Cigarettes And Alcohol

27 thoughts on “Cigarettes And Alcohol”

1. bisted February 20, 2015 at 11:58 am

   …in fairness, few people have as much experience in the alcohol or tobacco businesses as Fergus.
2. Vote Rep #1 February 20, 2015 at 12:01 pm

   What do they mean ‘works with’? Does IrishRoleModels work with Goddard Global or Diagio? Is this a case of guilty by association?
   1. Bobby February 20, 2015 at 12:10 pm

      It’s a conflict of interest. How can a group lobby for and against something?
      1. Vote Rep #1 February 20, 2015 at 12:22 pm

         Tbh, I don’t quite know why they are working with Goddard Global in the first place which was my real query – are they working with Goddard Global or are Diagio?
         1. Michael February 20, 2015 at 12:26 pm

            Irishrolemodels = Diageo. It isn’t a separate entity. The head of Diageo Ireland is on the board.
      2. Clampers Outside! February 20, 2015 at 12:25 pm

         This is a job for….

         *den-den-den-aaaaaa*

         The Comms Clinic

         * hits play on cassette player… theme to ‘Minder’ *
         1. Fat Frog February 20, 2015 at 12:31 pm

            *Grabbing popcorn and settling in to comfy chair*
      3. Siju Cat February 20, 2015 at 12:42 pm

         It’s an “if by whiskey”! After patriotism this is surely the last refuge of the scoundrel

         http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/If-by-whiskey
   2. diarmuid February 20, 2015 at 12:13 pm

      I see from @FergusFinlay tweeting Senator Jillian Turnhout that Goddard Global is the secretariat of the Stop Out Of Control Smoking campaign ( rolemodels.ie) in the same way they are have been secretariat to big tobacco firms .. I heard from a friend they were also involved in setting up the rolemodels.ie campaign http://tobaccotactics.org/index.php/Goddard_Global#Secretariat_for_the_Common_Sense_Alliance
      1. Clampers Outside! February 20, 2015 at 1:35 pm

         Stop Out Of Control Smoking

         WT actual F is that supposed to mean? :)

         What happened to ‘Never Start’ FFS
   3. Michael February 20, 2015 at 12:24 pm

      The irishrolemodels.ie campaign is designed by Diageo to stop public health reforms around alcohol and prevent more meaningful efforts to reduce drinking levels. Its a trojan horse. DrinkAware/Meas operated on the same principle. This is standard operating procedure by the alcohol and tobacco industries worldwide which is why the World Health Organisation states that the alcohol industry shouldn’t be permitted to take the lead on public health campaigns around alcohol.
      1. Clampers Outside! February 20, 2015 at 12:25 pm

         And there ya have it.
      2. Vote Rep #1 February 20, 2015 at 1:22 pm

         Cheers, much appreciated
3. eric cartman February 20, 2015 at 12:45 pm

   I personally love our drink culture, it makes being a pisshead socially acceptable.
   1. Continuity Jay-Z February 20, 2015 at 1:15 pm

      Exactly. You can breach the recommended unit intake with abandon in the safety of your peer group.

      I’d murder 20 units of porther now.
4. Spaghetti Hoop February 20, 2015 at 12:46 pm

   Finlay looking significantly younger there.
   2001 sounds recent…but in the vast landscape of the stretchy-saggy human mug it’s ages ago.

   14 YEARS COUNCILLOR!
5. Digs February 20, 2015 at 12:54 pm

   This is all so pedantic. It’s obviously in the drinks industry’s interest to get involved. It’s good PR. And so the campaign may as well get them to fund it. Ultimately it’s about getting people to drink aware. Who cares if Diageo use x firm or y firm? Finlay is no ones fool and he has a damn sight more moral integrity then most of his dim witted and conspiracy theorising detractors. Storm in a pint glass.
   1. Michael February 20, 2015 at 1:00 pm

      The campaign was initiated by Diageo. There are real independent alcohol related public health charities, but they have a fraction of the funding of this and DrinkAware/Meas

      International evidence shows that the campaigns like this being run by Diageo/Irishrolemodels doesn’t reduce harmful drinking. Restrictions on advertising, sponsorship of sporting & cultural events and minimum pricing reduces alcohol related harm. And these are all the things that Diageo, Drinkaware/Meas and the alcohol industry have opposed in the past.
      1. Digs February 20, 2015 at 1:17 pm

         Public Health policy discourse is tremendously alcohol centric at the moment. It’s a national obsession. Any drinks company or alcohol lobbying body would be naive not to try and get involved in that discussion. There is a demand and always will be for alcohol. Restrictions on advertising and sponsorship aren’t actually as profoundly affective as you seem to suggest. I still think it’s one of the ways to go, but there is also ( contrary to your assertion ) evidence that suggests raising awareness about the negative social and cultural pitfalls of alcohol abuse can influence behavioural attitudes. The drinks industry isn’t run by masons, it’s run by business men. Any business man worth their salt recognises that draconian policy is adverse to profit. Better to be proactive and a little profitable rather than adversarial and out of business.
         1. Michael February 20, 2015 at 2:01 pm

            It is right that public health discourse should be alcohol-centric, as alcohol harm is so high.

            I’ll give you the example of France where restrictions in advertising has worked over the years to reduce alcohol harm. http://www.drugs.ie/resourcesfiles/reports/Calling_Time_on_Alcohol_Advertising_and_sponsorship_in_Ireland.sflb.pdf

            I’d love to see any counter examples from you as to where “raising awareness about the negative social and cultural pitfalls of alcohol abuse can influence behavioural attitudes” Did DrinkAware/Meas the last big alcohol industry front charity manage to reduce alcohol use in all their spending?

            As you say the alcohol industry is run by business people. They look after their interests. So when faced with reforms that will reduce their sales and their profits, they co-opt charities like Barnardos, set up ineffective campaigns as a means to slow reforms. If you think this is conspiracy stuff then I’ll give you the example of Meas, the last alcohol industry funded “charity” which aligned with the industry in opposing the recommendations of the National Substance Misuse Strategy. http://alcoholireland.ie/home_news/%E2%80%98we-had-no-choice-but-to-submit-a-minority-report%E2%80%99/
            1. Digs February 20, 2015 at 3:37 pm

               With respect I think you’re being somewhat polemic. Most people working in this area would concede that a multi disciplinary attack on alcohol abuse would be prudent. Education and awareness programmes in isolation will not work. Blanket bans on marketing in isolation will not work. Life experience and socio economic profiling is also relevant. But of course you know that.

               In relation to the alcohol companies, the point I was trying to make was, they are savvy. They know it is not sophisticated nor productive to ignore the issues. Yes the bottom line is important, but so is PR. especially the good type. So yes, they will fight and lobby to advertise but will also compromise, as was the case in France.

               There are any number of research papers which mention a multi pronged approach. You can look them up yourself. The 1st reference you made is very narrow and not remotely comprehensive. The second reference to France ignores that binge drinking in France is on the rise. It is binge drinking in Ireland that is the biggest issue facing young people in terms of alcohol abuse. You can find info on that easily also.
            2. Bonkers February 20, 2015 at 3:49 pm

               Its also worth pointing out that when Des Bishop did his excellent documentary on Irish drinking culture he secured an interview with drinkaware.ie Then suddenly they cancelled the interview, it was pretty amazing stuff that an organisation whose purpose it is to educate people on harmful drinking wouldn’t want to take part in a TV documentary about harmful drinking and our drink culture.

               That one incident alone showed up drinkaware.ie for what they actually are- a strawman operation founded only so politicians can say ‘see, we are doing something’ when they know full well it is just another drinks industry funded group that has much in the shop window but little substance behind it.

               Fergus Finlay appears to have gotten wrapped up in a similar operation to drinkaware.ie. Champagne socialists need to be kept in champagne folks and sometimes you have to do unpalatable things to ensure the cases of Tattinger keep flowing. Be that working for alcohol companiies or tobacco companies it doesn’t seem to bother our Fergus, he’s had his nose in the public trough for so long now that his skin is just as thick as any Labout apparatchik
   2. Michael February 20, 2015 at 1:02 pm

      ” Ultimately it’s about getting people to drink”

      I fixed your line for you in your above post.
6. swoon February 20, 2015 at 12:57 pm

   ?
7. Chris February 20, 2015 at 1:08 pm

   ‘Nobody tells us what to think’ indeed, because if you listened most people in this instance are telling you you should have thought twice before selling your souls to Diageo.
8. Digs February 20, 2015 at 4:12 pm

   Des Bishop….
9. Kieran NYC February 20, 2015 at 9:27 pm

   Reminder time that Bill O’Herlihy is also knee-deep in the tobacco industry.

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