69 thoughts on “De Tuesday Papers

    1. SOQ

      These attacks have been happening to UKIP members for quite some time now but its the first for Farage. Brings new meaning to the term ‘lactose intolerant’ I suppose.

      Just wondering what the charge will be- Grievous Banana Harm (GBH) maybe? Assault with a full fat weapon perhaps? The possibilities are endless.

      1. GiggidyGoo

        Mick Noonan used to carry a spare suit in his bus when on the election trail. He knew he was going to get things thrown at him.

  1. SOQ

    FTL Hauwei tees up its own phone software.

    Funny I was thinking about that yesterday- What is there to stop Hauwei setting up it’s own deployment system for Android and apps? And as consumers, do we really care if the product comes from China or the US? This could actually break the Google monopoly.

    1. GiggidyGoo

      Plus, will people who bought Huawei phones etc. be entitled to a refund from the mobile operators who sold them to them, as they will be unable to update them?

      1. SOQ

        Highly likely they will roll out their own deployment in which case, do people really care if thier phones are being monitored by the Chinese? And who says the rest are not under surveillance from the Americans anyways?

        From what I gather they are a good phone and competitively priced.

    2. eoin

      Huawei is being shunned because its technology in phones is used to spy for the Chinese.

      A growing list of countries is banning Huawei. Google is the first major software company to cut ties, more can be expected to follow.

      In Ireland, we’re welcome Huawei with open arms (is Enda Kenny’s Irish Chinese Foundation smoothing the way?). Trinity is accepting millions from Huawei for research while universities across the globe are cutting ties.

      1. martco

        the Huawei thing is based pure speculation.
        fact is EVERYTHING can be hacked logical or physical at the board level….routers, phones, masts, operating systems (even precious iPhones)

        1. milk teeth

          I thought the Chinese government had introduced a law which required Chinese tech companies to allow their security services access to their systems?

      2. GiggidyGoo

        They can spy all they like on me. Google are doing it anyway. So are Apple.
        What secrets would the general population have that they would want? Wouldn’t it make sense to ban them from politicians and business leaders use?

    3. WOGAN

      Maybe its the milk of human kindness for the cream of the crop
      I belive this is a dairy occurrence
      Say cheese

  2. eoin

    How much is Pat Kenny being paid at Newstalk?

    We don’t know, but the Times Ireland reports some extracts from the abbreviated accounts for his company for 2018. Pat and his wife “shared remuneration of €301,975” and the company made a profit of €167,144. There’s no other word on expenses or tax, but assuming €25k of tax and no other expenses (it’s just Pat providing his services after all), you’d be looking at total revenue of just under €500,000. That would be total revenue, Newstalk, his show on TV3 and his many public engagements. I can’t see Newstalk paying him more than €350-400,000, a far cry from the €630,000 leaving salary at RTE (or €950,000 peak).

  3. eoin

    How did everyone sleep last night?

    Personally, knowing there’s free €1bn of gold just 80 miles from Donegal and just 500 ft down (not 500m as claimed by the Times), I didn’t sleep very well at all. Someone could come and take it at any time. I mean, an hour or two out in a speed-boat, a 20 minute dive and a couple of hours back with the €1 billion. What’s to stop you?

    Maybe the Gibraltar salvage company that apparently began operations three months ago might try to stop you, but you know, the wreck doesn’t belong to them, so who cares what they say.

    In fact, why don’t we all skip work today, take a few hours to drive up to Donegal and spend half a day getting the gold. We could all be set up for life by tea-time.

    Or maybe, there’s no gold at all and a salvage company is dangling the non-existent carrot of “€1bn bullion” in front of the Irish govt to get a reduction in the 7.5% salvage fee payable to the State to 4% and the waiver of the requirement to leave any wreckage in the possession of the government for a year, to use the concessions for another wreckage altogether.

    1. Cian

      500 feet = 150m; 40m is the maximum depth for standard scuba – any deeper and you need different gas mixes.

      But yes, their story seems a bit fishy. I suppose the state could give them the 4% – but restrict it to that one wreck.

      1. The Old Boy

        My back of the envelope calculation is that a billion Euro of bullion would weigh about 27 metric tonnes. Recovery wouldn’t exactly be a small operation. An article about it in this week’s Donegal Democrat says that a salvage operation was attempted in 1995. The salvage team reported they located the bullion room but found it empty. Make of that what you will.

        1. eoin

          Old Boy, it’s almost as if you’re doubting the front page splash and associated articles (there wasn’t a pull-out, but there was the next best thing with background articles) in the Times Ireland last week, or the segment in yesterday’s RTE News at One with Claire Byrne. They both claim there’s €1 billion of bullion down there.

          It’s a wreck in the same place for the past 80 years in relatively shallow water and it was a British govt ship so you’d expect they’d have the means to retrieve €1bn of gold. And, Wiki which is based on a book by a supposed expert on the subject says there is no gold and dives prove that.

          As you say, €1bn is three tons so it would be hard to miss.

          1. The Old Boy

            I’ve done a bit of reading about the sinking of the RMS Empress of Britain and it’s clear that this story is ridiculous. The ship was damaged by a German bomber and evacuated save for a skeleton crew before being taken in tow by the destroyer HMS Broke. More than 24 hours later, it was attacked by a U-boat and finally sunk.

            A book referenced in the Wikipedia article about the vessel, “Lost Treasure Ships of the Twentieth Century” by Nigel Pickford, states that when a salvage company approached the UK’s Department of Transport in the 80s, they were told that the gold had been recovered.

            It seems fairly clear that she was carrying a substantial quantity of gold, but whether it was salvaged in the 24 hour period between being damaged and sinking or subsequently, it seems that the gold has long been returned to the custody of its owner (and presumably flogged off by Gordon Brown at bargain basement prices sixty sears later.)

      2. eoin

        Don’t sweat it Cian, those figures are just recommendations and mostly there for pesky health and safety. You’ll be fine. All you have to do is dive down with the big cage, fill it with bullion and we’ll pulley it up onto the boat. 30 mins maybe, 60 mins max, you’ll be grand.

    2. GiggidyGoo

      Sshhhhh. There will be a queue of JCBs and vans with sunroofs on a flotilla out there shortly.

      1. eoin

        If this is what I’m beginning to think it is, it will be guarded by state-level defence forces and a few boyos will billhooks wouldn’t stand a chance.

  4. Listrade

    Just as a note to the Express. Stabbing and killing Jo Cox was an affront to democracy. Milkshakes are on a par with the egg throwing at Jeremy Corbyn. You weren’t wringing your hands over that one. Let’s get Chumbawumba back, they knew how to ruin a politician’s suit.

    1. Rob_G

      Devotees will remember that I have never had a good thing to say about terrorist-fellow traveller Jeremy Corbyn, but indeed throwing an egg at him is an affront to democracy.

      1. millie st meadowlark

        Not really. It’s bad manners, to put it very lightly, but calling it an affront to democracy is going a bit Helen Lovejoy on the whole thing.

        1. Rob_G

          Physically assaulting someone because you don’t agree with their views (even if the assault is a relatively trivial one) is the definition of an affront to democracy. Someone didn’t like what Farage was saying, and so took the decision upon themselves to prevent him from saying it – this is rule by the mob.

          1. millie st meadowlark

            Explain exactly how is it an affront to democracy because I’m failing to understand this pertinent point.

            I won’t disagree with you in that throwing food at someone
            whose views are at odds with yours could be defined as assault, but how is it an affront to democracy? Are they obstructing them from their democratic rights in some way? I’m sorry but I think you’re clutching at pearls a little here.

          2. Yep

            They didn’t shove it in his gob, Rob. He was still free to speak. It will only embolden his supporters and give his critics a giggle.

            You considered the state run broadcaster here poking Wallace as an attempt to make good TV. Farage gets a milkshake thrown at him and it’s an affront to democracy. Get a clue.

          3. Rob_G

            Throwing the milkshake had it’s intended effect – Farage got back into his car and drove off somewhere. Someone didn’t like what he had to say, and prevented him from saying by means of a physical intervention (albeit a milkshake).

            Nigel Farage, no matter how stupid/odious his views are, has the same right as you or I to go around spouting them without being physically assaulted.

          4. Listrade

            Ha! Like Farage has been hindered in having a platform for his views. It’s about humiliation. Protest hasn’t stopped them. The media hasn’t doesn’t challenge them enough if at all. There isn’t time given to an opposing counter view even in this dumb media-driven time of opposing views to appear balanced.

            This bull we see about slippery slopes. I played pie face with my son at Christmas, deliberately lost each time. He thought it was hilarious. He hasn’t now started hitting me in the head with a baseball bat because I normalised hitting me with something.

            The reason eggs, buckets of water and milkshakes are ok is because we know they are harmless, it isn’t about threatening, it is humiliation. Farage could have still given his speech, just covered in the aftermath of an elephant bukkake. He chose to scuttle away.

            We’ve had the throwing of non-harmful objects through history. From rotten fruit to milkshakes and it has yet to stop democracy or escalate to more serious violence.

            It’s a statement, it’s clearly humiliating, it’s doing what it was supposed to do. If it were stones or rocks or bricks, yeah I’d be worried. But it isn’t. Same way the kids will be having water balloon fights and won’t suddenly start throwing rocks at each other. We know the difference between harmful and not harmful. We can make a statement and not have it escalate from humiliation to harming.

          5. Rob_G

            I have a clue – you get a clue. If I had have started throwing milkshakes at Mick Wallace the other night because I made a unilateral decision that no-one should have to listen to his guff, that would also have been an affront to democracy.

          6. Brother Barnabas

            “We’ve had the throwing of non-harmful objects through history. From rotten fruit to milkshakes and it has yet to stop democracy or escalate to more serious violence.”

            except for the French Revolution, the nascent origins of which can be traced to the plebs throwing rotten tomatoes at the funeral cortege of louis xv in the mid 1770s

          7. Rob_G


            “.. (Farage) has been hindered in having a platform for his views”

            – so, some milkshake randomer gets to decide who gets to have their views heard, and who doesn’t? Fupp that

            “The reason eggs, buckets of water and milkshakes are ok is because we know they are harmless

            Most of the the time, yeah…

            “From rotten fruit to milkshakes and it has yet to stop democracy or escalate to more serious violence”

            – you literally gave an example in your first comment where is has. If people think throwing an egg at someone they disagree with, the next step might be, oh I don’t know, trapping someone in inside their car for a couple of hours, shouting obscenities at them. There are loads of canvassers who have stories about being spat at or assaulted, actually deciding to kill someone is just the next logical step.

            Genuinely surprised to see you advocating for mob rule, Listrade.

          8. Listrade

            @Rob_G Did they physically stop him speaking or did he make that choice to stop? If people shout down a politician making a speech is that also hindering their voice? So ultimately all we have to do is listen to their crap and mutter our discontent? The milkshake thrower didn’t stop that, Farage stopped it. He decided to take it as a threat and walkaway.

            You know what, there’s examples of everything being harmful in exceptional circumstances. A milkshake or egg thrown at a politicians suit? Nah, I’m not going to even bother to link that to potentially harmful.

            It’s protest. It’s legitimate. It isn’t mob rule, because there was no harm or threat it was the preciousness and cowardliness of the speakers who when confronted with humiliation and protest ran on their heals. Nothing stopped Farage continuing to talk with some milkshake on him. No mob stopped him.

            Practically each time a far right speaker turns up in Liverpool, they are met with a mob and forced out the city. That’s legitimate too, and it’s far more threatening. Same way keeping a minister in her car as a protest is legitimate.

            Protest is part of democracy. Humiliating those who we vehemently disagree with and who are allowed unfettered access to the media to give their views unchallenged is fine by me. The whole centrist view of leave it to the polls is bull.

          9. Vanessa the Holy Face of Frilly Keane

            Ah Rob
            Cop on

            Throwing food – fresh or compost heap stuff
            Even slurry
            Has been a form of protest since the dark ages and stocks and travelling shows

            Taking the leap to physical assult and beyond is the kinda stuff Sarah Palin’s followers would do

            Not Listrade

          10. Rob_G

            “If people shout down a politician making a speech is that also hindering their voice?”

            The difference is that he wasn’t shouted down; he was physically assaulted.

            “Practically each time a far right speaker turns up in Liverpool, they are met with a mob and forced out the city. That’s legitimate too”

            No, it isn’t.

            “Same way keeping a minister in her car as a protest is legitimate.”

            No it isn’t, either.
            You and I are currently in mild disagreement; by your logic, if me and group of mates came and trapped you in a toilet cubicle to keep you away from smartphone or laptop to post any more comments on Broadsheet, that would be legitimate, too.

            “Protest is part of democracy” – yes it is. Physically assaulting people, physically intimidating someone to shut them down, physically obstructing them from going about their lawful business, is not part of democracy. It’s the opposite of democracy.

          11. millie st meadowlark

            I have to say Rob, I generally find your counter arguments very informative and even if I don’t agree with your point, they are almost always well made.

            But not today. There’s more than a hint of the strawman about them. Your point re assault was dead on the nose, apparently, as the milkshake thrower has been arrested on common assault. But you really are stretching it with the outrage over this supposed infringement of Farage’s democratic rights.

          12. Listrade

            @rob Think we’ll soon be reducing our arguments to absurd levels and equivalence, so might be a point to agree to disagree and our suits will be milkshake free.

            On your point about our disagreement here, I don’t see it as the same. We both have an equal platform to express our views. Neither of us is putting ourselves on a pedestal to influence a population on a particular position. Farage has numerous very high profile platforms for what he says, his critics don’t.

            Again, nobody stopped Farage, he was free (and has had ample coverage today too) to make his point.

            It is different for politicians because they have an unchecked platform. You are checking me and my views at every stage.

            If you want to take my laptop to make a point on democracy, give me a heads-up to delete the browser history and untitled folder 5.

          13. Cian

            …if the milk-shake thrower had screamed “peaceful protest” he would have gotten full support from the BS crowd.

          14. rotide

            This is hillarious.

            If the milkshake was flung at a pro choice speaker or Panti or anyone other than the cartoon villian that Farage is, you’d all be up in arms

          15. millie st meadowlark

            My issue is the claim that it’s ‘an affront to democracy’. It’s not.

          16. Yep

            @ rotide

            Difference is Panti would most likely have made an off-colour joke, called for the person to be ignored and continued speaking.

            Do you consider this an “affront to democracy”?

          17. Rob_G

            Panti strikes me a dedicated and a resilient fellow, I’m sure if someone skulled him in the head with a can of coke he’d be able to shrug it off and solider on – doesn’t make it any less wrong, though.

            @Listrade – the thing about your examples is that they are full of people you more-or-less agree with obstructing people you more-or-less disagree with.

            What if Panti (to keep the analogy going) was invited to speak at some venue, and a bunch of far-right activists blockaded the building preventing him from going in and speaking – this would equate to ‘democracy in action’, from your Liverpool/Joan Burton reaction.

          18. Listrade

            @Rob, no, I would have no problem. I would have no problem with throwing milkshakes. Plenty of politicians I have agreed with or not minded have had eggs, paint, etc thrown at them. I haven’t minded. Most handled it well to be fair and didn’t slope off. But there is a key difference in all these examples: there is no “left” equivalence to Farage or his ilk.

            Rory, invited to speak would not be on the same kind of platform as Farage. It would not be on the basis of seeking election and a position of power. That is a key difference. Panti would not have positioned themselves as someone who has an answer or seeking to be put in a position of power using divisive and inflammatory arguments. Panti would not have been repeatedly given airtime or newspaper space without an opposing view being given an opportunity to make a counter argument. We saw this happen.

            So when anger and frustration result in action of humiliating an individual who has positioned themselves into a position of power an influence and they end up with an expensive dry cleaning bill for their suit, I’m ok with it. Whether I agree with the politician, like them, hate them, disagree with them.

          19. Nigel

            ‘If the milkshake was flung at a pro choice speaker or Panti or anyone other than the cartoon villian that Farage is, you’d all be up in arms’

            Be a bit stupid if we weren’t. Supoorting the people we support and opposing the people who protest them while opposing the people we oppose and supporting the people who protest them isn’t hypocrisy IT’S A TAUTOLOGY.

          20. Rob_G

            Rory does have political power, albeit not of a party political nature. The fact that he has been on The Late Late & is a household name and the face of the marriage equality referendum means that he has 1,000x more political clout than one of out hypothetical blockading far-right activists. I haven’t seen any far-right politicians or activists being interviewed on RTÉ; ergo, they could make the argument that ‘the other side’ had been given all of the airtime without any opposing arguments, and that their ‘anger and frustration’ was as real as anyone else’s.

            “… seeking to be put in a position of power using divisive and inflammatory arguments” – again, your subjective opinion. There are probably many people who consider the notion of marriage taking place between a man and a woman to be highly divisive and inflammatory – would Christians then be justified in throwing milkshakes at Rory, or running him out of town, or trapping him in car for several hours?

            Again – you seem to be fine with people being denied the right to express themselves, so long they are people you disagree with. Freedom of speech is for everyone, even people whose views we may find abhorrent.

          21. Listrade

            @Rob we’re not going anywhere here.

            1. I said I would support a protest against Rory.
            2. I consider protest to be a form of speech and so is also a right. Who has the most “right” in that case, whoever has the less chance to exercise their speech. Politicians get all opportunities to speak, they’re never off the tv, radio or newspapers. Farage is literally on the news at some point every day. He even had a radio show. At no point has his free speech been impacted by the milkshake. He’s made his point. However, us, me and you, we don’t get that same voice. We get to bitch and moan on here or wherever, but we don’t get a voice. Protest is our voice. To me it takes precedence over any politician who has had ample and unchecked time to speak. I consider milkshakes, shouting and even running them out of town to be legitimate protest. I cannot make that any clearer.
            3. Rory is not and equivalence of Farage. Give me an equivalent “left” politician, who is given huge media coverage, who uses verifiable untruths, fear and hate to impact politics and to seek power and we will have that debate. Well, we won’t, because I’ve already said: I have no problem with it.
            4. To make it absolutely clear once and for all: protest by those who do not have the same opportunity or position of power trumps the minor inconvenience of anyone seeking political influence, who is consistently given an opportunity to speak.

      2. bisted

        …devotees you say Bog_R…affront to democracy…first time I’ve had a proper lol at one of your comments…

        1. Rob_G

          … the comments that assiduously reply to, even going so far as to give me a familiar nickname :)

          Always a pleasure to hear from the devotees, bisto ;)

          1. bisted

            …you’re welcome…possibly not a devotee yet but definitely a fan…glad your colon problem seems to be improving…

  5. eoin

    What’s happening with the *proposed* Mediahuis takeover of INM?

    Well, other than Denis O’Brien and Dermot Desmond selling around 25% of the company to Mediahuis, nothing very much at all.

    INM applied to the High Court, apparently for approval of the procedure to hold an extraordinary meeting of shareholders on 26th June where approval of 75%+ of the shareholders for the sale will be sought. There have been some vociferous individual shareholders who say the 10.5c a share (€146m) offer undervalues the business which is making €25m a year profits and is sitting on €80m cash.

    I really can’t see Mediahuis getting approval of 75%+ of the shareholders for a 10.5c offer.

    Why though did INM need to go to the High Court for directions for the EGM in June?

    1. Vanessa the Holy Face of Frilly Keane

      Wild guess now
      So don’t be laying money Eoin

      I’d say they were looking for HC backup to push back any rabble rousing from those pesky Minority Interests and less dominant shareholders

      ODCE may still have some handcuffs on them

      Like I said
      Just guessing

      1. eoin

        You’re probably right Vanessa about the ODCE aspect, but funnily, neither Denis O’Brien nor Dermot Desmond required High Court permission before they sold 25% of their joint 45% stake. You’d expect established company law and the memo and articles would normally cover a takeover.

        By acquiring 25%, Mediahuis can stop anyone else taking over (anyone contemplating a takeover needs to get 75%+ of the shares).

        It will be interesting to see how this proposed transaction proceeds and if any shareholders hold out for a higher offer.

  6. eoin

    Are Fianna Fail’s words on reform of libel laws just hot air?

    The (daily) Phoenix shows how the current libel laws are very lucrative for the FF justice spokesperson

    “Another instance where O’Callaghan’s party political line could be regarded as a little ironic given his legal obligations came after a security company, Risk Management International (RMI) was hired by Denis O’Brien’s Siteserv subsidiary, GMC/Sierra, in 2014….”


      1. rotide

        Sometimes I honestly think google are perfecting a ‘just asking questions’ deep mind AI and are testing it here.

      2. eoin

        No need for the sarkiness Millicent and just for that, you’re not invited to join the BS €1 billion bullion boat and diving trip to Donegal.

        1. millie st meadowlark

          Oh no! Don’t break my heart eoin! I am the ficklest of friends! I shall prostrate myself of the floor!

          (incidentally, it was intended as more of a teasing jibe than undiluted snark as are 85% of my comments)

          1. eoin

            Fine then, you’re back in, remember to pack your one-piece and a big sun hat, you can bring a bit of style to the enterprise, sit at the back of the speed boat imbibing a martini while Cian goes down and retrieves what the Times Ireland (re-reported by RTE) assures us is €1bn of bullion and that definitely isn’t fake news.

          2. Andyourpointiswhatexactly?

            While Cian goes down?
            Ah Jaysus. I’ll need the light on tonight when I sleep, now.

          3. Vanessa the Holy Face of Frilly Keane

            What d’ya mean I’m not invited ©Bodger

            If Millie’s going so am I

            Feckin cheek

  7. WOGAN

    The transplant story is most disturbing
    So many organs people donate to save lives are treated with the same contempt as babies at tuam
    That’s it
    They pillage you in life and now want to pillage your dead body
    I assume the country will be up to its neck with skips containing harvested organs

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