Ray Kinsella’s call for an “Irexit” was surprising, confusing, and deeply disappointing.
While Brexiteers have lately been drenched by a cold shower of reality, “Irexiteers” frustratingly cling to the same toxic fantasy that has driven the UK to its greatest foreign policy disaster in decades.
Europe is our home. We have benefited and grown greatly as a nation from our EU membership, and remain members because it is overwhelmingly in our interests.
The Irish people have repeatedly recognised at the ballot box that, whether we are in the EU or not, many decisions which are important to our country are decided in Brussels.
As such, we’re far better off as equal members, with our vote, our veto, and our seat at the table of the world’s most important trade bloc – all of which the UK has gambled away.
Mr Kinsella disappointingly blames the EU for issues not of its making, such as the existence of the Irish Border, the US-led bombings of Syria and Libya, and even the consequences of Brexit.
While claiming that Brexit renders Ireland “marginalised, peripheral and dependant”, Mr Kinsella also bafflingly seems to believe that an Irexit would reverse this.
How does losing our vote and our rights in Europe strengthen us? How does cutting ourselves off from the single market we helped to build make us more prosperous or secure?
Does Mr Kinsella not recognise that leaving the EU actually results in a very real loss of control, as the UK is currently finding out?
Finally, Mr Kinsella asks “who will uphold and advocate Ireland’s national interests?” The answer is simple. Ireland will. To do so, we need an equal seat at the table, and a vote to cast.
A stupid, pointless Irexit would deny us both.
Saoirse Ni Chrualaoich,
Should Ireland seriously consider Irexit? (The Irish Times letters page)
We are 1% of Europe and will be treated as such once our only partner with similar beliefs leaves…
What similar beliefs?
I suspect Paul means (in broad terms) pro-business, pro-free market, pro-competition, pro-widening the single market etc.
It is true that we were allied with the UK on many of these issues, as indeed were a number of other (usually small) countries such as the Dutch, the Danish…
It is a risk imo but still much better than some stupid meaningless ‘taking back control’
what beliefs are those exactly?
Let me correct that: “…similar language…”
Ireland has been exceptionally pro-Europe and pro-EU since before we joined the EEC. Even when they joined, UK had a vocal anti-EU element. and this has been allowed to grow larger/more vocal for internal political reasons, resulting in Brexit.
I’m all for debating Irexit, but let’s do it on the basis of fact, not sentiment.
list to a few of those beliefs there
we voted no on nice and Lisbon. and were forced to vote again PLUS all the fear.
fupp the eu
Voted after changing the Treaty to our wants.
Think about that, we’re a tiny 1% nation but we had a veto, as is only right, and were able to make the EU wait till we were happy.
We literally got the treaties changed to suit our wants and people seem to think that this is a bad thing.
We said no to Lisbon. We were told we gave the wrong answer. The fear was ramped up and we were told to vote again. Any changes were cosmetic as the political establishment ignored the will of the people.
The OP ignores the reality of history.
The EU needs us more than we need it.
What do they need us for Zippy?
Our fishing grounds for starters
Rubbish. We voted no, our reasons were canvessed and the treaty was changed. Obviously to people who are against everything the EU stands for, such as yourself and Bodger, it is quite easy to ignore this as go for the childish idea that we were given the exact same thing to vote on. Hardly shocking for the two tinfoil hat lads though.
With regards the fish, the FF government gave up the waters and shafted the fishermen to get an amazing deal for the farmers. They could have tried for a decent deal for both but not too many votes on the boats.
What changes did they make to the treaty? How many still stand? Have you forgotten Mastrict? Same story.
The people said no and the politicians ignored us.
The EU is a liberal fascist nightmare.
CETA was blocked because Wallonia (with a population even smaller than Ireland’s) rejected it. Can’t get much more democratic than that.
guarantees that the Lisbon treaty, and constitution of Europe, could not affect Irish sovereignty, taxation, military, and abortion weren’t seen as cosmetic by the electorate.
it’s what the no campaign had told them to fear .
those fears were addressed then democracy. we were the envy of Europe for that power.
“The EU is a liberal fascist nightmare.”
So you actually don’t know what got changed? Why I am not surprised. Far easier to to call it things like a liberal fascist nightmare to then to some actual research other then the likes of infowars.
“guarantees that the Lisbon treaty, and constitution of Europe, could not affect Irish sovereignty, taxation, military, and abortion weren’t seen as cosmetic by the electorate”
The electorate were duped.
“French presidential candidate Emmanuel Macron has the Irish regime in his sights as he will push for tax harmonisation among eurozone states if he wins this Sunday’s French election.”
“Guarantees” are just words. See also; Trump, Donald.
he can push all he wants but he can’t do it.
every state has a tax veto.
always did but this was restated in the Treaty. Because of us.
Facts lads, rather than media snippets, if you want to make an argument.
Where are your facts? All I can see from ya is a smug opinion.
the facts are in my comment? documented treaties are facts. tabloid headlines are not.
What Harry said as well as a seat on the European commission.
Please. Our sovereignty was ignored during the banking crisis. Covney and the blueshirts are slowly dragging us in to the EU army and our constitutional protection for the unborn is being undermined by a billionaire Hungarian ex-nazi
“he can push all he wants but he can’t do it.”
Right wingers live in a complete fantasy where everyone does what they’re told.
wow, so Mr French President can implement a universal tax rate across the union unilaterally!?
It actually makes sense that you think that since you seem to pick and choose what laws people have to obey.
Thankfully, the reality is different.
“wow, so Mr French President can implement a universal tax rate across the union unilaterally!?”
Yes. Unilaterally. That is the only way this. Jay. Zus.
*only way to intepret this. Ah well.
Zuppy, you’re pushing the same nonsense the Kippers were during Brexit; those are all issues created by our own elected politicians, not edicts handed down from Europe
I always found visiting Ireland was appreciating Irish culture and Irish people. The same visiting France.etc
We have lost a lot of our culture, small village shops, small farms , its sad to see the decline . Its nonsense to suggest all about the EEC is top drawer…..Aren’t we committed to taking 8, OO0 refugees , ? Nowhere to house the misfortunes, we can’t house our own .
How is it the EU’s fault that shops in villages are closing down :/
Everything bad that happens is the EUs fault.
If we hadn’t joined the dastardly EU, Irish culture would be just like it was in the 80s where we’d still be stuck.
Free trade means large multinationals can move in on markets that are being served by small, independent traders and undercut them. This also cuts down on employment options and puts downward pressure on wages which means people have even less money to spend in small independent shops. Come on, man. You think houses were cheap in the 70s because women didn’t work. Surely you can get your head around this.
Ah, not only is the EU at fault for Irish “culture” disappearing, it is also at fault for the current housing crisis.
Indeed. We were not allowed put down our bad banks for example. Instead private gambling losses were yoked to public debt all thanks to ECB interference in our sovereign affairs.
Before the EU, small traders were being undercut by Quinnsworth, Dunnes Stores, Musgraves etc – the EU didn’t cause this to happen.
“ You think houses were cheap in the 70s because women didn’t work.”
– this is one of the main reasons that houses were much cheaper then than now. Your inability to comprehend this is perhaps understandable, but you probably shouldn’t wave it around like a turd for everyone to see…
“Before the EU, small traders were being undercut by Quinnsworth, Dunnes Stores, Musgraves etc – the EU didn’t cause this to happen.”
Amazing. Really and truly. I think you can’t embarrass yourself any more than you already have and then you come out with this. Amazing.
Would you like me to do you a drawing with crayons, maybe that would be easier to understand? x
Lol! I don’t think anyone will be surprised to know that you write in crayon. Poor Rob. :D
You know moyest is lost when he resorts to the insults.
Hey babes! You literally insulted me in your last post. Not having a good day, little Reta..Rotide?
That I did, but I wasn’t making long tiresome arguments that were refuted completely at every turn.
How did the J1 go this year?
“I wasn’t making long tiresome arguments that were refuted completely at every turn.”
That’s right, your hilariously terrible arguments are just ignored by everyone these days. You really should be showing me some gratitude for the attention I’m giving you here.
!How did the J1 go this year?”
Why, are you looking for tips before you go on yours next year?
You might have a point Moyest, but our own planning laws allowing one off houses all over the place mean that people are less likely to frequent the village shop, but rather to do a ‘big shop’ in a larger town once a week. They’re less likely to stroll down town at half nine for three pints. The EU’s contributed; we haven’t helped either though. We don’t like building up, which means that lots of places* never reach a critical mass that MORE people want to move there.
(*yes, I know, there are exceptions)
Catherine I know I can’t talk in the language and punctuation stakes a lot of the time, but I have no idea what you are trying to say
have a trading zone. screw the political and banking union.
There must be a pros & cons list about being an EU member floating around somewhere?
Basically just watch what happens with Brexit and presume that Irish politicians will be a little bit more incompetent.
you pay off eu bank debts.
enjoy flooding the country with “refugees” cheap labour..
Needs some ‘cons’ as well.
We’re not bailing out till we get a better word than ‘Irexit’.
Hmm. Not my greatest work.
Better but still not a rallying cry. Hiberemainers?
Hiberemainers, why don’t you come to your senses
Been out riding fences for so long now…
I tend to digress, unfortunately.
It will only be confused with Wexit, the official campaign for the Independent Republic of Wexico.
Not bad Nigel. Eirgoers, like it.
No one has benefited more from the EU than Ireland. Ireland pre 1970 and joining EEC was a poverty stricken mess, with no decent roads, and barely any investment.
+ billions (in EU funding)
+billions in debt (you must have known that was coming!
I like that I can’t be forced to resign from my job if I get married and that I get the same rate of pay as a married man with the same length of service and experience. We may have joined in the 70’s but the EEC dragged Ireland from a 1950’s backwater to a modern country.
I’d get rid of the European parliament in the morning, but I’d keep the EEC.
Hey! Wasn’t Brendan O’Carroll’s Mum the lady who got that legislation introduced (ie having to give up your job in the civil service on getting married)? I didn’t think it was an EEC thing.
Equal pay was the EEC; not sure about the other.
only bigoted racists are against the EU, the EU is the best thing to happen to us our voice is heard and acknowledged in europe we have an important role in the decisions being made in Brussels and our concerns are listened to. We need to ignore the voices saying the EU is a monolith of corruption and bureaucracy and that the illusion of democracy is presented via MEP’s who have to vote in Blocs and that the EU is ruled by unelected Commissioners. Brexit was racist an ignorant majority stole democracy away from the people we CANNOT allow that to happen here, the EU has our best interests at heart we are all equal partners in Europe, Germany and France listen closely to the Irish people and their needs reform is coming soon we just need to be patient.
beepbop beeep beeep KABLAMMMO!!
There goes another Conformité Européene sarcasm detector! 2nd one today!
– the longest peaceful Europe in living memory, if not ever (maybe some history people might comment)
– the most prosperous Europe
has been since the EU :)
German domination without firing a bullet. Damn Hun.
Never mind the leaving the EU, we should be more ambitious. In 1961 Yuri Gagarin traveled into space and escaped the bonds of gravity. Why should Ireland not follow suit? Gravity is no friend of ours, it keeps us chained to hard, unyielding earth with other nations who do not share our interests. We would do well to remove ourselves from the downward tyranny of earth’s gravitational field and reposition ourselves in a market where the physics allows for a more omnidirectional fluidity.
And it would make it harder to the refugees to catch up with us.
the EU is a big international shake down. a scam. and we got massively used by it. they set it up as a way to drain what they can from each country and funnel it to elites.
that’s why I became an elite. lottsa gravy :-)
If we leave what do we think we’re going to get from aligning to Britain?
Don’t get me wrong I’m not anti-British but we’re far better off with a decent say (voting, veto, seat at the table) in Europe rather than a partnership with Britain.
Would we ‘join’ the ‘union’ again or try go it alone?
At least Britain have the scale to survive on their own if they have to.
On the plus side: peace in our time, access to the single market, free movement, a mature and moral approach to social justice such as the refugee crisis.
The cons: it’s a neoliberal takeover by evil sausage munchers and shadowy George Soros; we are actually a slave vassal state who would be rich as Croesus now had we stuck with 1950s social attitudes and protectionism, flogging mouldy beef and butter.
If the EU is a neoliberal nightmare, I’d love to see the egalitarian Scandi-state we’d have ended up being by looking to Boston rather than Berlin.
Yeah I know which one I’ll go with