund, or an avuncular old dear down the credit union: they can’t ‘extort’ you if you are making your payments. And you aren’t making your payments, they can take action against you, eventually repossessing your home – like it says in black and white on the mortgage the the borrower signed. Again, this will happen if your loan is owned by a vulture fund, of the Bank of Ireland that you had your first savings account with since you were 9.

    3. Nigel

      Yeah and if you loan out money you are at risk of losing that money such as in the event of a financial crash caused in part by your own reckless lending practices. As above so below. I’ll wager the failure of so-called moral hazard on one has had a more dysfunctional effect on current conditions than the other, but which?

      1. Rob_G

        Indeed – the banks did lose money – their share prices fell through the floor, and anyone who bought shares at €20 or €30 in 2006 ended up with their shares being worth pennies overnight – this is the bank’s losses, many ended up being taken over by the govt. You seem to be suggesting that this family should be able to continue not making payments, but get to keep the house – it doesn’t work like that.

        1. Nigel

          I’m not suggesting anything, except that this family and people like them aren’t really the cause of or the solution to the broader problems in the housing market.

    1. Spaghetti Hoop

      Was there a court order?
      I find the reporting of facts always lacking in these cases. Like they always want you to side with the evictee.

    2. rotide

      He has financial difficulties which stretch back almost a decade and include a more than €400,000 settlement secured by the Revenue Commissioners against him in 2015 for the under-declaration of VAT.

      Land Registry records for the Falsk property also show that more than €18,000 was secured in a judgment in December 2008, which was subsequently registered against his property. That judgment was obtained by a local company which operated a quarry at the time.

      In 2015, Revenue secured a settlement totalling €429,501 against the evicted man as a tax defaulter for the under declaration of VAT. It included €177,000 in tax owed, almost €75,000 in interest, and more than €177,000 in penalties.

  9. TheOtherGuy

    There’s many good reasons for hiring people from outside the state to handle this kind of work. Mostly to do with intimidation and attacks. If no one on the ground knows them, where they live and who they drink with in a particular pub on a Friday, there is less chance of them being attacked.

    Personally I can see a lot of sense in that.

    Evictions are not pretty in the least. And there’s a lot of talk about the bailouts etc here. And some people, rightly pointing out, that if you’re not paying your mortgage you could very well lose your home. Having gone through the mortgage process I can attest to the fact that the banks are pretty clear about this. Pay us, or you will lose your home. And the courts here have been very slow to grant eviction notices and the banks know this. Vulture funds not so much and are far more aggressive in their methods for obtaining them.

    The one thing that is really missing from this story is all the facts. Why was the eviction notice granted? Who owned the house? How long had the eviction notice been in place?

  10. anne

    House in the family for 3 generations. Then, vulture fund buys the loan from KBC & look where we are?

    You have reports of people being late on 1 payment, or most of a mortgage almost paid with 10k in “arrears” & these vultures (who are great for a picking at the carcass of society, per the baldy coot accounts teacher from Limerick) and they want the lot.

    Greed and more fupping greed on display.

      1. A Person

        Have you ever been in a position where someone owes you money, but doesn’t bothering paying you back. I have. Small business ruined. 20 people unemployed. But, yeah, let people who don’t pay their taxes or mortgages (btw why a mortgage on a house built in the 1950s?), let them off the hook. How the fupp is that greed, to expect someone to pay their debts. How the fupp is it greed that these 3 people thought it ok not to pay their debts. How the fupp is it ok to accuse the evictions people of being foreigners, and therefore open to violence.

        1. SOQ

          I worked for someone in Belfast who went bankrupt. He was so good at it that the first the company accountant knew about it was front page Belfast Telegraph. I was standing beside her at the time. Even the pictures on the public facing office walls were rented. This was his fifth time and he legally set up again three months later.

          Now you talk to me about mortgage payments and sole trader / SME difficulties and I will point you to people like him, a multi millionaire based in Canada, who knew how to game the system.

          I don’t blame him for that, I blame the government.

          And Leo’s next photo shoot is when?

    1. Owen C

      However, in this case the borrower is a serial tax defaulter (€425k for under payment of VAT) and delinquent borrower with a history of judgments against him (€18k court order vs local quarry company). This isn’t to say that Cabot or KBC don’t have to follow the law, but perhaps this is not the guy to hold up as a ordinary working person who’s being screwed over by the bank

      1. anne

        Nothing to do with his mortgage though. Unless he remortgaged to pay back VAT.

        VAT payments should be collected by revenue directly IMO, otherwise you can have businesses left with hefty bills when their VAT receivables are way higher than your VAT payables.. the UK have payment plans for VAT too.

        Try harder Cian. This is about unethical vultures.

        1. Owen C

          There’s a few oddities in this whole story:

          1. If Cabot are now the owners, KBC shouldn’t really have any interaction any more (see offer to pay KBC €1000 a month). Further, the KBC loans which Cabot bought were described at the time as residual unsecured balances on loans where the property has already been surrendered (their words). Which makes me think that Cabot don’t own the loans, but are just acting as debt servicing/judgement enforcement agents (they sometimes buy the loans, but they sometimes just act as debt enforcement the owners of the loan – comments at the Oireachtas Finance Committee by KBC CEO would also suggest Cabot are debt servicing rather than debt owners in this case).
          2. Its previously been stated that the family have lived in the house for 3 generations. So this wasn’t a loan to purchase the house, and looks more like an SME farming loan with the house as collateral.

          1. Owen C

            Actually, I’ve thought further about this. Reporting of this case clearly says that Cabot Asset Purchases sought and was given a “judgement mortgage” against the borrower in January, so it must own the loans. But KBC said VERY CLEARLY that none of the loans it sold to Cabot involved cases where there was a dispute over the house (the loans sold to Cabot were remaining unsecured debts left over after foreclosure or voluntary surrender of the homes). So in this case was the original loan on a BTL or SME asset, and Cabot have chased the remaining unsecured amount against OTHER assets owned by the borrower (ie this house/farm)? Whole thing seems weird.

          2. anne

            Have you considered that KBC are lying about what they told us they’ve sold to the vulture, when you were thinking about it?

        2. Rep

          So nothing to do with his mortgage unless it was to do with his mortgage.

          And weirdly dismissive attitude to not paying nearly half a million in tax.

          1. anne

            Another shill, weirdly discussing financial responsiblity.. but not applying it to the banks or vultures. Weirdly.

    2. Rob_G

      “House in the family for 3 generations”

      – so, it wasn’t even a mortgage that was taken out to purchase the house; the house was already long paid for, and they decided to mortgage it again? It’s sad that they are losing their house, but it was themselves that decided to use the house for security on this loan.

      “You have reports of people being late on 1 payment… ” – bullpoop, it takes years of not engaging with the lender to get a repossession order.

    3. rotide

      Bit more than late on ‘one payment’

      He has financial difficulties which stretch back almost a decade and include a more than €400,000 settlement secured by the Revenue Commissioners against him in 2015 for the under-declaration of VAT.

      Land Registry records for the Falsk property also show that more than €18,000 was secured in a judgment in December 2008, which was subsequently registered against his property. That judgment was obtained by a local company which operated a quarry at the time.

      In 2015, Revenue secured a settlement totalling €429,501 against the evicted man as a tax defaulter for the under declaration of VAT. It included €177,000 in tax owed, almost €75,000 in interest, and more than €177,000 in penalties.

  11. rotide

    For a website completely obessed with how the MSM reports the news, ye’re all very willing to take random facebook posts as gospel

  12. A Person

    Have you ever been in a position where someone owes you money, but doesn’t bothering paying you back. I have. Small business ruined. 20 people unemployed. But, yeah, let people who don’t pay their taxes or mortgages (btw why a mortgage on a house built in the 1950s?), let them off the hook. How the fupp is that greed, to expect someone to pay their debts. How the fupp is it greed that these 3 people thought it ok not to pay their debts. How the fupp is it ok to accuse the evictions people of being foreigners, and therefore open to violence.

  13. Martco

    I want to know who this famous “British” Can’t Pay We’ll Take It Away private security outfit are.

    I was under the impression that these days the security game is completely regulated, if I want to so much as put up my own alarm/cctv I have to use a PSA licensed company.

    Who are they and are they seriously PSA approved to operate??

    or is it a case that eviction somehow falls outside the definition of “security” if this is so why haven’t the Guards intervened in what looks like a very clear case of assault originally?

  14. Oscar

    Being from the north I have no doubt they are UDA gangs rebranded as a security firm.
    Plus for the supporters for the banks does nobody know where the bank gets the money to give to borrowers. If you take out a 300k mortgage the bank funds your account by creating a 300k balance out of thin air. You then pay back around double that amount out of your hard earned real money. When banks write off a debt all they do is remove the fake balance they created to fund the mortage in the first place. On top of all that the banks got bailed out by the tax payer to protect profits. Most people apparently don’t have a clue how fractional reserve banking operates

  15. Oscar j

    Being from the north I have no doubt they are UDA gangs rebranded as a security firm.
    Plus for the supporters for the banks does nobody know where the bank gets the money to give to borrowers. If you take out a 300k mortgage the bank funds your account by creating a 300k balance out of thin air. You then pay back around double that amount out of your hard earned real money. When banks write off a debt all they do is remove the fake balance they created to fund the mortage in the first place. On top of all that the banks got bailed out by the tax payer to protect profits. Most people apparently don’t have a clue how fractional reserve banking operates

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