198 thoughts on “Saturday’s Papers

      1. f_lawless

        As much as the corporate media outlets who’ve positioned themselves against Trump since 2016 all now bleat in unison that his allegations are “baseless”, the reality is they aren’t baseless and warrant a proper and fair investigation

        If fraud has been committed, it would be more important to salvage some integrity for US democracy rather than let it slide on the grounds that the ends justify the means. The question is though, will there be a proper and fair investigation? Let’s hope so

          1. f_lawless

            Have a look at this news clip. No malarkey to see here? I think it’s reasonable to say this is potential evidence of malarkey

            “One Michigan county clerk caught a glitch in tabulation software so they hand counted votes and found the glitch caused 6,000 votes to go to Biden + Democrats that were meant for Trump and Republicans. 47 MI counties used this software. ”
            https://mobile.twitter.com/robbystarbuck/status/1324783531139235841

            From what I read, in the presumed final count, Biden had originally led in the county by roughly 3,000 votes. Revised totals show that Trump won the county by around 2,500.

          2. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            A democracy we envy…what a joke. Electorial reform certainly needs to be addressed, however all the country’s woes cannot be squarely layed at Trumps door. Trump is just the latest ugly manifestation of what US politics has progressively become. Unfortunately for Trump, he does not come from the political class, meaning those who spend there entire careers supposedly ‘serving’ the people but rather enriching themselves by colluding with lobbies and special interest groups (both domestic and foreign). Most are law graduates and former praticiing law proffesionals and as such have a command of not only the law but of language. Trump on the other hand is crass, brash, vulgar and some would say ‘inarticulate’, this is probably due to him coming from the world of business and later entertainment. Trump is US politics with the mask of respectablity off, without the stirring speeches and platitudes that carress and reassure it’s citizens, it is no wonder the political class with its compliant media hate him (the media is a whole other subject).
            The ‘Make America great again’ slogan, is not too much different in it’s implication from ‘The US is the shining city on the hill’ that has been alluded to by former presidents and those in high office. We seemed to have forgetten that a mere 20 years ago, there was also election meddling, which opened the door to a Bush administration, far worse than Trump has ever been in the past four years, yet somehow Mr G W Bush gets a fee pass “All is forgiven, now show us another one of your paintings”.
            The US greatest asset are its people, and NOT its politicians, and Americans need to realise they can have better and deserve it.
            The lobbying and money from pharmaceutical companies for example for a start make any ” democracy” a farce.
            I can’t stand the orange turd and am happy to see him go not least because of the role model in behavior towards wemon but it doesn’t blind me to believing the other shower are saints. The apple is rotten.

          3. millie

            Brilliant comment, J. You’re on fire this morning. Both with this and the cervical check comments you make below.

            I love it when you get all passionate and outspoken.

          4. Clampers Outside

            +1 Millie, and not just today. Janet’s made great comments of late. It’s like J’s been hiding these insightful gems and only recently letting it all out :)

          5. SOQ

            Fox news reports that the election software system in Michigan that switched 6,000 votes from Trump to Biden is called “Dominion.” It is used in 30 states including: Nevada, Arizona, Minnesota, Michigan, Wisconsin, Georgia and Pennsylvania- all listed being swing states.

            Was this a glitch meaning a coding error or was it a hack? A security breech is an even worse scenario. Either way, there is a very strong argument for an audit of Michigan and if the software is found to be defective, all other states that use it.

          6. deluded

            https://nonprofitquarterly.org/the-case-of-the-300000-missing-mail-ballots/
            If we take it that a lot of Biden supporters heeded advice and mailed their ballots then I think it’s clear that there is some interference going on.
            More worryingly, I know from my own family that people have no end of excuses to vote for Trump and to say so… to stick to the one or two issues a Republican will “deliver”. How then are the pollsters getting private response tallies so wrong?

          7. SOQ

            @ Janet- I agree with you about Trump- he is a business man not a politician and in my experience such types never sugar coat. But, that is also his attraction and he resonates with some of the working class or blue collar vote, which was traditionally Democrat.

            The real problem is he is a cuckoo in not just the Republican nest but the political nest and has confounded all critics to date. Anyone who thinks he is going to go quietly is deluding themselves, especially when so many electoral irregularities may be emerging.

          8. Nigel

            A glitch is not evidence of fraud, just evidence that electronic voting devices are a bad idea, whch is something that people on the Democratic side of the aisle have been saying for ages. Trump’s charges of fraud are being called baseless because he is clearly making them up, just as he makes them up every time he’s involved in any kind of voting. He claimed fraud when he didn’t win an emmy. He claimed fraud when he WON in 2016. He lies and lies and lies. The MSM went easy on him.

          9. Nigel

            ‘Trump is just the latest ugly manifestation of what US politics has progressively become.’

            Some people here (not you) dismiss Trump as a distraction or a symptom, as if people who view him as a unique danger can’t also recognise him as a manifestation or resurgence of an evil strain in US politics. That strain is white nationalism. Openly corrupt, demagogic, reliant on the slaver-state-favouring EC, Jim Crow-lite voter supression in southern states, the demonisation and criminalisation and over-policing of black urban men. How many of Johnny’s beloved weed legalisation measures have seen draconian convictions for non-violent weed crimes being overturned? When pro-Trumpers armed with guns surrounded counting centres you didn’t see the National Guard being called in. Proper electoral reform in the US will be an assault on white supremacy. So will police and health care and educational and immigration reform. So will demilitarisation and non-violent conflict-resolution-driven foreign policy, action on climate change and a restoration and expansion of environmental protections. It’s the whole ball game, and Trump is proof of that.

          10. Nigel

            That’s just.. counting the votes? The way they were going to be counted anyway? It’s just a reiteration of the state procedures they were already following? Obviously if there was farud, it needs to be uncovered and dealt with, but this ain’t it.

            Edit – Oh, I see, what the Republicans WANTED was the count to be stopped altogether, what they got was this. Classy bunch, as usual. Nicely slanted reporting by RT, too! And a link to Michelle Malkin as a source! Oh dear SOQ, your ability to asess modern information flow is deteriorating.

          11. SOQ

            Why should it matter who the link is to? The Supreme Court have issued the order and they clearly think there is reasons to do so- end of.

            Anyways, an underreported story is how well Joe Biden did with senior citizens, particularly those aged in the 125-150 range!

          12. Johnny

            La-decided to award licenses based on your ability to run a business right ………
            Nah they gave then to a bunch of losers from the hoods,x cons and brothers and hustlers and gang bangers -we left and many more companies left la.
            Now I’ve comfy with crooks,cons and dirty cops,I can have a drink and smoke a joint,but forcing me by giving them licenses to become business partners,with me fronting all the cash…not happening.
            Social equity is all bs and theory if you don’t unskill,lack education is the issue and yes opportunity but education, retiring or train these “victims”,some are just dumb asses who got caught now want try run the game…
            I helped found and yes fund a online college that helps upskill, x cons/ losers / minorities / vets – it’s a gateway to jobs within the industry
            We also signed a labor pact agreement and are fully unionized,partners with the local union and were instrumental in bringing them into mass-we are the poster boy and sometimes funded by union retirement funds.
            It’s a little more complicated Nigel like most things in real life.

          13. Nigel

            In this day and age you don’t think sources and platforms matter when it comes to reporting? Surely you’re being disengenuous.

            This order represents an effort to placate Republicans while keeping SCOTUS at arms length from the issue. The order was from Alito, the most conservative judge on the court. If the best they can get from him is a court order for the counting to continue as it was already going, then they’re not going to get much joy out of the court as a whole. It’s just a question of ballots received late, for which there were already procedures in place, and no indication of anything untoward going on. The Republicans got something they can spin as a victory, you can furrow your brow in concern, but it doesn’t mean anything.

          14. Nigel

            Here’s a funnier joke about actual attempted voter fraud, and by funnier, I mean kind of scary and alarming:
            ‘Armed men arrested in Philadelphia were trying to deliver fake ballots
            …Both men were carrying loaded handguns, and police found an AR-type rifle in the Hummer, authorities said at a news conference Friday. About 160 rounds of ammunition were found in the weapons and the vehicle, authorities said.
            Stickers and a hat with logos of the QAnon conspiracy movement were found in the vehicle, Philadelphia District Attorney Larry Krasner said.’
            https://edition.cnn.com/2020/11/07/us/pennsylvania-convention-center-arrests/index.html

            Insert cryptic Qanon slogan from Bodger here.

          15. V aka Frilly Keane

            Same’oh bhoy
            You’re only making a fool of yourself now

            The track record of mail in ballots is firmly established
            From research going back a few decades
            Conducted by ThinkTank Political Science sets up from both sides of the house

            In one of the studies I quoted from (that I provided a link to) puts incidents of fraud in the millionth of a %
            Based on total ballots cast

            Trump’s campaign never saw mail in ballots as an opportunity to canvas and enable the core GoP grassroot vote
            If they’d even bothered to consult their own in house Psephologists he’d had made sure ever registered voter in ‘Merica and overseas would have had a mail in ballot posted to them by August

          16. SOQ

            @ Nigel- same story from CNN- is that better? Are you saying the Supreme Court did not make this ruling? The reason for it is what is interesting- that a challenge is coming to have them binned.

            @V all I did was report a factual story and craic a joke- Jazus.

            As for previous mail in credibility- I am not sure if such can be applied this time around because of scale- 45 million I think was the figure I read- and the heightened level of feelings running on both sides- some fear this will end in civil war for goodness sake.

            And now the data analytics people are asking questions- thousands of votes appearing for Biden without a single one for Trump at times- which is statistically impossible- time will tell.

          17. V aka Frilly Keane

            Same’oh
            I agree that whole bales of ballots
            In the thousands – hundreds of thousands
            all spill out all for Biden doesn’t make sense
            And doesn’t add up given the spilt we’re seeing

            And whether we all like it or not
            The margins have to be tested – either by recounts / courts whatever
            It’s exactly what would happen here
            And our election count Management is the best in the World

            But I’m obliged to tell you, I have seen boxes spill out all Tá
            Or for a particular candidate
            Rare, yes
            And usually shared with spoiled votes

            But if the box was from a particular parish/ street where that candidate is prominent
            Yep. It can happen

            Just saying

          18. Nigel

            SOQ – no, the CNN story is way, way worse.

            I’ve explained why the ruling isn’t what they and you are making it out to be. You keep ignoring what I say. That’s fine, anyone else reading this can make up their own minds. You’re talking about this as if the supression, the efforts at fraud, the efforts to overturn the vote, the militia’s angling for a civil war, aren’t all on one side, when they are. The legal efforts are not to prove fraud, they’re to discredit the election. There’s only one side at fault here. One. End of.

            (Trumpian data analytics have ‘proved’ that his words and tweets are statistically impossible to NOT be coded signals to Qanon followers, so feckin’ spare me your faux naivety.)

          19. Nigel

            Here’s a mail-in voter scandal not getting much attention – Trump’s appointee to the Postal Service has ‘lost’ 30k vote-in ballots and isn’t even looking for them, despite court orders. Bet they won’t be riding that one to the Supreme Court.

            He’s also the guy responsible for so many delayed mail-in ballots arriving late, so I can see why they’re mad that they’re still required to count them when they went to all the trouble of sabotaging their delivery.

          20. f_lawless

            2nd attempt at posting comment. 1st one went into the ether a few hours ago.
            __________
            https://twitter.com/JosBtrigga/status/1324894261654007809

            Clip of former top NSA official turned whistle blower, William Binney:

            “These things that they’re calling ‘glitches in software’ that are randomly changing only certain votes, they’re not glitches at all. Those are programmed into the software. It’s doing exactly what it’s supposed to do…”

          21. Nigel

            Wow so Reoublicans missed a trick when they didn’t include glitches in their voter supression campaign.

        1. Rosette of Sirius

          “There are suspicious partisans across the spectrum who believe widespread election fraud is possible. … But stealing hundreds of thousands of votes would require a conspiracy on the scale of a James Bond movie. That isn’t going to happen”

        2. Charlie

          Trump says he has proof of fraud but he won’t reveal the proof. If he had proof he’d be insane not to reveal it right now. The longer his spoof takes to get through the courts, the less it is likely to make an ounce of difference. He won’t reveal any proof now because he has nothing but desperation.

          1. newsjustin

            Obviously the block chain, watermarked ballots revelation is gonna be revealed in a few days, just you wait and see….that’ll be huuuge.

          2. SOQ

            @ newsjustin- I very much doubt that story is real although I have seen videos of magnifiers used claiming that it is.

            If it is, they would have bounced it by now and besides, all it proves is the ballot papers are, or are not, legit.

        3. George

          Corporate media outlets like Fox News and the New York Post? It’s over, babe. Trump has been claiming fraud since he lost the popular vote in 2016. It is his strategy whenever things don’t go his way and has no relationship to reality.

    1. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

      it’s a bit nuts really, would you let a 70 year old drive you down to Cork ? Employ them to run your company ( say it’s a complicated one that involves lots of travel etc ).
      I’d say the answer is No, yet it’s thought this is the right profile to run America.
      Call me ageist but wait until your day 55 say and on the job market again that’s the logic everywhere but here.

        1. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

          aye,
          wouldn’t it be nice to see a younger ( like in 40’s so mature ) individual, dynamic, attention to detail, innovative, energetic, forward thinking person in the job.

          1. ce

            Just like like David Cameron, Tony Blair, Leo Varadkar, Obama, Trudeau, or Macron etc. I don’t think it’s an age thing as much as, as you say – “forward thinking”… but any PM-type/Head of State figure is limited by their own population to some extent and the population’s ability to have an imagination, and what the population prioritises… so maybe we’re all doomed!

          2. V aka Frilly Keane

            In Fairness
            It’s well established by now
            That the Mná handled their respective Country’s pandemic far better
            Than any of the fellas

            Each of the higher profile ladies each brought something slightly different, like Angela was all about facts and didn’t waiver once she got a grin, whereas Erna was a lot more touchy feely

            But most of the lads used very much the same tactics – fear and power

            Clamps in .3…2…

          3. Clampers Outside

            * Many hours later *

            Did ya want somethin’? The women leaders did a good job compared to the lads, yep, everyone can see that.
            My issues are with the outright misandrist, sexist side of feminism. How many times do I have to tell you that.
            Your other have been great, do carry on.

          4. ce

            Or Arlene Foster/Michelle O’Niell… that’s working out great… might even get Nikki Haley in 2024, careful what you ask for!

            I do think Jacinda Arden is great, she understands the aspiration/abilities of the country she runs and exactly how it’s nudged to do things. She has a lot to work with in terms of a confident and realistic people. However, I think it would be perhaps better to stop waiting for ‘leaders” to come and make everything better, ultimately they are just people like us and they can only lead where people are somewhat willing to go.

      1. Charlie

        I’ve no problem with anyone in their 70s doing a job. However, I believe this election is not about Biden. It’s about the Dems getting Trump out of office. Biden is merely a stepping stone and will be quickly replaced by a much stronger candidate in 4 years time.

        1. italia'90

          eh, hmmm, that, eh, hmmm, this, eh, hmmm….
          Isn’t that the point of running in an election?

          Agree with about the over 70’s though.

          1. Charlie

            Never mind. I think you may have ehh ummm emmmm ahhh hmmm missed my point. Although Pat ‘the echo’ Custard did too. You’re in good company.

          2. italia'90

            I couldn’t resist Charlie.
            Here’s a hawt take for ya…
            Biden wins The White House. Trump loses.
            The Dems lose the Senate elections and the Gop gains seats in Congress.
            In 2022 the Gop flips Congress and holds the Senate.
            Supreme Court is 6 – 3 in favour of Conservatives.
            The Gop, Wall Street, MIC, Big Pharma, Fossil Fuel and Foreclosure Banks have won this election.
            The reasons I’m thinking this are based on the facts that every seat the Dems lost was a “CENTRIST” one. Zero “”PROGRESSIVES”” lost their seats.
            Turn out for Ilhan Omar and Rashida Tlaib probably won Michigan for Biden.
            Moving from the centre right to further right will be disastrous for Dems in 2022 and deliver catastrophic results, but their already planning to do it anyway.
            Now, you have to ask yourself why?

          3. italia'90

            I couldn’t resist Charlie.
            Here’s a hawt take for ya…
            Biden wins The White House. Trump loses.
            The Dems lose the Senate elections and the Gop gains seats in Congress.
            In 2022 the Gop flips Congress and holds the Senate.
            Supreme Court is 6 – 3 in favour of Conservatives.
            The Gop, Wall Street, MIC, Big Pharma, Fossil Fuel and Foreclosure Banks have won this election.
            The reasons I’m thinking this are based on the facts that every seat the Dems lost was a “CENTRIST” one. Zero “”PROGRESSIVES”” lost their seats.
            Turn out for Ilhan Omar and Rashida Tlaib probably won Michigan for Biden.
            Moving from the centre right to further right will be disastrous for Dems in 2022 and deliver catastrophic results, but their already planning to do it anyway.
            Now, you have to ask yourself why?

          4. Nigel

            ITALIA – I couldn’t agree more! Everyone is pushing the Dems right, for all the wrong reasons. If they betray the people who did the groundwork that got them this win then they deserve to burn – but that’s going to leave those people completely voiceless. But Biden only needs to be a little progressive on a range of things to make a ridiculously big difference in America. If he doesn’t treat Republicans as a gang of liars and gangster, he’s a fool.

          5. italia'90

            Nigel, I couldn’t disagree with you more!
            Nobody is pushing Dems further right.
            They pivoted right and tacked further right as an election strategy.
            It has won them the WH but they’ve lost everything else, including
            swathes of progressives and socialist sympathisers.
            A new party is forming and now building for 2022/2024 from the left.
            They loaned their vote to Biden and the Dems for the last time.
            By pivoting right, you can see how the split vote outcome has cost them.
            Soft Republican voters Voted Biden and then Republican down the ticket.
            It must be obvious, even to you?
            You’re ignoring the causes and focusing on the symptoms again, as usual.
            That is how Trump won in 2016.
            There’s worse to come. Dark money learns quickly, unlike the Dems.

  1. Johnny

    PA Biden up + 14,541 (lead has been growing)

    GA Biden up +4,185 (lead has been growing)

    AZ Biden up +39,400 (lead has been shrinking)

    NV Biden up +20,137 (lead has been growing)

    He has run the table.

    1. Johnny

      % Trump needs from outstanding votes/What Trump is getting

      Arizona: 57.8%/53.6%
      Georgia: Too few known votes left to calculate
      Nevada: 57.5%/41.3%
      Pennsylvania: 60.7%/34.8%

  2. AndyD

    Joey B will not last the 4 years, all a big ploy to get Kamalla in the back door, there are clear signs of dementia, I actually think it’s cruel they allowed him to even run, his wife had to remind him he was up against Trump and not George B FFs. She wants to be First Lady more than he wants to be president!!

  3. Micko

    300,000 cancer check delayed.

    Jesus H Christ…

    Mostly BreastCheck and CervicalCheck, but sure that only effects women, not like they’re important or anything.

    So let’s plough on with the madness.

    1. SOQ

      At least the UK, the likes of The Telegraph and Talkradio challenging this madness but who or what do we have here? And it is not just cancer which is going mad- I have heard of three suicides in the past two weeks- 2 under 25- gone, just like that. These zealots with their wildly inaccurate projections and their steadfast refusal to even contemplate the harm they are doing, have blood on their hands.

      But even within the sphere of a single virus- it is the lack of medium or long term planning which bugs me. So they open up the shops in December and what happens then? Everyone rushes out at the one time to get presents and food and drink. OF COURSE the infection rate is going to rise sharply because they have created the perfect conditions for it to do so.

      And then they reactively lock down again for January and February and probably the first half of March- still with no regard for the many many other deaths and suffering which that will cause.

      1. Charger Salmons

        Indeed.
        Where are the Irish journalists holding this government to account and asking them to justify the measures they’re taking ?
        RTE’s George Lee is basically a government mouthpiece for passing on information from behind-closed-doors press conferences where we’re not allowed to see proper cross-examination, even if there is any.
        You’re being taken for fools.
        https://twitter.com/EdConwaySky/status/1324819551335403520

      2. f_lawless

        Graham Neary, poses some questions to Stephen Donnelly via Twitter:

        https://twitter.com/GrahamNeary/status/1325146002421149697

        “Minister, some questions:

        1) Why has the amount of testing reduced since Level 5 began?

        2) Have the parameters of the tests changed since around the time that Level 5 began?

        3) Have you checked whether age-standardised mortality is higher this year, compared to any other year?”

    2. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

      even non covid times it’s been shown cervical cancer isn’t a biggy here

      1. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

        checks every three years for a start, what nonsense, it should be every year starting when you are first sexually active.

          1. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            yes now it has, it has currently started being given to 12 year olds so it will take a few generations to see effect, unfortunately for anyone over 14 now it’s too late, screening and care remains imperative for most of the female population. HPV pretty much everyone has it, including men, there are many different strains, a couple the most dangerous for cervical cancer, it’s not going away anytime soon.

          1. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            Oro in most other countries in Europe you have a smear EVERY year, like all cancers the earlier it’s caught the higher the chance of successful treatment, caught after one year is obviously better than three years left to develop.

          2. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            Cervical cancer is much more common in developing nations than it is in developed nations. Cervical cancer is the 2nd most common cause of cancer death in developing nations, with 84% of all cervical cancer cases occurring in Africa, Latin American and the Caribbean underdeveloped areas. It is fairly rare in the United States. Every year, an estimated 13,170 cases of cervical cancer are diagnosed in the United States. This number is dropping each year. There has been a 75% decrease in incidence and mortality from cervical cancer in developed nations over the past 50 years. Most of this decrease is attributed to the effective institution of cervical cancer screening programs (pap testing and/or HPV testing) in the developed nations. Regular screening, saves lives.
            Apart from cancer once you are sexually active regular smears can pick up a variety of other issues…get tested yearly ladies.

          3. Oro

            NHS recommends every 3years too, and if I’m not mistaken what they’re searching for (as long as you’re not overdue a screening) is precancerous cells, so it’s not more difficult to treat, it’s a removal procedure that wouldn’t differ. While we’re at it, all is not lost post 14yrs old re HPV vaccine, not necessarily at least. In some countries the vaccine is offered to certain demographics up to ages into their 30s and is still accepted to be beneficial (Altho not as much). And of course an STI screening is a better way to detect an sti using a specific test rather than relying on a smear to catch something else.

          4. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            France it’s every year, you have an allowed gyno, as a woman who has experienced health care on both sides I can tell you it’s cursory at best here unless you can afford private.

          5. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            obviously blood tests should be included every 6 months,
            it has taken a woman I know TEN years to get her endometriosis taken seriously here, now it’s stage three and she is in incredibly pain, the scar tissue is extensive, the operation she needs may leave her using a bag for life, I could give you plenty other examples,

          6. Oro

            Apparently the newest Pap smear (not sure if available in Ireland yet) will allow these tests to be completed only once every 5 years. I’m not totally sure what your point about uterine cancer is – are we talking about smears or not? And don’t forget about your swabs for the STIs! The most fun part :)

          7. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            let me spell it out very clearly, a recommendation gyno check up once every three years for any reason is not enough, if you are sexually active and especially if test positive for HPV you need yearly checks to catch anything quickly, and biyearly blood tests,
            they won’t marry you in France without a clear HIV test, it’s perfectly acceptable for a new partner to ask to see your STD paperwork before dropping the jonnies.
            The general sexual health attitudes and female health care in this country is appalling. I’m not giving personal details but I have had something removed that could not have waited three years because I was always on top of my visits.
            A seemingly simple example, do you know that many wemon live with the discomfort and stigma of BV thinking it’s normal because they never go near a gyno until they are pregnant, a condition that is often a signal for other issues. Are you a gyno ? I’m going to stick with my french one, he’s actually as it happens the doctor who discovered links between HPV and cervical cancer , and he would tear me a new one ( as would any french gyno) if I missed a yearly checkup, I’ll listen to the expert.

          8. Oro

            Oh – you initially mentioned cervical cancer and then followed up saying ‘checks for this’ so I presumed you meant smears (checks for this being cervical cancer) and not general gyno checkups because there wasn’t a distinction drawn. Yes different things require different check up spacings, and appropriate tests for the appropriate screenings. Just to clarify your earlier comment was incorrect about most countries in Europe having yearly smears. And smears should not be a catch all for STIs. Fewer things that bother me more than misinformation regarding sexual health. I think an important thing to remember with any Public Health Service is that funds should not be wasted with over-testing where it’s not required, resources are thin enough as it is. The HPV vaccine (as long as it’s widely performed) will save huge resources that can be used elsewhere (hopefully in women’s health) and will also save countless lives. An amazing public health development. Also beneficial for the men (and women ofc) for head and neck cancers.

          9. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            you are correct I did make an assumption that the rest of Europe was on par with France where,
            yearly tests check for irregular cells in the cervix, this is not a waste of resources,
            I don’t see why anyone would think it is.
            Have you ever had irregular cells, would you be happy to wait three years for your next test ?
            My doctor is one of the most renowned in this field in France. I’ll still take his advice over some random person on the internet.
            Let me introduce you talking about his work with cervical cancer in this interview https://www.revuegenesis.fr/interview-du-dr-joseph-monsonego-25-annees-de-recherche-sur-lhpv-les-maladies-induites-desormais-evitables/

          10. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            I also amended that yes of course additional blood tests are necessary to catch a range of STD diagnoses, stipulating twice a year.
            What exactly is your problem with people getting the right care.

          11. Oro

            I don’t need to know who your doctor is. He didn’t discover the link between HPV and cervical cancer which is what you claimed, I was only disputing that. Suggesting that public health tests be offered at a artificially accelerated interval is a waste of resources. We all have irregular cells, if they’re being monitored at a safe rate then that is how it should be. 3 years regularly is safe, sorry if you feel differently but that doesn’t make you correct. And this isn’t me saying so it’s medical advice. Most of what you’ve said today has been at least partially incorrect, which is irresponsible.

          12. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            I’ll let my know the doctor above that you know better than him after 25 years of research and explains here how he came to the idea of a vaccine that all the treatment he has given me is wrong…
            D’où l’idée d’une prévention par un vaccin ?
            Les HPV à risque, lorsqu’ils persistent, ont un potentiel de transformation des cellules. La zone de transformation du col, site vulnérable à l’exposition aux virus, va subir des modifications objectivables en colposcopie. La lésion peut alors être détruite ou retirée selon une procédure précise. Ma réflexion m’avait conduit à penser qu’un virus initiant une pathologie précancéreuse et cancéreuse devait pouvoir être neutralisé si un vaccin préventif pouvait agir au moins sur les virus les plus fréquents et les plus à risque.

          13. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            There is bugger all irresponsible about urging people to get regularly checked you absolute tool, the leading doctor in his field in France agrees with me.
            I’m done here.

          14. Oro

            People should be regularly checked. At the proper intervals. What’s irresponsible is your misinformation. Off to mumsnet with you. Nobody will fact check you there :)

          15. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            Dans les années à venir, le test HPV sera de plus en plus utilisé et nous permettra de sélectionner deux types de femmes : celles qui ne seront pas positives au HPV chez lesquelles on pourra espacer les frottis et celles qui seront positives au HPV qui seront suivies plus régulièrement”.

            Non active sexually / negative testing for HPV yes three years would be fine, but that’s not really the case for most wemon, you really need a HPV test to determine how often you can get away with being tested.
            Keep in mind HPV is very common, although not every strain puts you at the same risk. This is possibly why you get checked more often in France as they check for HPV more often. Maybe I have just been lucky to have an excellent gyno specialized in the field and the vacine.

            By the way you won’t find me in Mumsnet or group whatssapp either, sorry to disappoint.
            :)

          16. Oro

            Also I think your doc might be fibbing you, a (now 84yr old) German virologist discovered the link between HOV and cervical cancer. Won a Nobel prize along the way.

          17. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            I can garantee you it’s yearly in France , my midwife is Italian, she told me straight not to expect the same level of care I was used to and I’m not going public

          18. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            another reason you would want to avoid cancer cell removal or lettz procedure furtber down the line is because it puts you at risk to carry a baby to term, it weakens the cervix, they put in stitches and hope for the best, prevention. is better than a cure, as is minor procedure better than more complicated, removal of non benign polyps etc,
            I don’t know every countries practice, I can tell you on behalf of myself and female friends here gyno care is crap , really crap unless you go private.

          19. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

            Do you what would be nice to hear, let’s get BEST care for a reproductive system we all pass through and causes every woman we know hassle and pain at some stage of her life. Let’s make it accessible, specialised and reliable.

    3. V aka Frilly Keane

      The hardest part to swallow here is that all those cancelled / delayed appointments
      In fact all our screening programmes
      Should have immediately transferred over to the Private Hospitals
      Who have those setup’s

      Same for all the surgical wait lists, and early care/ pediatric lists

      The National Treatment Purchase Fund (NTPF) crowd should have negotiated and managed it
      And supervised it

      Probably not enough gravy and jobs for the boys there
      Don’t be surprised if they create a new Quango to do exactly that
      Something for Paul Reid and a few disappointed FF+FG bhoyos to be hived off to

      1. Micko

        Sad but true V. :(

        It’s not like those private hospitals were sitting around doing nothing

        Oh wait…

        1. V aka Frilly Keane

          Or that the NTPF have skills and experience of negotiating with private providers either
          In my experience, they’re actually very good at it
          They secure treatments cheaper than it costs the HSE to provide, when it all comes through in the wash of the respective casemix returns

          In addition to dealing with these providers day by day – for years so know exactly how much they should only be expected to pay
          They are also subject to several arms of oversight

          But shur’
          Tis what it is
          The boys needed announcements to spin
          And there were some post election favours to be bailed out

  4. GiggidyGoo

    Vote of no confidence in the confidence trickster on tuesday. More pressure on FF and the Greens. Probably more revelations about the big V. In between we will hear the whataboutery …. SF this, SF that…..Bruton already out of the traps. ROFL.
    This will run and run, until Varadkar grows a pair and does the right thing. Same for Michilín.

  5. Bertie Blenkinsop

    Re: The Star campaign.

    My neighbour has his Christmas decorations up since November 1st. I don’t think he’s terminally ill….

        1. Clampers Outside

          I have a new neighbour… Full garden of Christmas lights, reindeer, trees, Santa, the lot… And a little sign on the lawn that read “Liverpool fans live here”… which I imagine from the worn look of it is a permanent fixture :0)

  6. Gabby

    Ballina and surroundiing townlands are now being called Biden Country.
    Welcome to Biden Country will be the signposts and banners.
    It is interesting that they are not calling it Robinson Country.
    Whatever happened to the reputation of Mary Burke?

  7. George

    The Echo needs to hire a headline writer who is familiar with the English language. “Ripped off of €330k”.

  8. Johnny

    Meadows was in/out the hospital room,day after this epic loss goes into quarantine….
    America wants move on,he will be remembered not just as a loser,but a sore loser.
    There simply is no evidence,none.
    The Dems are on target raise 200 million in next few days for Ga senate races,R.s are a mess.
    There is no legal route left,just rhetoric and cheap stunts.
    Murdoch and Fox has moved on,time for the Trump organized crime family to hire some criminal defense attorneys,

    https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020/11/donald-trump-presidency-election-week.html

  9. V aka Frilly Keane

    Seeing as you’re all here today, a little Fográ

    I’m hoping to get a special Bake’Sheet up this week

    Partly inspired by this year’s S11 btw, Bake Off

    As I’m a Collaborator and Co-operator by nature
    I’m going to be calling all the home’Sheet Bakers
    the out and proud Bakers
    and still in the kitchen cupboards Bakers to come into the mixing bowl

    And if anyone knows where our old pal Martco is these days
    Could ye give him a nudge

    Ta, V

        1. Janet, dreams of a steamed clootie

          it was very moist, I was worried I couldn’t get dimples in enough to put extra olive oil on, but came out so light it was the right way to go

          1. ce

            Time to see what odds we’ll get on the following –

            What country will Biden drop a drone strike on first

            And for a double…

            What country will Harris drop a drone strike on first after Biden steps down in around year 2

          2. Nigel

            Me? I’ve been waiting to you you guys say a single word about Trump’s drone strikes and bombing campaigns. Maybe complain about the reduced oversight and reporting. Whenever I brought it up it was roundly ignored. Not a single solitary word until, I think E’Matty conceded they might be bad yesterday, when it was clear Trump had lost. So, yeah, now you’ve been silent for four years, you can get back to criticising them. Go for it.

          3. SOQ

            Are you Irish Nigel or do you even live in Ireland?

            Genuine question as your comments appear to be coming from elsewhere.

          4. bisted

            …well Obamas bombs weren’t falling on me or you so I wasn’t counting…nor was I counting how many bombs or drone strikes that Trump ordered…but they fell on children in 8 different countries during the Obama years…and he had just picked up a Nobel peace prize…Trump didn’t start any new wars…a lot more people are alive after today that would certainly be dead under crooked Hillary…but sure hey, lets open a new plaza…

          5. ReproBertie

            The 237,000+ US Covid dead might disagree with you there

            Trump bombed people but he was only continuing and increasing the wars other people started so that’s fine?

          6. Nigel

            Blisted – yeah, Obama’s drones bad, Trump’s drones irrelevant. Guess the 230,000 really dead of Corona don’t count against your imaginary Hilarycount. Think it must be racism and sexism, tbh.

          7. bisted

            …Nigel…you whinged for four years solid after crooked Hillary snatched defeat from the wide open jaws of victory…the only upside that I can see from a Bidon victory is that you’ll be quiet for a while…after the gloating, that is…

          8. Nigel

            Yeah, tired of your utter nonsense, condemning Obama’s drone strikes and bombings (rightly) completely ignoring trump’s. You’re done.

          9. SOQ

            Are you Irish Nigel?

            Your view of left / right wing politics is a bit Ballsbridge which is why I am asking.

          10. bisted

            …hopefully, you’re done as well…a ceasefire…we’re even…didn’t know Trump had gotten a Nobel peace prize as well…but then, I’m on the other side looking in at Uncle Sam…

          11. Nigel

            SOQ – no idea what that means. Might have driven through Ballsbridge a few times at best.
            Blisted – whatever. Maybe research trump’s droning and bombings for a while.

          12. SOQ

            Thanks- you appear to be somewhat USA on the left / right scale is all.

            Biden being more right wing than FFG here in Ireland of course- great facial surgery mind.

          13. Nigel

            And your reactionary weirdness is pure centrist JAQing off fed by rightwing disinformation. My fervent support is now with the activists pushing Biden leftward. I hope we here in Ireland can learn from their example.

      1. Nigel

        Sorry, your prediction that Hilary Clinton would replace Biden at the last minute didn’t pan out.

  10. Nigel

    Just as Trump’s lawyers are giving an important press conference at a landscaping business next to an adult book sttore in a business park on the outskirts of Philadelphia I am not making this up.

    1. Daisy Chainsaw

      What concession speech? The Tangerine Toddler won’t concede and will be forcibly evicted from the white house on 21 January.

        1. Nigel

          His concession speech is… a statement saying he doesn’t accept that Biden has won. I expect this will set the tone for the transition.

    1. Rosette of Sirius

      Fox also called Nevada and have him on 290. 306 possible and 7m in the popular vote is the ultimate pfo for Trump.

  11. f_lawless

    Footage of a massive anti-lockdown protest currently underway in Leipzig, Germany. British journalist, Peter Hitchens, writes:

    “Once again, fascinating that former East Germany, all too familiar with a self-righteous repressive regime, is much less willing to accept this sort of thing than the long-pampered west.”

    “https://twitter.com/ClarkeMicah/status/1325099603281256448

    I was dismayed listening to the Taoiseach yesterday on the 6 o’clock news as he said the apparent reduction of cases during the current level 5 restrictions meant that we should have “a good stretch” of lower level restrictions in the upcoming lead up to Christmas. The implication being that he views the future easing of restrictions as only temporary then it’s back to more of the same.

    With governments across the board now seemingly acting in lockstep to impose these new sets of overblown, draconian restrictions on citizens, I think it’s getting increasingly apparent that our elected leaders are either acting in acquiescence and/or being put under duress by this cohort of unelected transnational financial elites who, under the pretext of the pandemic, are now openly pushing their plans to radically transform societies according to their own vested interests.

    They don’t plan to let us return to normality, or should I say ‘normality’, until the transformational apparatus is properly in place. I think we need to take a leaf out of the Leipzigers’ book and start making it clear that enough is enough!

    1. Nigel

      ‘this cohort of unelected transnational financial elites who, under the pretext of the pandemic, are now openly pushing their plans to radically transform societies according to their own vested interests.’

      It’s like a set of Protocols of some sort of Group of Old Guys.

      1. f_lawless

        2nd attempt to post comment..
        ————
        Go back to sleep Nigel.

        I think I’ve a pretty good track record in recent years of correctly calling out some major western propaganda campaigns as they were unfolding. eg:-

        Russiagate – my take: fabricated narrative
        Assange rape allegations – my take: part of an orchestrated smear campaign
        Syrian White Helmets – my take:western propaganda construct
        Chemical Attack in Douma, Syria – my take: staged by Islamist rebels
        Skripal chemical attack – my take: fabricated narrative
        Venezuelan self declared president, Juan Guaido backed by US & EU- my take: lacks legitimacy among Venezuelan public
        Claims of voter fraud by Morales in Bolivia elections – my take: no evidence of fraud, US-backed coup taking place
        Antisemitism allegations against Corbyn – my take: part of an orchestrated campaign to ensure a Corbyn-led Labour party doesn’t win the UK general election

        On the other hand, as I seem to recall, you’ve a bit of a tendency to reflexively go along with whatever the dodgy establishment media narrative might be at the time

          1. italia'90

            Pathetic!!!
            That is even worse than the corporate CNN, NBC, Democrat party imperialist answer
            I imagined you were going to reply with.
            You have amplified almost everything opposite to what f_lawless has mentioned above on here.
            Can you not defend your positions or concede like an adult?
            How very Trumpian of you.
            Again, that was,
            PATHETIC.

          2. Nigel

            6 outof 7 topics I have made no comment on whatsoever. The idea that the Russiagate thing was fabricated is so colossaly stupid I can’t even. Doesn’t bode well for the rest.

          3. italia'90

            You and I have argued over 4 of the first 6 topics mentioned.
            Facts Nigel, stick to the facts. Not just the narrative you like that is pushed by US MSM.
            As far as I can see, you are a Neo-McCarthyist, Russophobe
            and Empire Toady/Tanky.

            As an author, you deeply disappoint me because you understand
            how narrative utility is used and Russiagate and Russophobia are always used
            to deflect from American imperialism and empire expansion to smear any and all opposition to wars in the Middle East.
            Just like you have been doing on here for over 4 years – And you’re still not finished by the looks of it.
            You might try reading Hersch, Hedges, Pilger, Fisk or Johnathon Cooke when you get back to the library.
            Throw in some Michael Parenti for good measure.

          4. Nigel

            No, as I recall, you brought up three of four of those in your responses to me – I prefer to avoid expressing opinions on them precisely because the competing efforts to drive the ‘narratives’ sow confusion, making definitive statements difficult if not impossible. It also makes me mistrust commenters whose approach is purely that of championing preferred ‘narratives.’ I know enough about narrative to understand that outside of immediate reportage, they’re a very limited tool for understanding world events.

        1. Brother Barnabas

          in fairness, f_lawless, you also dismissed the amazon rainforest fires as a load of nonsense

          1. f_lawless

            I had look back to check what you’re going on about.

            Reality check: I didn’t.
            https://www.broadsheet.ie/2019/08/23/de-saturday-papers-326/#comment-2123916

            I raised the point that the narrative going around at that time that the Amazon fires were burning at an unprecedented rate may not be accurate, not that fires weren’t occurring, nor that we shouldn’t be concerned, nor that the fires were “a load of nonsense” as you put it. You responded with an ad hominem. I then linked to and quoted from an NYT article:

            “The decade before that included several years in which the number of fires identified during the first eight months was far higher.”

            but you didn’t respond

          2. Brother Barnabas

            because f-lawless, the subtle intro is your m.o. – you also started back in march with the nonchalant ‘just asking questions’ shoulder-shrug angle. you werent just asking questions at all, though- you were subtly building up to your ‘great reset’ inanity.

  12. Brother Barnabas

    hopefully now we can put all that US election stuff to one side and get back to the Great Reset

      1. Daisy Chainsaw

        He’s plotting to bring down all the paedophiles with JFK Jnr on January 19th and then people will take to the streets to demand that Trump remain in office for 4 more years and Joe Biden will be so impressed he’ll abdicate and give Trump back the football.

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