Cassidy & Jaber

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cassidy and jaber(State Pathologist Dr. Marie Cassidy and Dr. Khalid Jaber)

When they met it was moyder.

Sunday Times Crime Correspondent John Mooney spoke to Seán O’Rourke this morning about Deputy State Pathologist Dr Khalid Jaber tendering his resignation at the weekend.

If follows Dr Jaber’s claims made in letters to the DPP and the Royal College of Physicians in Ireland that State Pathologist Marie Cassidy isn’t qualified to hold her title.

In the letters Dr Jaber claimed Dr Cassidy doesn’t have certification in forensic pathology. The Department of Justice is standing by Dr Cassidy.

During the interview, Mr Mooney also mentioned that Dr Cassidy and Dr Jaber fell out over one specific homicide.

John Mooney: “[Dr Jaber] said this [certification] is highly relevant for anyone working in the field. Now it should be stated that the Department of Justice and, particular, Alan Shatter have stood squarely behind Dr Cassidy. They have said that there’s no issue concerning her qualifications or anything like that. And that that’s where the situation is. He appears to have been brought into the Department of Justice on Friday concerning these letters that he’s written. But Seán, you can imagine, there’s all sorts of legal issues arising out of these, in so far as he’s now made representations I suppose to the DPP, there’s issues of disclosures, disclosures about that type of representation, should it be linked to any sort of ongoing cases that he’s involved in. And it also I suppose would provide a certain defence teams perhaps with ammunition, should they wish to question cause of death in a case or something like that. But he attended the meeting with [Department of Justice secretary general] Brian Purcell on Friday and he said he tendered his resignation, denied emphatically to me that he’d been asked to resign or had been dismissed.”

Sean O’Rourke: “So he has resigned? The offer of resignation has been accepted with immediate effect is that right?”

Mooney: “Absolutely, he said he wasn’t pushed though, it was his decision and he took it for professional reasons, as opposed to personal ones.”

O’Rourke: “What about cases where the cases haven’t reached court but he’s the pathologist who carried out the post mortem. Is he, or would he still be available to give evidence in those cases?”

Mooney: “Well Seán, we received, I suppose what could be described as a very strange statement off the Department of Justice on Saturday. They stated that they had made arrangements with Marie Cassidy to arrange for a second pathologist, to give any evidence in cases where Dr Jaber would be unavailable. Now that is all very well and good but there have been cases came before the courts where you’ve had this sort of issue arise where two pathologists or pathologists have had to give evidence on the basis of notes, etc., drafted by another pathologist, and that has ended in, how would I say, the failure of prosecution that matters like that in the past. So this really does remain to be played out yet. Pathology is a very specialist form of medicine. And I would imagine, and certainly the senior counsel that I’ve spoken to or involved in this or people in charge of serious crimes, would say that they would intend to raise this matter certainly to poke holes in any prosecution, certainly in any case that he’s maybe had disagreements with Marie Cassidy on cause of death or something like that. It’s hard to imagine a situation where that will not become an issue at some point in future cases. Although it should be stated that the Department of Justice are saying that they don’t believe there will be any issue. From the guards point of view and the DPP’s point of view, they’ve stated without hesitation that they will issue a witness summons on Dr Jaber to ensure that he does attend any forthcoming trials.”

O’Rourke: “That pre-supposes that he will be in this jurisdiction to give such evidence as to be required.”

Mooney: “Absolutely, as you can imagine, there are all sorts of scenarios that could play out here. It’s hard to imagine that Dr Jaber will remain in Ireland. He’s a Saudi-born pathologist, he has previously applied for jobs in foreign countries and, although he didn’t say it to me, I would imagine that he will contend to leave the State.”

O’Rourke: “How vulnerable might prosecutions be in the cases involving Dr Cassidy, the chief State pathologist, if he now has raised questions about her lack of this certificate of forensic pathology, even though the position doesn’t require it, could there be scope there for defence lawyers?”

Mooney: “I think possibly so but I do think it depends of the type of case. For example, if cause of death is by gunshot or from some sort of crime, involving say firearms, it’s quite clearly a criminal act. Where you may have some sort of defence team, making much of this issue is where the cause of death isn’t quite clear and possibly that they could bring in an expert witness or a pathologist who appears in court on behalf of defence teams to give a different opinion, possibly someone who may hold, the certificate in forensic pathology and that could certainly dint or poke a hole in any prosecution case. But the other matter, Seán, is that it’s very clear that Dr Jaber has had serious disagreements with Dr Cassidy about cause of death in specifically one homicide case. I find it almost impossible to believe that that issue is not going to raise its head in a future trial. I think it would be almost negligent of a defence team not to sort of go for full disclosure on these matters and sort of highlight differences in opinion and, as you and I both know, trials have collapsed for much less important issues.”

Ex-deputy State pathologist will continue to give evidence (Irish Times)

Pic: Merrion St

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