British author and former GP Vernon Coleman says the UK’s mask wearing rules are ‘illogical, unscientific and dangerous’, and claims ‘those who insist on wearing masks are are threatening our lives and our future’.
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FIGHT!
Earlier: A Plague On All Your Houses
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Ah the almost daily Broadsheet conspiracy post.
Didn’t he also call AIDs the hoax of the century?
and he wasn’t right about that too?
He displays a pretty nasty attitude to gay people on his website and claims “a study” that he doesn’t cite showed men with AIDS had an average of 1,100 sexual partners.
was it a hoax or not? That was the question
Was that a genuine question? I assumed it was supposed to rhetorically because nobody could be stupid enough to believe AIDs was a hoax.
Thank about the average person. How intelligent the average person is.
Half the population are as stupid or are more stupid that that.
Of course there are people that believe AIDS is a hoax.
I don’t get this opposition to masks. It’s a very basic way to filter each others air. It works.
By their logic:
Why do houses have chimneys at all? Why not let the smoke and fumes built up inside the house when you light a fire? I want the freedom to choke and pass out!
most of it is because it gives a fake sense of security ‘allowing’ businesses to re-open, trade etc
in fact the best way to stop the virus is to close everything down and everyone work from home
but then that exposed how little a lot of the government workers actually do when they are IN the office
hence, gotta re-open.. wear a mask little boy, you know you want to, you know you want to put your mask on baby
Completely daft claim. The vast majority of government workers are working from home for the foreseeable future and are likely to be the last to return.
Wonder why that is George?
Or you are prone to make uninformed comments here mostly?
Because government advice remains to work from home wherever possible and government workers are obviously expected to follow government advice.
I hear they won’t be back until January
I’ve been working the whole time split between home and office, using my own data allowance and laptop while working from home. How about you?
Working at home mostly – observe colleagues take advantage of the situation by doing even less than they did before
How can you observe from home?
Worthless or zero contribution at team meetings
he observed it the same way he gave a detailed first-person account about travelling through the airport, even though he wasn’t taking a plane…
Whilst I am sceptical about preventative value of a face mask I wear one while shopping . There are many people filled with stress and anxiety who scitter away from the maskless . I carry mine in my pocket and don it before entering a shop . It’s really simple . I don’t feel that I’m becoming indoctrinated by ‘ The Man’
If wearing one helps alleviate a little anxiety in my local community I think I am using a smidgeen of ‘ emotional intelligence ‘
His claim that masks are unhealthy is ridiculous. They don’t appear to have any adverse affect on surgeons who perform operations that take several hours.
Surgeons change their mask every half hour or at least are supposed to. They also wash their hands before and after putting on and never touch it while operating. I expect they also have their cardio vascular system checked on a regular basis and/or if they develop symptoms.
Their environment is risk managed to ensure no harm to either themselves or the patient which is quite different to the general public situation. I have a friend who was a theatre nurse and had to give it up that very reason.
Any evidence for that claim? “Surgeons change their mask every half hour or at least are supposed to. “
Nope- anecdotal from said person who was forced to quit job.
The online consensuses appears to be around 90 minutes but with the proviso that it is replaced if it becomes wet, torn or displaced- as the filtration efficiency and protective ability is compromised. There also seems to be a breath-ability rating on them, which is interesting.
Right, on being challenged you immediately go from 30 minutes to 90 minutes.
Nope- I merely recounted what I was told. This person has no reason to lie- that I know of anyways.
You made a statement like it was solid fact.
I feel it would be more honest if you had written something like:
“A friend (who was a theatre nurse) told me that [in Ireland/UK/US] surgeons are supposed to change their mask every half hour – although 90-120 minutes seems more common.”
I wasn’t aware of that mask etiquette for surgeons, but I do know the procedure for nurses in Santa Clara, California – a relative of mine is one. Long before COVID came on the scene and during the flu season, nurses at the Kaiser hospital had a choice of getting the flu jab or wear a mask for the full 12 hour shift. My relative chose the mask and has never suffered any harm at all and she’s been doing that for years.
Thank goodness that we are all fortunate enough to be working in operating theatres.
I clocked over 19,000 steps at work today, inside a construction site.
To see how that feels, do 10K on a treadmill with a mask on.
@italia’90 Well there is rumors of them been made compulsory in gyms- yet another reason not to go.
Seriously- just because some people get on fine with them doesn’t mean everyone will. I have a family member who takes panic attacks when she wears one, and here is the thing- she never did before.
Ask your self this- if they are so harmless then why is it not compulsory for shop staff to wear them?
@SOQ
I can only share with you my own empirical evidence, with any degree of confidence, but saying that, everyone’s experience is different.
I’m not buying into the fear anymore, or the hype or the shaming of people to suit someone else’s agenda until there’s a dramatic or significant surge in the death rate of otherwise healthy people, exclusively from the ‘rona.
I know only 3 people who have been sick with the virus.
2 are nurses that deal with elderly patients regularly and the other is a care facility manager. Weirdly, none of their immediate family members contracted the virus especially when you consider how contagious it’s supposed to be? Almost all of their colleague’s have tested positive for it and in the case of the care home manager, every worker and every patient has tested positive for it. One of the worst death tolls in a care home took place less than 200 meters away from my house. I am much more concerned for my relatives outside the country than those who are here. I also have 3 grown children, early to mid 20’s who are NY, LA and Sydney. Thinking about them keeps me awake at night and if I’m honest here, it wakes me up in the middle of the night too. My younger kids are carrying on as if nothing has happened. After the initial shock and upset to their usual routines, they been having a great time. Sure the home schooling was a pain for all of us, but I think we know each other a lot better and I know far too much about Tik Tok and Minecraft and that pathetic Roblox than I otherwise would have. We observed the lock-down rules, we socially distanced when out at the shop or at the bank or the rare occasions we had to attend meetings for work in the city. No masks, just keeping a high standard of personal hygiene and social etiquette while staying apart at a reasonably safe distance. My local supermarket has been a bit of a joke when applying all the new standards and rules. Yet, not one of them has been sick. I keep asking the manager when I see him, he lives around the corner from me. Similarly with the 2 Gardaí that are my immediate neighbours. They’ve never had so much time off and are on reduced shift pattern. They’re not regular garda btw. They’re even more sceptical about the effects of the virus than me and that concerns me some what.
Lastly, I had a sever viral infection in 2018 and I haven’t had so much as a sniffle since then. I was quarantined in the Mater for 3 nights as they first thought I had TB, then they said I had pleurisy, then they finally treated my for a viral infection with steroid and antibiotics.l had just returned from Mongolia. Mama Italia and Mrs Italia both came down with serious viral infections back in December, both confined to bed for a week and both had a lousy dry cough for weeks afterwards.
Not sure if that is coincidental?
@SOQ
“if they are so harmless then why is it not compulsory for shop staff to wear them?”
It is compulsory if they are on the shop floor with customers. e.g. stacking shelves.
It is optional if they can either keep a distance of 2m or have a partition from customers.
You only have to see how far a persons breath travels with and without a mask to see the benefits. Anyone saying otherwise is an idiot or is selling something.
Judging by the previous post it looks like there’s a difference of opinion between Bodger and Chompsky on this one.
FIGHT!*
*dont fancy Bodgers chances much!
I dunno.
I heard he’s lethal with a handbag in close-quarters combat …
Have you seen the end of the film Fight Club?
hajaj very good
lol – I’d suggest Split over Fight Club!
I seriously doubt that Bodger and Chompsky are the same person though. Anyone from the Sheet care to confirm?
So Chompsky is Brad and Bodger is Ed?
Meh
Each to their own
Usually
But I don’t get the face masks are a hoax charge, charges or chargers
If there was money to be made – like with vaccines, or long shorts on the various markets,
Then yeah I could see it
But not with something you can make yourself out of an ould’ tea towel
Also, since I’m here like – that Vernon Coleman is an odious intolerant creep
Could be a “perfect storm” of different factors? According to the BBC’s medical correspondent, Deborah Cohen, various sources recently told her that “the WHO committee reviewing the evidence had not backed masks but they recommended them due to political lobbying” .
For governments it’s a way to transition a public traumatised by media “fear porn” out of lockdown. At the same time, imagine the scenario where masks aren’t worn, but after the lockdown measures are lifted, there’s no resurgence of the virus as predicted – instead it continues to fade away. If that happens, the spotlight would turn to the government decision to introduce lockdown in the first place. Mask-wearing avoids a potential scenario where the public deems lockdown as having been an unnecessary overreaction. “The virus didn’t take hold again because of the masks” will be the narrative.
Our epidemiological experts may also be in the grip of groupthink and unwilling (at least publicly) to accept the burden of having made a mistake of historic proportions. Although further evidence is emerging to suggest that their initial assumptions were wrong on how widespread the virus already was and how susceptible the general population were, they seem intent on doubling down on the path they’ve taken. The WHO policy turnabout could be feeding into our experts’ confirmation bias. Maybe they’re also being influenced to some extent by what the UK is doing.
Profit driven pharmaceutical companies are already invested in widespread uptake of a vaccine. What they don’t want is for the virus to have faded away for an extended period and out of public consciousness by the time a vaccine is ready for market. Mask-wearing is way to prolong the fear whether the virus is really circulating or not.
Then of course there are those financial elites who have said they see the pandemic as a unique opportunity to implement the ‘Great Reset’ (as they put it) of the world’s economies (in reality to maintain the capitalist status quo a while longer). Again mask-wearing and stoking pandemic fear in general is a way to ensure the crisis is prolonged until these plans are realised
Cheezuz
That’s a mouthful FLaw
Well said, f_lawless. There are many connotations to the term ‘pandemic’ which seem to have bypassed most people.
Why does BS give space to this bs?
Slow news day.
Although Princess Beatrice got ‘secretly’ married so I’m all of a dither.
Because Bodger believes – or at the very least, has a sneaking regard for – every single conspiracy under the sun (apart from the moon-landing hoax one, as he helpfully pointed out).
We have plenty of coverage on the site for those who believe in the moon landings. I happen not to, but I don’t feel the need to ridicule people who do and I never object to those posts.
+1
Rob is afraid of any sort of contrary viewpoint away from orthodoxy and sublimation
I assume that is due to the mountains of evidence including the scientists in many countries who continue to take measurements to this day using markers left behind during the moon landing.
Yeah – everyone knows that the moon landings were faked – they were filmed on mars!
I really find that one hard to understand. Especially when so much of our current Technology was born out of the Race to the Moon. Professor Brian Cox, Neil DeGrasse Tyson, Patrick Moore, Carl Sagan, all of the Astronomers and Cosmologists would have to agree to the cover up. I just don’t see that happening, or that it could be a matter of opinion.
I quite like Bodger’s Conspiracies actually
Personally I reckon there’s a bitta Conspiracy Theorist in all of us
Ok maybe not all David Icke
Or Terry the bees are turning into killer ladybirds with 5G locator venom Lawton
Or the ACI and the False Bottomed Ballot Boxes
But still
Think about it- I betcha you’ll find yourself harbouring a few suspicions
It’s the tens of thousands of people who worked for NASA and managed to keep the secret for all these years that I have a sneaking regard for …
+1 to “It’s the tens of thousands of people who worked for NASA”
He had a column in the news of the world years ago, need I say anymore.
Coleman is warning that, as the need for these measures become less and less, the imposition is actually increased. As he points out, the wearing of masks is liable to be extended for a long time. There will never be a time when it will be ‘safe’ to do without them if it is, supposedly, not safe to do without them now. When/if a vaccine is available, at some uncertain date in the future, the virus will have mutated and/or a new one (two, three…) will have appeared so even vaccination won’t guarantee safety.
Coleman is talking about England, although he says UK. He could have a field day with the new public transport regulations in Wales. Apart from 3-layer masks, there are the following:
No running for the bus or train (the bus should wait for anyone who wants to get on so that they don’t have to run – so the driver has to be able to check in all directions and wait for how long?)
No taking or making of mobile calls, except in emergency
No loud activities (like singing)
No food or drink, except on medical grounds (no water, even, on a journey which could take several hours!)
No reading of newspapers
Presumably, though, the rules change abruptly at the border between Wales and England, for example, somewhere in the Severn railway tunnel or on the Severn Bridge. I wonder if this is announced on the intercom of cross-border trains/buses or whether people are expect to ‘know’ where the border is so that they stop drinking or whatever.
There is no evidence of a mutation at the present time, but if it does happen prepare for the worse.
The Covid-19 virus has been mutating/evolving/changing from the word go. There are loads of references to this on the Internet, not just from the media but also from medical sources. Whilst one cannot believe everything on the Net, these are not all ‘cut and paste’ repetitions. ‘The D614G variant of COVID-19 quickly took over as the dominant strain soon after it first appeared’. This is from Medical Press and is from an article provided by the University of Sheffield. An Irish Times article refers to different strains being found in different cities in Ireland and 100-150 mutations being identified by scientists around the world.
Virus do mutate and produce different strains – that is their nature – and Covid-19 has mutated already and will continue to so.
Surely its mutation, in viral terms, is relatively slow John?
Depends what you mean by slow, SOQ. The D614G variant, apparently, appeared pretty early on and there are, also apparently, a lot of other mutations already. It’s, pretty likely, to say the least, that there will have been more mutations by the time any vaccine has been cleared for general use. Who’s to say whether the vaccine will be effective against the mutated form(s)? Only time will tell.
It all adds to the overall uncertainty that allows the Government to ‘justify’ the continued enforcement of the use of masks for the foreseeable future, unless people stand against it – and, whilst there is a general disinclination to wear masks (I speak of the counties round where I live and shop), there’s no real evidence of a will to fight against it. It’s more of a ‘well, if I have to, I have to but I hope it won’t be for too long’ – similar to the grudging acceptance of lockdown. There are, of course, some true believers, too, and they certainly won’t fight for the ending of enforced mask-wearing.
It’s down to the few, like f_lawless and Coleman, for example, to keep up what pressure they can to persuade people to really think about what is happening and not just toe the line regardless. You don’t have to agree with either of them, or with me, for that matter. The important thing is not to blindly accept and repeat whatever is the official line, just because it IS the official line.
.