My Building, My Choice

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Further to the removal of Maser’s Repeal the 8th mural from outside the Project Arts Centre, Temple Bar, Dublin 2.

The Irish Council of Civil Liberties has erected replicas at Blackhall Place, Dublin 7 (above)

Fight!.

Pics: The HunReal Issues

Meanwhile…

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Loughlin O’ Nolan writes:

Use of the –#repealthe8th hashtag. First asterisk is the day the mural was installed, second when it was removed.

Meanwhile…

project

These colours don’t run.

Greg McLaughlin writes:

To get around planning violations that prohibited a painted mural an ‘Augmented Reality Marker’ has been placed on the exact spot where the original mural stood.

When people view the marker on their android phones (iPhone version will be available soon) using the website 8mural.com they will see a digital version of the mural in situ on the wall.

The website will also allow people to print their own version of the digital marker that they can stick on their own (legally owned walls).

As this marker is effectively a poster it does not contravene any of the planning regulations that resulted in the DCC requesting that the original mural be removed.

8mural.com

146 thoughts on “My Building, My Choice

  1. Cot

    We should stop the Repeal the 8th slogan. What we want is legal abortion. We should go with that, reproductive rights for all.

      1. Cot

        my fear is, they repeal the 8th, and leave it at that. they’ll say, we did what was asked. we don’t want abortion just for fatal foetal, we want it in all cases. we should be bombarding the nation with that message.

        1. trevor

          Yep. If/when it’s repealed there’s a whole other argument to be won for abortion legislation and services but these campaigns are fought on word games. Look at Tony’s comment- pro repealing the ammendment and anti-abortion.

        2. newsjustin

          Fair play to Cot for honestly telling it as it is (or, at least, how he/she feels about it).Nell McCafferty has said something similar – that she wants abortion for all, in all circumstances – not just removing the 8th Amendment.

          The more open the pro-choice side is about this, the less likely that 40.3.3 will be removed.

          1. pedeyw

            Hardly. Plenty of people feel that abortion in certain circumstances is okay (such as FFA, rape etc.) but don’t neccesarily want abortion on deman. There’s a whole spectrum of beliefs on when or if it should be permissable but with the 8th sitting there everything is blocked.

          2. Cup of tea anyone?

            Abortion on demand is such a terrible choice of words. Abortion when needed fits a bit better.

            No one gets an abortion they don’t need.

    1. Al

      Unfortunately the 8th prevents any meaningful legislation from being constitutional. It is such an ambiguous amendment that it stops any conversation about abortion on its tracks right away.

      1. Zuppy International

        If you are diagnosed with brain cancer and given a prognosis of two months to live so I shoot you in the head because it is more convenient for everybody’s schedule, is that murder?

        #ofcourseitfuppingis

          1. ReproBertie

            I didn’t bother replying to that as it was so clearly an admission that you couldn’t back up your ludicrous claim about human life bring sacred.

          2. ReproBertie

            Really, still nothing after all this time? And yet this is something you actually believe despite being unable to back it up in any way? I’m disappointed for you.

        1. pedeyw

          Zuppy in your example has the patient deteriated into a non sentient lump of thoughtless human bits? Because if that happened to me, I’d rather not be a burden on the healthcare system and my family. It wouldn’t be murder if there was no hope of survival.

    1. Anomanomanom

      Ridiculous comment. Thats the muck comment someone always throws out. Your body, Your choice, when you can make a baby by shagging your self then il agree its a women only choice.

      1. Nigel

        When men can take over the gestation in wombs of their own, then it’ll be more of a shared choice in the sense to which it is clearly being asserted.

      2. Annemarie

        Welcome to the brave new world Anomanomanom. Actually, you don’t have to be shagging anyone to make a baby these days. Tonnes of them being born and no shaggin involved. Shockin isn’t it?! Repeal the 8th!

        1. Anomanomanom

          Thanks the reply. But clearly no normally person would go through all the non shagging methods, which I know from friends is awful toll on the person, to just then have an abortion. So your smart ass point is moot.

          1. Annemarie

            Wow, you’re all fact!

            Do a bit of googling and see exactly how many abornal people go through this process each year. And flick me on the link that shows none of them have a need for termination, or those that do are abnormal?

          2. Anomanomanom

            Its clearly obvious im not talking about the cases that are genuine medical reasons. It was the altitude of “my body” and that’s it I had a problem with

          3. realPolithicks

            “It was the altitude of “my body” and that’s it I had a problem with”

            It’s none of your business what other people do with their bodies.

      3. Starina

        a man can’t use my body to gestate some cells just because we had sex. i’m a human being, not an incubator.

        1. Anomanomanom

          So then act like a human being and use the human brain you have to buy protection. And by the way I agree we need some sort of abortion, Its happening anyway every day, but not if a women can just “mybody” And use that as a reason to get an abortion…… I can give you an example and ask a genuine question. If the man leaves because he says “im not ready fora baby, I cant handle it”, the women can(if she wants) have the baby and then look for maintenance(which is hard) off the father who already stated he wanted nothing to do with it. Thats an awful thing that really happens…… Now the other scenario. The women states everything the man said but this time the man wants the baby. The women can then abort their baby and he had no say. How is that fair?

          1. Starina

            you really have no idea how many people get pregnant while using protection, do you. and we’re not talking about the other situation, so don’t sidetrack, dear.

          2. Anomanomanom

            How many of the millions of people using protection get pregnant. Its a tiny tiny %. You seem to keep throwing up things that rarely happen. Its simple as this, allow abortion for medical reasons not as a means of contraception.

          3. Starina

            jesus, nobody uses it as a form of contraception. stop reading redtop tabloids and get some female friends. saying people use it as a form of contraception is like saying people stab themselves in the gut to get a good night’s rest in the hospital.

          4. Ginger

            what?!? I woke up this morning and said to myself “I totally feel like having abortion today, or ice-cream.. one of the two anyway..”
            WTF??
            Abortion is an act of desperation and my daily routine!!
            If the life goes that way and a woman needs abortion she should have an access to a safe procedure without all this extra stress, it’s stressful and heartbreaking enough!

          5. Dόn 'The Unstoppable Force' Pídgéόní

            I had twelve before breakfast because I’m a stupid lazy whore. What a world!!!!

  2. forfeckssake

    I wonder will there be more complaints. Signage inside windows is also subject to planning permission.

      1. forfeckssake

        I don’t know the history of planning law but do know a business who received a letter from DCC about 18months ago saying that all signage that is visible from the street including graphics on the inside of their windows require planning permission.

  3. Tony

    Preaching to the converted. And the use of the heart to promote abortion is still quite distasteful IMO. But they probably know that.

      1. Tony

        Not a heart. Usually signifies love…. hardly appropriate, despite any upside. Distasteful heart is distasteful.

        1. Starina

          ladies, don’t forget that when you fight for bodily autonomy, please do it tastefully. Tony’s tutting is harsh.

          1. Tony

            Its not sympathy, it proposing that we allow abortion. the only question is in what form. hearts dont do it for me when abortion is the subject. As the pro life campaign say, every abortion stops a heart. We have to be careful when we make the decision to stop those hearts.

          2. Starina

            Nobody makes a decision lightly to abort. It’s always careful. that you imply otherwise is condescending.

          3. MoyestWithExcitement

            It’s not just condescending, it’s disgusting and could only be uttered by a bitter, socially inept depressive who doesn’t get much respect in real life, especially from women so he needs to condescend in order to impress and win respect from the audience he’s imagining in his head.

          4. Tony

            As a society we have to make the decision on who to abort. We shouldn’t take it lightly. We should be guided not by fluffy hearts, but by real cases. We should have learned this in the past 30 years.

          5. Tony

            As for that ghoul Moyest. you make the best case for post natal abortion I have ever come across.

          6. MoyestWithExcitement

            “As a society we have to make the decision on who to abort.”

            Oh wow, you’re actually completely insane.

    1. Al

      A heart also symbolises passion. And when I hear the stories of women affected by this stupid amendment I feel a whole lot of passion. Passion to fight against this amendment.

      Also it is a symbol of love, love for the women who had to suffer because of the amendment.

      Love can be expressed in many ways and for many situations.

      By the way, nobody is promoting abortion here. Repeal the 8th is promoting CHOICE.

        1. MoyestWithExcitement

          Choice for abortion. Everyone understands it. It’s the pro life tactic of painting the decision to have an abortion as an easy one which makes people uncomfortable.

          1. MoyestWithExcitement

            And the law will be decided upon by government on the advice of doctors. Again, not you. Sorry, little buddy.

          2. MoyestWithExcitement

            How do I know the limit on abortion times won’t just be picked out of the air? Are you even avle to dress yourself in the morning?

          3. Tony

            Abortion is a difficult one for you SJW’s. but real change comes from tackling hard issues. Shame you’re not up to the task.

          4. MoyestWithExcitement

            Aww, poor widdle Trollny is upset that people are calling out his made up on the spot BS. Do you need a safe space, widdle Trollny?

        2. realPolithicks

          For women to “choose” what they want to do in their lives and not have self righteous people like you dictating to them.

          1. Tony

            Show me once where I dictated anything. If you can’t be honest about such a defining question, don’t be in the debate. Fricking bandwagoner.

          2. realPolithicks

            Everything you say and how you say it makes your position very clear. Also its a pity you can’t discuss things without slinging insults at people.

    2. forfeckssake

      Everyone passing on the street is converted? Well we’d better repeal the 8th if so many people already agree.

      1. Cup of tea anyone?

        I think the sign encourages conversation and media attention so that people talk about it and maybe learn something about the issues faced by some women due to the 8th. so when the referendum comes around people know what they are voting for.

    3. Tony

      No one loves abortion do they? So why the heart? To make something abhorrent acceptable? Im actually pro repealing the 8th, but this doesn’t do it for me.

      1. Annemarie

        The heart is a message of solidarity with women & families who have been given a diagnosis of fatal foetal abnormality and who may be experiencing loss or grief compounded by the fact of having to leave their country, travel abroad on nasty ryanair flights, and come home to wait for the remains of their children to be sent back in fedex boxes. The heart is a public statement of love, compassion and empathy towards people who been given the devastating news that their child won’t survive outside the womb.
        Who in their right sane mind would question the use of a heart or it’s appropriateness for the Repeal the 8th campaign? Tony your comments are registering way high up on the thick-as-planks meter!!!

        1. Tony

          Annemarie, if that is what it meant, then fine. But it says that nowhere, Repeal the 8th means everything from what you said, to full on abortion up to 22 weeks. This is the problem. thats where the vagueness lies. What is it actually promoting? Using a heart to signify abortion at 22 weeks is distasteful.

          1. Annemarie

            It’s promoting a message of love to people who are grieving, and whose grief is being shaped and interfered with by the law. To anyone who has had a sister, or friend, or who themselves has buried a child, and actually to the general public who use their brains, no more explaining should be needed. Repeal the 8th is about parents who have been completely floored by the worst possible news, and a country that doesn’t support them. How much more detail do you need?! Where is the vagueness? Read the papers, click on links, THINK: get informed. Your comments are distasteful, not extending love or hearts to bereaved parents and families!!!

          2. Annemarie

            Fatal Foetal Abnormality can be diagnosed at 3 weeks, or 22 weeks, or 25 weeks. WHAT are you talking about?! Dude, you need to really read up on the legislation before you start waffling on about something you know nothing about. !!

          3. Tony

            Would you ever give over and stop being so naive. You ask me how much detail I need. Repeal the 8th and replace it with what? How about that for a simple question? Is it just for people in FFA, rape and incest, or for all cases up to 22weeks? Or is it another definition. This is what the referendum will be about. If this logo was about bringing in abortion for all up to 22 weeks, would you consider the heart tasteful?

          4. Tony

            Dudette! You really need to answer the question here and stop lecturing. Most of the country agrees with the exceptional cases, where the divide occurs is in the detail. Fine if you want to avoid it in the name of love, but that wont repeal anything.

      2. Nigel

        It may be to indicate to the women that they are loved. Remember them? The women? Possibly alone, vulnerable, in fragile emotional state? Them? Ring a bell?

        1. MoyestWithExcitement

          “Possibly alone, vulnerable, in fragile emotional state? Them? Ring a bell?”

          Careful now, you’ll have him pitching a tent.

        2. Tony

          Dont patronise in your usual way please. If you are in favour of abortion up to 22 weeks. Just say so, Id have more respect for you than hiding behind skirts. Its time to move beyond the rainbow and into the actual detail of what repeal the 8th want. I think you’ll find wildly different views.

          1. Nigel

            So not so much forgetting as studiously pretending they’re of little to no importance.
            I think Repeal the 8th want the 8th repealed. If there are wildly different views as to what comes after that, probably best to focus n the one thing that can be agreed on, don’t you think? That way at least stuff like FFA and rape/abuse cases can be dealt with, don’t you agree?

          2. Tony

            What has to be agreed is what replaces the 8th. The public will not repeal it an hope for the best. They are not naive. The public need to know what the effect of repealing the 8th would be. As you say, most would be in agreement in the exceptional cases, but after that, the real debate begins. And it would be honest of Repealthe8th to say what they mean. Honest?? Any harm in that?

          3. MoyestWithExcitement

            “The public will not repeal it an hope for the best.”

            Yes they will.

            “The public need to know what the effect of repealing the 8th would be.”

            It would be the removal of abortion from the constitution. They already know that.

            “And it would be honest of Repealthe8th to say what they mean”

            They are saying what they mean. The clue is in the name. It’s not their fault some people are dimwits.

          4. Nigel

            Yeah, there’s been such a lack of debate on the abortion issue with people notably failing to set out there aims. When oh when will it begin?

          5. Tony

            You sure are Nige. And getting your knickers in a twist with your yes but no but. Why afraid of being honest though?

          6. Nigel

            I am honestly in favour of repealing the 8th and legalising abortion for so-called exceptional cases. If people want more than that, they can campaign for it, but it seems to me that while there’s a groundswell of support for the basic repeal, it makes sense to focus on that.

          7. Tony

            I agree with your position, but the electorate deserve to be told what will replace the 8th. Otherwise we will be stuck with XYand Z cases forever

          8. Nigel

            The electorate won’t be told what will replace the 8th, the electorate will decide what will replace the 8th. I’m sure there will be plenty of suggestions before a consensus is reached, but it seems more urgent to get rid of the 8th and allow abortion in exceptional circumstances before the wrangling over that begins.

          9. Tony

            Repealing the 8th does not only affect exceptional cases. It affects all cases. That why the debate and the accompanying honesty is needed now. Or are you thinking of having two referenda?

          10. Nigel

            Which is why there is support for repealing it from so many quarters. Don’t worry, I’m sure the pro-lifers will be making all the slippery-slope arguments you could possible want, though perhaps not with a great deal of honesty.

          11. rotide

            Of course the public will be told what will replace the 8th. At the moment, from what i can see ‘nothing’ is what will replace the 8th. The public won’t decide what will replace the 8th, 2 choices will be presented to them and we’ll decide between them.

            I’m in favor of repealing the 8th so that cases of FFA can be seen to. but I won’t get to vote on that. I’m in favor of repealing the 8th so that women can have a choice up to a reasonable amount of time outside of cases of FFA but I won’t get to vote on that either.

            I’m not in favor of unlimited ‘my body, my choice’ abortion, but again, I won’t get to vote on that.

            Thats why the pro life lobby and anyone who is shaky about the issue is not pushed about removing the 8th.

          12. Nigel

            Realistically, which do you think has more of a chance of being put in place following a repeal, full choice or exceptional cases? Tony and newsjustin seem to be pushing for full on aborto-war in the hopes that the divisions will stymie even the latter. I expect pro-lifers will be pushing the slippery slope argument hard. The smart thing is to focus on getting the bare minimum human decency and lingering conservatism will allow, then build on that, if it can be built on. I suppose you;re right in the sense that, eg, we got that stupidly formulated suicide exception mess that nobody wanted and nobody was happy with, and that’s typical of the way Irish politics responds to this issue, always causing more problems than it solves.

          13. Tony

            “I expect pro-lifers will be pushing the slippery slope argument hard”

            It is always good to anticipate and plan for your enemy’s tactics before he attacks. Preparation is everything. So dealing with these questions now is better than wishing it away on graffiti. By the way, newsjustin is anti abortion and eloquent with it. I am not, I just hate the obfuscation and lies on both sides.

          14. rotide

            Bonus points for ‘Abort-o-war’ :)

            Like, I’m going to happily vote to repeal when the referendum eventually comes. To me, the benefits outweigh the negatives even if it does mean it’s going to be 6 months of My Body My choice and other such cross-issue catchphrases.

            As another poster said, there’s already legislation in place to deal with a lot of the aftermath, but what is worrying is what you’ve touched on , in that it’s going to be left to the government to come up with some sort of plan and that doesn’t fill me with confidence.

          15. dan

            What should replace it is abortion on demand up until the point when the fetus is developed enough to have the capability to perceive pain, which is 27-28 weeks.

  4. Annemarie

    Tony asks the question why should we exhibit a heart for parents who have lost children, and what should we repeal the 8th with?

    Hows about we replace it with the right by law, to decide what is best for you and your family when you have been told that the child you are carrying has, for example, only a partly formed brain, underdeveloped heart, and a 1% chance of being born alive and even then living in pain for a few minutes…..

    Clearly, we should replace the current law with the right for each mother to make that choice AND the right to be in her own country, surrounded by family, to grieve in a supportive atmosphere…

    As for the last part for your question “if this logo was about something else entirely would I consider it distasteful?” …. Possibly not, because thats a different conversation about a different set of issues about which we are actually NOT talking?!

    Wtf! People are mental!!!

    1. Tony

      WTF!!! Stop the H8!!! Annemarie, are you avoiding the question I asked? We are not exhibiting a heart for parents who lost children, we are using it to garner support for repealing the 8th which protects the life of the unborn. Now, Ill ask again, do you agree with abortion up to 22 weeks? Stop using suffering parents as your human shield and face up to the question we all will have to deal with when the referendum comes. We ARE talking about this issue. get your head out of your fluffy heart shaped clouds.

      1. Niamh

        Here is what many pro-repeal activists want: REMOVE reference to abortion/unborn from the constitution altogether. Other legislation adequately covers destruction of life in the womb by assault etc. Then the issue of abortion remains a purely medical one dealt with by medial policies and medical ethics. This won’t mean hospitals and clinics will all provide it, or standardise it, but it will be a start – this is the case in other countries.

        As for the question about 22 weeks: if you are not bright and empathetic enough to realise that this is an immensely personal and case-specific question, you’re not worth engaging with. The area is immensely grey. Nobody understands that more than women – you know, those of us who spend our adult lives relating in various ambivalent ways to our sexuality and reproductive capacity. Those of us who are coached to be motherly from childhood. Those of us whose business this whole shebang is. We’re complex.

        Claire Daly has made numerous submissions to the Dail with detailed and well-researched alternatives to the 8th, by the way: we have never been given a chance to vote on it.

        Nobody is ‘avoiding your question’. You are not asking a question and you do not wish to be enlightened. You are an immature asshat.

        1. Tony

          More patronising guff. Of course the area is grey. thats why its complex. And one in which we will all be asked to decide. Thats why the issues should be discussed and positions clarified so the public know what they are supporting. Im a fan of Clare Daly, but she doesn’t indulge in fluffy cloud syndrome, she deals with the details, the gritty stuff, the stuff that has to be dealt with before legislation is passed.

          1. trevor

            Most abortions are in the first trimester brought on by taking tablets. The result is a similar biological process that happens during a first trimester miscarriage. Stats vary but a third to a half of pregnancies result in miscarriage and sometimes without the woman even knowing.

            This 22weeks thing is a red herring which the anti-abortion side use as a wedge to muddy the waters (if you’ll pardon the pun). While premature babies delivered at 20-something weeks can and have survived it’s down thanks to advances in medical science – the same field that has discovered how pregnancy worked. Doctors don’t usually go around saying “hey, let’s just induce birth at 22weeks, sure the anti-abortion crowd said it’s the same as full term!”

            The life of the “unborn” (a hazy term already tbh) is contingent upon the life of the mother. There’s been 30+years of cases that have blown a wide hole in the argument that they can be treated the same.

            Tony, what would you like to replace the current regime (8th ammendment, abortion onlynwhen “real and substantial risk to life”, 14year sentence for illegal abortion)?

          2. Tony

            I would like abortion to be available in all cases of FFA, rape and incest. I would also like it to be available for a number of weeks (less than 22) should a woman chose to have it. The reason I chose 22 is that it is the UK system which is in place here already. However, if people made a reasonable case for a shorter duration, I would be open to persuasion. Like many, I have no set time for the onset of consciousness, but the thought of killing a sentient being does jar with me. I also believe any change in the abortion laws should be accompanied by education and provision of other services to try and keep the number of abortions to a minimum. These are the issues we should be discussing in order to have a plan for post Repealthe8th.

          3. Cup of tea anyone?

            so Tony. You accept it in the cases of FFA, Rape or Incest.

            So would a pregnant women will have to go to court an prove she was raped / Incest?

            Would the court case be finished in 22 weeks? What happens to the baby if the verdict comes in at 6 months? is it ok to abort then?

            Can you honestly say the Rape Incest thing can work with our court system?

          4. Tony

            These are precisely the issues that need to be part of the campaign so we don’t end up in another mess after it. Of course the courts need to be addressed if we are bringing this in. It is much more complicated than a simple slogan, and the sooner we start discussing that, the better.

          5. Cup of tea anyone?

            so many rape cases go unreported. So when a woman realises that she is pregnant she is already gone minimum 4 weeks. There is no way a rape case will ever get through in 18 weeks, and that is if the abortion is done that day.

            Agreeing with abortions in the case of rape is a pointless.

            The 8th should be repelled. It does not need to be replaced with anything. The well being of everyone involved should be decided on individually by their own doctor.

          6. Tony

            So you believe in abortion in all cases? At least you are straightforward and honest about it. I dont share your certainty. Like many people, while supporting the right of the woman to chose, I do feel i have a role in shaping society, and Id like my vote to go to shaping the best society for all. Including the unborn. Complicated, yes. In need of a compromise, yes. And that best compromise will win the day, not the most strident argument.

  5. Annemarie

    In the case of 22 weeks, or 39 weeks, or any weeks where the child has been given a fatal foetal abnormality diagnosis, I believe the decision whether or not to go through labor should completely ly with the mother 100%. For me, it is THEE same as a situation where a child in hospital hooked up to life-support machines has been given a diagnosis that guarantees no quality of life. We cannot take that decision out of the hands of parents.

    Read any literature on Repeal the 8th, watch the videos, inform yourself: women, parents, and family who have received distressing medical news are at the forefront of the Repeal the 8th campaign. This is not a set-up, or I’m not trying to be clever. Thats what the campaign is ALL about. It amazes me that you could have missed that?!

    1. Tony

      You are either totally naive, or deliberately obfuscating. Ill ask again. If the child has no FFA, and is not a product of either incest or rape, would you be in favour of allowing abortion up to 22 weeks? or have you another time in mind? That is what this will come down to.

      1. MoyestWithExcitement

        Are we going to vote on what time limit should be placed on abortions or will that decision be left to medical professionals? Which do you think is more likely you adorable, socially inept little dimwit?

          1. MoyestWithExcitement

            Oh dear, Trollny. Oh dear oh dear oh dear. You poor little shut in. That’s not how things work, young man. You’ll learn that when you leave home.

          2. MoyestWithExcitement

            When a man and woman love each other very much, they take their clothes off and have a special hug. Then a stork comes and delivers them a beautiful little law in a basket a few months later.

      2. Annemarie

        Jesus, the goal-posts are fairly moving here…..

        Tony, having discovered that Repeal the 8th is ALL about parents, families and unborn children who won’t survive illness, now jumps ship and wants to “debate” a completely separate issue, and a completely different question…

        Thats an eejit’s tactic. (Sure I could do the same thing. For example, are you in favor of disempowering parents at Temple Street Childrens Hospital to make decisions about whether or not to turn off life-machines?)

        You made some stupid comments here about hearts being inappropriate for the campaign; you got some heat, if you want a new conversation about wider abortion rights go get your ass kicked on the relevant thread elsewhere!! My foot is tired!

        A

        1. Tony

          Why is repeal the 8th only about FFA in your opinion? Where does it say that? you are de;literately shying away. One could almost call you virtue signalling. You care, but not about the messy bits.

          1. MoyestWithExcitement

            “One could almost call you virtue signalling.”

            Virtue signalling? :D One could call you a vacuous, slack jawed slogan chanting moron for using that term.

          2. MoyestWithExcitement

            No, little Trollny. We’re not banning the words you like outside your Safe Space, we’re laughing at them.

          3. Tony

            Who are we? All right thinking people? Why don’t you like that term? Too close to the bone? Does it call you out for being a person who pretends to care, but judging by your behaviour on here is an actual bottomhole?

          4. MoyestWithExcitement

            “Who are we? All right thinking people?”

            Normal, well adjusted people who don’t live in your safe space where your stupidity is immune from criticism.

            “Why don’t you like that term?”

            I nothing that term, little Trollny. I’m just laughing at you for mindlessly chanting meaningless right wing slogans in your cute little attempt to appear knowledgeable and rational and better informed than the normal people you argue with.

          5. MoyestWithExcitement

            So gay folks are abnormal, yeah? I see your truuuuue colours shiiining through…..

          6. MoyestWithExcitement

            He did….in a separate conversation I was having with him, not in this conversation I’m having with you. Poor Trollny.

  6. Zuppy International

    The wording under discussion, FYI:

    he State acknowledges the right to life of the
    unborn and, with due regard to the equal right to
    life of the mother, guarantees in its laws to
    respect, and, as far as practicable, by its laws to
    defend and vindicate that right.

  7. geroshite

    these people are stupid.
    they really think this will change anything.
    I’d say enda kenny is really worried.

Comments are closed.