Direct Action

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Campaigners calling for the end of the direct provision system outside the Dáil this afternoon

Universal Children’s Day?

Pcs via Sam Boal/Photocall ireland, Jane Mahony and Grace McDermott

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The Direct Provision protest moves from Leinster House at the Department of Foreign Affairs.

Pic via Sam Boal/Photocall ireland and Doras Luimini

60 thoughts on “Direct Action

  1. Padi

    Hang on, what a load of spoof….€9.60 a week!? What about food and board?

    They or their parents have supposedly fled life threatening scenarios in their home country, the Irish people are taking them in, feeding them and providing shelter plus very modest amounts of cash all of which I suggest is at or above the standard of living in their home country but with the added benefit of their life not being in danger (the reason they are seeking asylum). The Irish people then seek to validate the bona fides of their asylum claim. The only people who are long term in DP are those who have already had asylum claims rejected and are seeking an appeal or multiple appeals. All seems entirely reasonable to me.

    1. Am I Still on this Island.

      Some of those people have been waiting ten years. Fundamental rule of justice: decisions should be made in reasonable time.

      1. Norbet Cooper

        Is the constant re appealing of the Depts decision on case refusals not part of the problem why people are remaining in the system for up to ten years.

          1. Sidewinder

            Have you seen some of the judgements that have come out of some levels of appeal? One appeals board deemed that a previous appeal had been rejected simply because they didn’t like the guy. Literally like, they didn’t examine any of the evidence he had presented, and still rejected the appeal. I agree seven is ridiculous but until we have fewer reliable ones I say appeal away.

            On top of which whether or not the number of appeals is too high, it’s not their fault there is such a number and it’s their right to go through all stages of appeal that the state makes available.

      2. AliG

        Most of them passed through safe EU countries to get here and then drag out the appeals process to become embedded in our community. We need a quicker system with less appeals.

    2. McMuffin

      Entirely reasonable? Good luck paying for school books, shoes, clothes, transport or any sort of social activity for €9.60 a week. Just because someone’s an Asylum Seeker doesn’t mean they’re not a person who needs social, physical and mental stimulation. Should they just sit in a direct provision center all day staring at the walls? How long do you reckon you’d last yourself before you’d get seriously depressed? Nobody deserves that sort of a life, so wise up and quit talking through your arse.

      1. Padi

        No need to be rude. The fact is we cannot simply open up to any and all economic migrants. I’m not heartless but just being brutally realistic. You cannot rule by emotion on this one, by shirking tough decisions in the past the system has encouraged more people to come and now look where we are.

        I’ve said before on this topic, I am more than happy for my taxes to go to support an efficient system that would allow the genuine cases to be looked after. I am also more than happy with economic migrants but on the proviso they can support themselves and/or the country needs their skills or labour. If so, welcome in.

          1. Padi

            I am not sure nonsense can be hyperbolic by its very nature of being nonsense : )

            But your point is taken thanks for the link, have the numbers of long term in DP risen? I would assume yes given this matter is coming to a head but again am open to correction is you have data.

            Can we all agree on one thing that people shouldn’t be in the system for 10 years!? Maybe we start there and work on next steps.

          2. Clampers Outside!

            Even nonsense can be deliberately exaggerated :)

            Yes, we agree the time is too long.

            Some next steps:
            – There are 7 levels of appeal in the asylum process, I think that number of appeals should be reduced. How, I don’t know, but if a person can only appeal 3 or 4 times, that’ll reduce waiting time by nearly half.
            – Equip the persons in the appeals process properly. That’ll further reduce times.
            – An amnesty for anyone in the system beyond two years (that one ill cause some upset)
            – The whole deportation bit is hard even for new arrivals…. there is something in the law that says if a person arrives here and claims status as refugee, we are legally bound to investigate and cannot send them back to where they came from. The other problem there too is that, most of these flights are not direct from the country of origin and…. it goes on….

            That last one is a real quagmire…..

    3. Owen

      To me it seems like Padi is right, AND they get free education. Kinda seems like to get more they should be working. Granted, I’m really not very well read on the issue, and this is the least likely place that will improve.

        1. ollie

          Neither are you mcmuffin.
          19.10 per adult, 9.6 per child.
          meals, heat light laundry tv no charge.
          I don’t have 19.6 a week left after my bills are paid.

      1. All the good ones fly south for winter

        Not well read on the issue, come on in you’re just what the internet needs!

        1. Padi

          As an Irish citizen I do not expect to land in any country in the world and just expect to be allowed to work.

          1. McMuffin

            Well the millions of Irish who have emigrated over the past couple of hundred years might have issue with that Padi…

      2. MUlch

        Education hasn’t been free in this country for a long time. Try schoolbooks, uniforms and ‘contributions’ that are asked of by every household.
        If you’re looking for and education on this issue, don’t immediately buy into Padi’s extremely narrow -minded view. Do some research.

        Citizens get annoyed because the people in DP are ‘living off our welfare system’ and they think they are getting a ‘free ride’. The very fact that they want citizenship to get off this system and work shows you how stupid the opposition’s point is. Not to mention the fact they have been waiting for this for up to ten years shows you what they have to endure to get it.

        1. Padi

          Does the fact that they have been waiting so long not prove that they have not been able to validate their asylum claim? Let’s call this what it is, economic migrants. And I’ve no issue with that, fair play to them I say, you can’t but be impressed by people who leave their homeland behind to seek better opportunities for themselves and their family. However, we simply cannot have open borders. We should have a smart efficient system that quickly processes those who can show their bona fides and good standing and willingness to work.

    4. Clampers Outside!

      “all of which I suggest is at or above the standard of living in their home country”

      I am sick to the teeth of that argument.

      Which basically says….
      If they are not in squalor or being persecuted, threatened, raped, shot at or whatever hell some of these come from it is OK to have them live in an unsuitable place under unsuitable conditions which were built for temporary accommodation, so long as it is in some small way better than what they left behind.

      The pig ignorance of that stance is astounding !

      Whether you like it or not, they’re here, and how we treat them is on us. If you want to treat people like dogs, you go ahead, I won’t.

      1. Padi

        Should we travel the world and invite in everyone who has a lower standard of living than us? You know probably about 4/5 billion people. Or do we take in our fair share of genuine asylum seekers and economic migrants which we can support? Then look to support developing nations in better supporting their people and become self sufficient.

        I appreciate you might not like my view but at some point you have to look at the reality of the situation.

        1. Clampers Outside!

          Exhibit A: ‘The Strawman’

          If ever anyone wanted an example of what a strawman arguement is, read the question in the first line of Padi’s comment above. It doesn’t get any clearer than that.

          *opens fly, pisses on strawman* …job done !

          1. Padi

            I would have called it being a smart ass myself but whatever floats your boat. I’ll leave the personal insults to yourself.

        2. Sidewinder

          Do we take in our fair share of refugees? Absolutely not. Nowhere feckin near it. Only 8.6% of asylum applications are accepted here compared with an EU average of 25.2%.

  2. Jock

    Since we’re doing false dichotomies, here’s mine.

    If you’re against Direct Provision then you support a ban on all legal appeals.

    1. herselfthere

      Then do what the rest of us do. Get organised and fundraiser. You should be able to get one for about 90 euro.

  3. Dubloony

    No-one should be left in the system for 10 years.
    It should be fair, transparent, just, humane and if you don’t meet the criteria of being a genuine refugee, you should be deported.

      1. Clampers Outside!

        That’s not what you have been saying.

        I will agree that both of us do view the system as fupped, and that we both agree no one should be in the system for that long…. but your points above go way beyond that.

      2. Sidewinder

        No, you’re a pig for saying someone should have to live in DP while waiting years for that and that they should be grateful for it.

  4. AliG

    I can’t understand why so many people stay in DP rather than returning to the first EU country they entered and applying for asylum there as per the regulations.

        1. Sidewinder

          Flights to two possible countries of origin, both costing over the weekly allowance, both allowing you to carry all you have in the world in one carry on bag and a handbag. Really, what are they complaining about?

  5. PG

    Nice prams. Shame i couldnt afford to buy ones like those for my children.

    OH sorry. they are free along with everything else from school books to fast tracked medical cards. Wish i could get the government to feed, house and give me every want. Maybe then if i had everything i wanted i would find something else to protest and complain about.

    1. McMuffin

      They’re not wants, they’re needs, and very basic ones at that. If they had ‘every want’ they probably wouldn’t be living in a direct provision center would they?

    2. Sidewinder

      Yeah, we should all be able to live like children. Not allowed to have visitors, barely any money for travel, to be told what we’ll eat and when. To be told we can’t work. Sounds like a fuuping paradise*

      If you’re a lazy, apathetic arsehole.

  6. Mimo79

    nobody is suggesting to just open the borders and let all and asunder in…what needs looking at is those who are currently here suffering in an unjust an unfair system…it supposed to be temporary…10years is not temporary…The system is flawed and needs to be rethought…locking people up for 10 years is hardly the answer..do they deserve that? told what time to eat what to eat and refused the basic right to even cook their own food…I could continue as it is endless once you really start to look beneath the lines.It basically is a money making machine… All these centres(institutions) are privately run…these people are not allowed to work, not allowed to go to school….and are kept on an appeal process that has no end…picture a mother with an 8 year old daughter fleeing to make a better life here to find herself locked in a system for 10 years with hope turning to despair…that child has now gone through school being stigmatised as a hostel child and having no memory of family time or even knowing how her mothers cooking tastes like…this child sits leaving cert and does amazingly well and then….shes not allowed to go on to further education…shes not allowed to work…locked in the same system that has destroyed her mother and will now mentally destroy whats left of her….tell me is that fair????? I could type injustice after injustice but all i want is you people to open your eyes and see how the system is failing these people.they are human beings and deserve to be treated as such……

  7. Joseph olowei

    These people in DP are rejected asylum seekers going through an endless appeals process…. appeals to the high courts can take more than three years… There are from non-typical countries such as Nigeria and Zimbabwe (very different to most EC countries) with no traditional colonial or travel ties to Ireland…Most transited through other countries including the UK….There is currently no deportation in Ireland , so its all about wait and see…..they are economic migrants not refugees as with the 60 Syrians who were arrived and were granted official refugee status in October..

    1. Joseph olowei

      I am sorry but it is time to be honest, rights and protection should be given to those who really deserve it or we will descend into anarchy and chaos. Ireland will end up with its own version of UKIP with social and racial problems and hard working accepted asylum seekers will be the victims… A country cannot be run without laws and regulations……. The Irish government should also be honest about the illegal Irish in America, they also broke the law, there should be no special treatment ….

  8. e no mean

    Most of d comments here are rubbish, I expect you to know about what you comment on…….for God sake

  9. martia

    Living for ‘free’ as some would say isnt fun at all after a year plus and not being in control of your life is worse than capital punishment. No one wants to live without being able to contribute to any society and just sponge off tax payers money. That is not a fair thing to say. Given a chance asylum seekers can contribute meaningfully towards Ireland economy. To those who think its all rosy living in DP, you try it for just a week. Rather close those borders totally and not accept asylum seekers than make people live hopeless lives in limbo. #NOTFAIR

  10. Sinabhfuil

    I wonder is part of the problem here that none of these people are known to us? If it were little Mani or Padi or Clampers, and we knew that her father was a skilled carpenter who could work well if he got the chance, if we knew that Celia’s mother was a programmer or a chef who wanted to work, that her eldest daughter speaks four languages fluently… then we might see them as other people, and think quietly about their lives and how they could be integrated into ours.
    I also wonder if a lot of the fears people have come from the idea that there’s a raging flood of the hungry and different trying to get into Ireland and drag us down into their poverty. Sometimes helping people can help us; look at the good effect on England and the English economy in the 1950s and 1960s and onwards, for instance, of the many refugees that immigrated there from eastern Europe, the Indian subcontinent and the Caribbean after the last World War.

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