76 thoughts on “Saturday’s Papers

  1. diddy

    well, if you thought your life was bad. trying paddling to England on a dinghy using shovels in 35c heat. perspective

    Reply
    1. Formerly known as @ireland.com

      You have to move quickly to beat the second wave. In Melbourne, the authorities reacted too slowly. We are now paying the price – stage 4 lockdown (Like Ireland’s main lockdown) – for the first time.

      Reply
      1. Kerry

        Could you make this answer a bit more X-files-y for SOQ? He doesn’t really go in for that grounded-in-reality stuff, he’s more of a “do your own research” on the internet guy. Anything that suggests some kind of global conspiracy with sinister, yet never fully explained, aims would be great, thanks!

        Reply
      2. SOQ

        Formerly, Melbourne never has a first wave so it cannot be having a second- this is your first. The police behaving like German Nazis is not helping of course- smashing car windows and dragging people out through them is something which will be remembered long after this thing has gone. Arresting people for not wearing masks IN PUBLIC has no scientific basis whatsoever.

        The plain fact is, viruses sweep the world all the time and they cannot be stopped, only slowed. All you can do is protect those identified as vulnerable and allow the rest to continue as was, which is exactly what Sweden done- albeit not with sufficient protections in place, as they now admit.

        But, according to Dr Marcus de Brun, they still have a lower over 65s fatality rate than Ireland so square that circle.

        In the case of Ireland, these outbreaks are in meat plants and asylum centers, so that is specifically where the resources should be deployed- they knew this would happen months ago so why the suprise now?

        We have a purpose designed space in City West which should be used to house those who cannot self isolate, mobilise all community groups to ensure the vulnerable are safe and allow the rest to continue as normal. In other words, quarantine the sick- not the healthy.

        Reply
          1. SOQ

            Yes- you could stop with the sarky comments and communicate like a grown up- that would be very helpful.

          2. Brother Barnabas

            fair play, soq- keep on fighting the good fight

            dont let those fupping factual realists bring you down

          3. MacGafraidh

            SOQ, have you actually thought about not being an anti covid warrior on Broadsheet and maybe moving it somewhere productive.. Like.. Anywhere else at all?

        1. Keith

          All the chickens coming home to roost
          A meat industry that pay slave labour wages only those desperate enough are imported to work in these sweat shops
          Not only that
          The farmers are paid SFA and only make money by increasing the numbers that have an effect on our global footprint

          Meanwhile the boys goodman and co laugh all the way to the bank

          It’s time these plants were all closed until covid is over

          Just import the cheap crap from South America until times this is over

          Reply
          1. GiggidyGoo

            And they will all be at a horse racing meeting on the westmeath/offaly border guffawing between themselves. Mini Cheltenham maybe, unless the Gardai do their job.

  2. Sirtuffyknight

    “Dr Glynn said that at present there is no community transmission in the three counties…” So why the lockdown? What’s the point in identifying clusters, track and trace etc. if broad-strokes, county-wide restrictions are going to be imposed anyway?

    Reply
    1. Janet, dreams of big guns

      it’s my understanding it’s in the meat package plants and the accommodation provided not the general community, I am concerned with the shutting down of the economy which in the long run will result in far greater deaths due to mass unemployment, people will no longer be able to provide for their families, we will see the rates of depression, mental health, suicides..etc.go through the roof. I urge you all to concider this perspective, which the media seems to downplay.
      The articles from the NYT, Time Magazine, CNN, Washington Post, etc for example…their concern for human life is rather touching, however it is a pity when that concern goes out the window when they act as principal cheerleaders for yet more war.
      I received an email that I won’t be back until March now, that will be a year of literally eating my savings, I have sent my CV out to other sectors but there’s not many positions out there except in nursing and IT.
      This covid stuff isn’t going anywhere, I think we have to start thinking around a more sustainable way of living with it.

      Reply
      1. Tom J

        You will see a few unemployed people at the G.P.O this afternoon, shouting waffle and spite. I don’t think any of them will be committing suicide any time soon.

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      2. Formerly Known As @ireland.com

        @Janet, I hope everything works out. The problem is that once the hospitals are full and/or the medical staff are sick, more people will die. You can wait till it is obvious that is possible, or you act early and avoid that downward spiral. I am in Melbourne and I wish we had moved more quickly. 500 cases a day is going to make this a long second lockdown for us. Start early and it might be possible to open up quickly.

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      3. Lush

        So sorry to hear that Janet; I can understand you having an itchy trigger finger, it’s not been an easy time for you since you came home.
        I’m probably going to be on activité partielle (70% of gross monthly salary) until the end of the year, but at least that is being guaranteed by the government.

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        1. Janet, dreams of big guns

          thanks Lushie, at least I have some savings, there’s worse off, my brother is on that 70 percent too, big relief ! Take care of yourself !

          Reply
    2. Keith

      Even better if you turn up at a covid 19 testing station you will not be tested unless you have been referred by a GP
      No one can access tests unless sanctioned by the HSE or if you try the net the latest scam is covid testing

      What has government got to hide?

      I have tried 6labs for a test and none will undetake testing without GP referral

      Now we see the biggest weakness and that is testing just like face masks a few months ago and sanitiser when covid started rearing it’s ugly head

      Get ready for more lockdowns

      Reply
        1. Keith

          I do not fit the criteria to get one
          As in no symptoms and no known contact yet

          Mind you around new year I had this pretty bad flu that involved such painful stabbing feeling if I even coughed aches pains fever and difficulty in breathing but this was way before we were hit with the first case brought in by a lady from Belfast who used Dublin airport then took forms of transport to Belfast

          Reply
  3. Niamh

    Good bye dinner party, hello snacks.
    And underneath, a picture of people struggling to survive.
    Peak earth

    Reply
  4. Vanessanelle

    For all those looking down their noses
    And sometimes mocking
    The doubters and deniers
    And the half hoax theorists

    Kildare Laois & Offaly back into full lockdown
    But racing is still going ahead in Killbeggan today

    And as for Meat Processing/ Packing plants
    A COVID-19 death earlier this year (Moy Park Dungannon) confirmed there were clusters throughout that Sector
    And their shabby pay & conditions, Communal living and many in DP btw was well aired by C4 news
    And by Unite in particular

    All summer we’ve watched this sector of our workforce be put at risk and exploited
    For profit
    Same as the GeeGees running today

    Not a toss about the Pandemic or risk of spread when it comes to industry

    We’re all being codded

    Reply
    1. Keith

      All the chickens coming home to roost
      A meat industry that pay slave labour wages only those desperate enough are imported to work in these sweat shops
      Not only that
      The farmers are paid SFA and only make money by increasing the numbers that have an effect on our global footprint

      Meanwhile the boys goodman and co laugh all the way to the bank

      It’s time these plants were all closed until covid is over

      Just import the cheap crap from South America until times this is over

      Reply
      1. Vanessanelle

        + time for the Farmers to return to their Cooperative roots
        And stop paying affiliation fees to the IFA to fatten themselves and their mocky’ah lobbiests

        Who’ll still do what the industrial processors growers and PLCs want

        Reply
        1. Keith

          Saying this for years
          Butchers used to slaughter their own and let’s face it
          If we produced mainly for the domestic market and had live exports only instead of the beef barons our emissions would be down and of course farmers would get a decent price for their product instead of getting SFA and relying on cheap labour to staff these death traps
          Strange how we are hearing over 300 cases from meat processors in the past few days which represents a good 75% of cases

          And where has the health authorities been
          Seems they are quite ignorant of covid 19 or they were scratching their bottoms

          Maybe close them all down and just import our needs

          As evidently they cannot be trusted

          While they lock down our people industry seems to be taking the Michael

          And still the airports are open with 130 flights today arriving in Dublin

          Reply
    2. Janet, dreams of big guns

      there’s a lack of consistency, a dose of the hypocritical and a real feeling of one rule for some and different rule for others that is making probably common sense things harder to digest

      Reply
      1. Vanessanelle

        At a meeting earlier this morning one of the oul’ lads referred to it as
        over and back
        Back and forth
        In and out

        But the game’s up now AFAIC
        A plane can land from the US this morning
        But I can’t go to Kildare town
        And have to wear a mask when I go up to collect the bread on Monday

        But not today
        Or Tomorrow
        Where the weekend seaside tailbacks for the IceCream go as far as Jack Whites

        Tis on Monday I’m to take the additional precautions ’cause we’re more at risk on Monday

        The likes of yerself and meself Janie
        The everyday people
        We’re being suckered

        And it’s not for Public Health reasons
        Or to prevent the HSE trip over their tipping point

        Its to push us to agree to anything

        Reply
      2. SOQ

        Yup well – hang onto your hat.

        This comes from a lady called Suzie Buckley @Thorgwen whom I know nothing about but if correct is saying that the fatalities for Jan to May for this year are LOWER than the previous three years.

        All deaths must be recorded within three months so perhaps a slight increase in the last two weeks in May and for June but seriously?

        The ‘peak’ was supposed to be in April?

        https://twitter.com/Thorgwen/status/1291768619744088064/photo/1

        Reply
        1. SOQ

          Has ANYBODY got an opinion on this?

          How can you have a pandemic AND a drop in overall fatalities?

          It just doesn’t make sense.

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          1. SOQ

            Did you even read that printed email darling?

            It is real- as any FOI request from a half decent journalist will prove.

            Do we even have those anymore?

          2. Cian

            1. All the figurrs are subject to change.
            2. The figures for Jan and Feb are irrelevant to COVID.
            3. There are 1,700 covid-linked deaths. There are 31,000 deaths per year so it is a 6% annual increase. Or a 24% quarter increase.

          3. GiggidyGoo

            Cian – we don’t know if the Jan and Feb figures are irrelevant for Covid. After all, it’s a 2019 virus.
            That’s a pretty damning piece of information that SOQ has produced and notably there are a lot of commenters gone very quiet here.

          4. Keith

            You cannot
            Somewhere porkies are being told
            My guess is the HSE are like North Korea with the truth

            Watch contagion on Netflix about a fictional covid pandemic

            All I know is one of our waitresses is a. Student nurse in cork

            She states the hospital she works in is chaotic and she lost a patient the other day

            20 years old on 13 hour shifts 3 days a week on and paid the minimum wage she also says half the nursing staff are from India

    3. Vanessanelle

      Happy days for the Horse Owners and Bookies
      + Jockies Pundits Stable hands, and all the other racing paraphernalia
      But mainly the Owners and Bookies

      The Curragh got the go ahead for tomorrow

      But don’t go through Kildare whatever you do

      Reply
      1. bisted

        …you don’t seem to like horse racing V…you’ll be relieved to hear that it’s held behind closed doors…no racegoers, nor bookies, nor owners will be able to attend…just people who work in the business…owners range people of very modest means to multi-billionaires…one of the biggest owners in Ireland is a guy called JP McManus…to celebrate Limerick winning the hurling he gave every GAA county board €100k…he won’t be able to attend either…

        Reply
        1. Vanessanelle

          I’ve no problem with the GeeGees Bisto
          And I’m no stranger to them down there in the Kildare Town/ Curragh enclave

          My problem is with the messing around with the phases and the ah no pubs can’t open now so what if ye’ve spent 0000s getting socially distanced prepped, the data lags, no you can’t get a test go to your GP pay 50 yo-yos for a referral first , the reports from sources with no names only initials, are schools opening, promise us you’ll insolate when you come back from New Orleans, make sure you wear a mask on Monday, ara’ they’ll be grand there coming home from The Curragh

          Ah Jesus I’m getting fed up now just talking about it

          If Kildare is spiking, why the jaysus are they sending jockies and stable hands and vets and medical teams, and race officials and course staff – all who come from all parts of the island going from point to course to gallops to yard.
          And then onto the next yard
          Before Epsom, Ayr and then Doncaster

          Shur that’s just taking the p1ss out of all us

          Wasn’t it enough that they forced people to work within established clusters FFS

          Ara’ tis sickening
          Listening and watching them all on their benchmarked 6 figures eff us around
          Gimme a dose of the virus anyday
          Than another week of this circus

          Reply
    4. Keith

      When will the penny drop
      WEAR A BLOODY FACEMADK WHEN IN PUBLIC AND REMEMBER ITS TO STOP YOU INFECTING OTHERS

      HOUSE PARTIES AND SWEATSHOP PROCESSING PLANTS
      AND NO TESTING UNTILL DISASTER HAPPENS

      Reply
          1. SOQ

            We dismiss past religions as variations of voodoo.

            And yet, here we are, under house arrest with no notable increase in overall deaths calling those who object to muzzling our facial identity mad- even though there is no scientific reason for doing so.

            I am pretty certain you are a state sector worker who is enjoying the high life- you are most definitely not a self employed business (wo)man.

        1. Keith

          In the early days of aids it was the same
          No one worse PPE and we all know what happened SOQ

          Wear a mask
          It protects others from you if you have covid19

          Reply
  5. Keith

    Surprised the FAI with its hand out for moolah has not made the papers

    I wonder how many millions is headed to this corrupt organisation from the public purse as people’s livelihoods are in ruins

    Reply
      1. Keith

        But nothing like Ryan air and aerlingus and we will now see the beef barons with one that might just be more than the export insurance claim from the first Iraq war the taxpayers were saddled with

        The banks will also be there

        Reply
  6. f_lawless

    According to the WHO, the “leading candidate” for a Covid-19 vaccine is being developed by researchers at the University of Oxford, led by Irish scientist Adrian Hill. and financed by AstraZeneca global pharmaceutical company (who also operate from Ireland).

    This article is noteworthy:
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-astrazeneca-results-vaccine-liability/astrazeneca-to-be-exempt-from-coronavirus-vaccine-liability-claims-in-most-countries-idUSKCN24V2EN

    ‘AstraZeneca has been granted protection from future product liability claims related to its COVID-19 vaccine hopeful by most of the countries with which it has struck supply agreements, a senior executive told Reuters…

    “This is a unique situation where we as a company simply cannot take the risk if in … four years the vaccine is showing side effects,” Ruud Dobber, a member of Astra’s senior executive team, told Reuters.

    “In the contracts we have in place, we are asking for indemnification. For most countries it is acceptable to take that risk on their shoulders because it is in their national interest,”..

    Dobber would not name the countries. ‘

    I think it’s probably safe to assume that Ireland is one of those countries.

    Considering that the usual safety protocols – which would normally take years – are being waived in the rush to bring out a vaccine and that a company spokesperson would make such a statement, I can’t see how anyone if they were really being honest with themselves wouldn’t find that very concerning.

    At the moment the current obsession in Ireland is about an apparent rise “new cases” but at the same time giving little or no consideration is being given to:

    (a) the unreliability and limitations of the PCR testing technology used (false positives)
    (b) what the apparent rise looks like when it’s been adjusted for the large increase in testing over time.( Is it, like in England, not actually rising at all as it turns out?)
    (c) the near complete drop off in deaths and hospitalisations across Europe for weeks now

    It would appear that the current road we’re on is inevitably leading us to a widespread vaccination program. But is the risk really justified by “the national interest” at this point? Those experts from various countries who have all along hypothesised that the virus was already widespread before lockdowns were ever put in place and that the near uniform drop off in deaths seen across Europe can be explained by reaching a herd immunity threshold , have gained more and more credibility as the situation has evolved.

    I think if our health officials here in Ireland fail to openly and honestly engage with those experts (as they sadly have apparently done from the start) before deciding whether a widespread and risky vaccination program is actually justified, they will be doing the people living on this island a grave disservice.

    And of course it goes without saying that being “Safe-Vax” and “Intelligent-Vax” is not “Anti-Vax”.

    Reply
        1. f_lawless

          I was wondering where it went – back now. Yes I agree it is worrying but something that needs to be considered on a national level

          Reply
          1. SOQ

            You may post something on this site which takes time to appear- I am speculating but I suspect it is to do with how often the underlying platform processes are ran.

            Think of it like a company moving to 365 email then wondering why so many emails come tumbling across at 12:01 ‘whatever’ time.

            The regularity should be in sync with the site traffic but to get priority costs money and as Broadsheet is ran on a shoe string- we have to live with what we have got.

      1. Keith

        Mind you it’s getting more like a script from a Hollywood movie

        Anyway half the medicines you buy do not work and you have no come back
        How many people buy creams for back pain only to find its as useful as a sieve in a sinking boat

        I suppose if you are desperate you will give it a try

        Reply
    1. bisted

      …well done f_lawless…you’ve managed to mould your usual template to suit your daily anti-vax message…I thought your revered Oxford Professors…Dr Hill is indeed a Professor, in fact, he’s a Fellow at Magdalene College…most worrying, you seem to use his Irishness as a way to denigrate his credentials and likewise that AstroZeneca has an Irish presence somehow diminishes it…spin it whatever way you like but you are a shameless and relentless anti-vaxxer…

      Reply
      1. f_lawless

        Silly interpretation of my comment. I mentioned Dr Hill’s Irish nationality and AstroZeneca’s Irish presence to make the point that there’s a strong Irish connection,so it therefore seems likely that Ireland is one of the group of countries which has granted protection to AstroZeneca from future product liability claims as per the AstroZeneca spokesperson.

        It’s not a comment on the Irish scientist’s ability nor a criticism of AstroZeneca because they operate from Ireland. Maybe it’s a reflection of your own inferiority complex that you would interpret it in such a way?

        The fact remains that standard safety procedures are being waived and AstroZeneca -and no doubt all the other pharmaceutical companies also rushing to develop a vaccine – are concerned about the potential risks from a financial point of view, hence the comment from their spokesperson:
        “This is a unique situation where we as a company simply cannot take the risk if in … four years the vaccine is showing side effects,”

        “In the contracts we have in place, we are asking for indemnification. For most countries it is acceptable to take that risk on their shoulders because it is in their national interest,”.

        When you say “your daily anti-vax message” you’re simply making things up. Please don’t do that. It doesn’t reflect well on you.

        Reply
        1. bisted

          …I’ve tried to understand what motivates you and the other anti-vaxxers here to bombard this site with a daily diet of dodgilinks and pseudo-science…ok, I don’t try too hard…but you all display symptoms of acute trypanophobia…

          Reply
        2. Brother Barnabas

          providing an indemnity to pharmaceutical companies when there’s a pressing need to access a vaccine is absolutely standard – and happened in 2009 during the swine flu pandemic. then a vaccine was produced within 5 months. ireland – along with every other country that availed of the drugs – gave indemnities to Glaxosmithkline, which made pandemrix, and to baxter, which produced another vaccine.

          i’m not saying whether this should or shouldn’t happen – pandemrix was subsequently connected to narcolepsy (around 30 cases in ireland, with compensation paid by the state) – but it’s completely normal – and understandable – that vaccine makers would look for indemnity before making any vaccine available

          Reply
          1. f_lawless

            But the point is not whether it’s normal or not for corporations to try to make sure they’re protected from being damaged financially. You wouldn’t expect anything else.

            The point is whether the risk to bring out a vaccine so quickly is justifiable at this point in time.

            In the case of the 2009 Swine Flu pandemic, governments stockpiled millions worth of vaccines but the rush to buy them proved unnecessary.. Swine flu dissipated quickly without the vast majority of the vaccines ever being used. The leading WHO scientists who pushed governments into urgently making the purchases, were later investigated by a leading human rights body and found to have been sponsored by the corporations producing the vaccines. At the time, the leader of the investigation called it “the medical scandal of the century”.

            At the beginning of Covid-19 pandemic it was feared that virus could potentially rip through a population exponentially, that no one had any kind of prior immunity therefore making the case fatality ratio extremely high. It was under those circumstances that governments decided to put us under lockdown and pharmaceutical companies were set to task to try and bring out a vaccine ASAP. The likes of Bill Gates were saying that we would have to stay in lockdown until a vaccine arrived..

            But since then more and more evidence has been emerging to show that populations would not get struck down at an exponential rate – up to 80% would exhibit mild to no symptoms due to acquired cross-immunity from similar viruses.

            Also, in the case of Europe at least, there’s now strong evidence to suggest that widespread community exposure to the virus had already occurred – though undetected – before lockdowns were ever put in place. With deaths and hospitalisations across Europe having been at near zero for weeks now despite an easing of lockdown measures, the most likely explanation is that most countries have reached, or are very close to, a herd immunity threshold.

            So I think the circumstances have changed since the beginning of the pandemic and I have doubts as to whether it’s still justifiable to rush the release of any vaccine at the expense of established safety protocols. Or if widespread uptake of a vaccine will be actually necessary if and when one emerges.

      2. Keith

        Bisted
        You really have to get past your Brit bashing

        The Americans. Are as near as oxford China as well

        The reality is each country except New Zealand has made a mess

        The only solution was to seal off your country untill you obliterate it

        Mainland Europe could not do it

        We could of as well as the UK

        Our governments chose not to

        Reply

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