84 thoughts on “De Wednesday Papers

    1. FMD

      Fiona. You voted to abort people like Greta. I bet you are very very very very concerned that people on the Asperger Spectrum have more ethics than you will ever have.

      1. Janet, I ate my avatar

        what a ridiculous comment,
        for a start you can’t test for Asperger’s or Autism in pregnancy ,
        if you are going to throw around disgusting accusations at least make it viable

    2. bisted

      …Fiona Looney: a mediocre Irish hack writing for the Daily Mail expressing concern for a charismatic kid who has just addressed the UN and made a passionate speech in a language that is not her first…

        1. Posting for a friend

          We all live online now and this stuff needs to be challenged yet at the same time I’m certain it would be best to ignore it completely

        2. italia'90

          Jay sus Nigel, how many names do you post under?
          B9 com from No is another one of yours.
          Now this one.
          Are you memes aswell?
          I’m beginning to wonder tbh.
          Trolling can’t be a healthy lifestyle.

          1. Nigel

            Excuse me I only post under my own real name or some abbreviated form thereof: Nigel Clamperissismus Bodgerington.

    3. TheQ47

      Exactly.
      She and (by extension) all of us of the generation or two older than Greta Thornburg are supposed to feel uncomfortable watching her speech. That was exactly the point. The idea is not that we leave it to Greta and her generation to fix, but rather that she make us feel so uncomfortable that we have to do something about it, if for no other reason than to stop this uncomfortable feeling.
      However, feeling uncomfortable in the way that is intimated by Fiona Looney says more about her than it does about Greta.

      1. f_lawless

        But did you even read the article? She’s not denying that we don’t need to act for the sake of the environment, she’s questioning whether it’s appropriate to use a child to spearhead an environmental awareness campaign if it means sacrificing the child’s happiness along the way and exposing her to the inevitable intense backlash she’s receiving from a large number of people?

        If you look further into it, it’s apparent that Greta’s rise to prominence wasn’t organic at all but from day 1, a carefully crafted PR campaign – Ingmar Rentzhog, CEO of ‘We Don’t Have Time’, didn’t randomly find her on the street on the first day of her strike and tweet about her plight. Thunberg and he had already attended earlier conferences where the idea of a large march for the climate was proposed. Thunberg’s mother had been in direct contact with Rentzhog at one of those conferences. Right from day one of her strike, her social media presence was further amplified by the likes of Callum Grieve, co-founder and director of Counter Culture, a brand development firm specialising in behavioural change campaigns and storytelling. A brief timeline: https://twitter.com/elleprovocateur/status/1176513700028702721

        I think by giving a child the platform, with pre-approved speeches, rather than an adult activist with the insight and expertise to detail the specific causes, call out the worst environmental offenders are(eg . the arms industry), and to propose specific solutions, the ball stays firmly in the court of the elite class, allowing them to set the terms of an appropriate response.

        Someone coined the term ‘pedophrasty’ which is the practice of cynically using children to sway public opinion to a particular argument. People suspend all skepticism in front of a child’s pleas as it pulls on the heartstrings and to voice any criticisms causes you to be accused of lacking in empathy. At the risk of offending, some of the comments here sound like they’ve fallen foul to a form of pedophrasty or are unwittingly indulging in it themselves!

        1. Nigel

          Yeah, I hear she didn’t cross the Atlantic single-handed either, what a stage-manged fraud.
          Nothing in your description is incompatible with the campaign being ‘organic,’ unless by ‘organic’ you mean sprung fully-formed from the fertile earth. Anyone involved in activism knows campaigns take work, and planning, and support, and luck. That this one took off so massively is miraculous, because God knows enough of them sink or fall apart no matter how much work is put into them. What you’re erasing is the idea that Greta herslef has any agency, or will, or say, or input, that she’s an empty figurehead parroting other’s thoughts and words.

          Oh, and yes, it is a disgrace that a child (and she’s not the only one) has to do this to get the issue attention it deserves. The sooner the ball gets rolling on meaningful action the sooner she can step back, if she chooses. Hey, huess what, your prevarications and insinuations make that less likely rather than more!

          I love your weird formless leap to some sort o elite class controlling her and through her the environmental agenda. The elite class already control the environmental agenda, and they don’t care Someone like Greta bringing the global focus onto the environment and climate change gives people the opportunity to call out all the worst offenders, so please have at it!

          Oh, no, you;re too busy caloing out Great.

          Pedophrasty is a great phrase, and I’m sure we can expect it to be directed at her and her family and supporters a LOT over the next while, so thanks for spreading it around! I’m sure it’ll do her a lot of good!

          1. f_lawless

            By not organic, I mean that Greta’s story was contrived beforehand – deliberately planned out rather than arising naturally or spontaneously. It wasn’t initiated by her and it wasn’t grassroots activism that gained her access to political leaders either. Her rise to this level of prominence is because corporate media outlets have collectively chosen to give her sustained front page coverage. Contrast that with say, the Yellow Vest protests still going strong in France but collectively ignored now by corporate media.

            I’m not saying that she doesn’t have any of her own will. I’m saying she is a child with Asperger’s and lacks the awareness to understand the complexities of world politics; to know whether she was being manipulated, misdirected, etc. Are you going to accuse me of being ‘childist’?

            I think contrary to what you say, the elite class are extremely concerned; late stage captialism, flagging world economy, running out of ways to make a profit.
            The financialisation of nature and ‘Green New Deals’ are a way to tap into previously inaccessible public funding and prolong the capitalist status quo a while longer.

          2. Nigel

            I don’t see how any sort of campaign which attracts media attention and gains access to political leaders is going to be distinguishable from whatever it is you’re describing here. In other words any campaign that succeeds is going to be implicated because of its success. Congratulations you’ve created a tautoligy that lets you cast aspersions from the sidelines.

  1. some old queen

    So it turns out that patients in Ennis hospital are not just dealing with all the usual HSE incompetence but also being force fed the voodoo death torture of sentinel beings called Halal.

    Blasphemy by other religious and other ethicals is somehow dismissed as not of relevance- how did that happen again?

      1. some old queen

        That comment is about it being forced into a hospital not schools- at least read it before trying to take someone down.

          1. some old queen

            My point should be fairly obvious- that it is being forced into certain places against people’s wishes.

            Now what is your point? Or is the point that you don’t have one?

      2. some old queen

        Ah there we have it- Islamophobia now is it? That it is being forced onto people against their wishes is of no relevance?

        This subject has resulted in a series of court cases in Britain and if they force it into schools here- the same thing is going to happen. And when the far right capitalise on the negative attention- sure we can all just blame the gays- or something.

    1. Listrade

      Having read X-Men comics since the early 80s, the death and torture of Sentinels is a good thing and I respect the HSE for forcing this on people.

    2. Lobster

      I understand that muslims have a religious requirement to kill animals for food by slitting the throat, and that in Ireland we ordinarily kill them with a bolt to the brain. I’m not convinced that either method is gentle and loving, or that there are any grounds for us to refuse halal meat. And even if we did, just go with the veggie option! I personally don’t feel particularly attached to the bolt to the brain method, but maybe that’s just me…

      1. Rob_G

        Agreed – unless someone is a vegan (which I am not, btw), this fascination with Halal slaughter, as opposed to any of the other unpleasant sh|t that we put animals through for our enjoyment, seems a sort of odd fixation.

  2. Formerly known as @ireland.com

    A slow news day :) . There was a time when BoJo would have resigned immediately, or would have been told to in short order. The Tory buffoons are using Trumpian tactics to ignore the law. I love the strategy of the old Etonians wanted to be seen as taking on the establishment. If people vote on that basis, they deserve the mess.

    1. shayna

      Like-wise in the USA – they voted George W. Bush for two terms. A breath of fresh air when Barack Obama was in The White House for eight years – Trump? – they voted – a deserved mess?

      1. shayna

        Although, to be fair to the British electorate – they voted Tory – Boris Johnson PMship was another hiccup, in the British system. General Election, of course. Corbyn?

        1. some old queen

          Today is going to be fun- Bercow intends to make it as uncomfortable for Johnson as possible and a contempt of parliament motion is on the cards. I cannot see how Attorney General Geoffrey Cox will survive because it was his advice which was acted on- likewise Cummings but the whole thing is so mad- God knows.

          1. Spaghetti Hoop

            I know it’s all very serious but I’m as excited about watching the Commons today as one would have been for the Breaking Bad finale some years ago.

          2. Otis Blue

            Nice parody from today’s Guardian

            “Have you paid fees to Eton School?

            You may have been mis-sold an educational product – and you could be entitled to a refund!

            Just text CON to ……… and our team at Girly Swot Solicitors will start your claim – TODAY!”

      2. some old queen

        Formal impeachment inquiry launched into Trump over Ukraine- whiter anything comes out of it or not is another story.

          1. italia'90

            There’s more than just Dems implicated here.
            Lots of powerful wealthy families from the Repugs too.

            Just a reminder for those that have forgotten, Pelosi refused to impeach GW Bush and Dick Chenney when she had the opportunity. She disgusts me tbh.

            If you read back about the Clinton administration years, he made sure Russia got billions in loans to help it get it’s economy greased.
            Yeltsin borrowed the money and signed it’s terms and repayment schedule.
            Along comes Putkin, tells America and the world banks where to go and keeps the money.
            Always follow the money folks.

    2. Spaghetti Hoop

      Recent events – Brexit, Thomas Cook, Supreme Court judgement, party conferences – have really exposed Britain’s class system. Who knows how British society and government will emerge after October 31st. One good thing is that many of their citizens are now politicised when pre-Brexit all they did was read the Strictly gossip in the Sun.

    3. eoin

      Chaos [today] = Chaos [yesterday] + 1

      I might get this on a t-shirt as gifts for Christmas, just three months away today.

  3. some old queen

    Discontented rural Ireland fertile ground for populists- Jennifer O’Connell

    https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/discontented-rural-ireland-fertile-ground-for-populists-1.4029090

    “Some of those protesting against direct provision centres betray the same kind of cognitive dissonance, insisting it is not the people they’re opposed to; just the large numbers of them. Or, they say, it is the inhumanity of the system of direct provision they oppose, even if it never occurred to them to march against it before.”

    Jennifer writes about the danger of populism in rural Ireland and then makes that incredibly patronising statement. In the case of Oughterard it is EXCATLY the large numbers they are opposed to. And the fact that they weren’t protesting beforehand is an accusation that could be levelled at practically everyone in the country who disagrees with the direct provision system.

    The bottom line is that immigrants coming into the country do not affect affluent areas anywhere near as much as poorer and rural. The blatant disregard of these communities shown by the DOJ is the core reason why they become fertile ground for the far right- nothing else.

    If Jennifer or anyone else is going to write about this subject then at the very least- lay the blame where it belongs.

    1. Rob_G

      While everyone agrees that things like prisons, drug treatment centres, sheltered accomodation, etc. are essential for the running of society, people don’t want them to open near them – somewhat understandably.
      That’s all there is to it.

      Also, O’Connell is right on the money with the residents of Oughterard’s new-found interest in the issue of Direct Provision.

      1. Verbatim

        How do you know what the residents of Oughterard thought about Direct Provision before the march? Sure each and everyone of them had some thoughts on the subject, but it’s now that they all get together and march that they are condemned. I’ve read a few of O’Connell’s pieces and find them toe curling awful.

        1. Rob_G

          It’s mad that DP has been with us for 20 years, but people in Oughterard only felt strongly enough about to march about it when it started to look like it might affect their property prices – some coincidence, that.

          1. some old queen

            Yup- just keep painting it all as self interest eh? There couldn’t possibly be any other explanation which fits the narrative.

          2. Rob_G

            Everyone acts in their own self-interest first and foremost; there is nothing inherently wrong with this. The fact that residents are pretending that their objections are about the DP system in general (which never seemed to have exercised them much before) rather than the centre that is being opened in their town does seem a little cynical, however.

      2. some old queen

        There is quite a difference between your average nimbyism in Dublin 4 and 300 immigrants begging around a small village which is reliant on tourism don’t you think?

        1. Rob_G

          No.

          I don’t think that the people of Oughterard are bad people for feeling put out at having to carry the can in this instance. But governments need to put these types of essential services somewhere, and wherever they put it, there will always be someone put out.

          They have to put somewhere though, and between a village with a vacant hotel (one close to Galway city, it should be noted) and cities where accommodation is already under strain, I am not surprised that the government decided to go with the former.

          1. some old queen

            Direct Provision is not an essential service – but even then, the accommodation should be subject to the same planning rules and regulations as all other redevelopments or new builds.

  4. eoin

    Did you catch the tonight show on TV3 last night. Regular guest, the editor of the “Irish” Daily Mail , Sebastian Hamilton was on again, looks like a weekly appearance now. Was the Shinner, the FFer, the FGer asked their views first? No, Sebastian was guest #1 to give his views on the issues of the day, I think the Bojo court thing, and of course the Mail was the paper which demonised the judiciary when Gina Millier first popped up in the wake of Brexit. I switched off before I could hear what convicted criminal Sebastian had to say. As you’ll recall, Sebastian, who has the reputation for being a bit of a dosser, was convicted in the criminal courts in July for contempt in relation to an article in the Mail on the trial of the murdered child from Lucan. The conviction came even as Sebastian pleaded with the court to stop short of a conviction because he was currently applying for Irish citizenship and he was worried a criminal conviction would affect his application. The judge was not impressed and Sebastian was fined €4,500.

    And on today’s “Irish” Mail, you have Matt Cooper featured, the co-presenter of the Tonight show.

    Circle jerk or what. The only ray of hope is, the Tonight show is struggling with ratings in its new season, despite the Micheal Martin interview and the fact it still gets TDs to appear. The “Irish” Mail is selling around 26,000 copies a day.

  5. eoin

    90 minutes before the expected announcement that Wrightbus is to be liquidated.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-49818156

    The company employs 1,400, 86% of whom are Protestant, and makes buses for the likes of Dublin bus, but is best known for the Routemaster or Boris bus (the modern red double decker with the entrance at the rear, on London streets)

    Wrightbus has given £15 million to a church which is operated by the son of the Wrightbus founder. It is beset by allegations of impropriety but it is very popular and its services are slick, I mean US gospel TV slick.

    Wrightbus is also linked with the DUP.

    I’m expecting a major accounting scandal to be revealed, because its financial state in 2017 when it last reported was actually quite sound. Despite having revenues of £200m+, it is audited by a mom and pops local firm in Ballymena.

    Poo’s about to get real.

    1. shayna

      Ian Paisley Jnr was asked for comment this morning – his Dad’s church, The FreeBees were the recipients of a ton of cash. To paraphrase his comment, he was saddened by the loss of 1400 jobs – I’ll send a post-card from Mauritius.

      1. eoin

        I’m hopeful the administrators will be able to find a buyer when the financial state of the company is clarified and the founder and his apostles are shown the door. It has some good product, staff and systems. Hopefully its future working practices won’t be overshadowed by religious matters and it becomes a socially inclusive workplace. I would also be worried for the livelihoods of local suppliers.

    2. scundered

      why would the religion of workers matter to you? If it were a company in Dublin would you be making a point about religion? Weird.

      1. SB

        Because surely going by the religion statistics in the North, only about 55% of the workers would be Protestant. It’s harking back to the old days and “jobs for the Sammys”

        1. Cian

          This 55% may be true for the 6 counties as a whole.
          But this is a small area and a sub-set of the population.
          This area may have a different percentage breakdown – and this would be reflected in the numbers working.
          Secondly, one should only look at those aged 18-65 (say) as this is the cohort from which the workers should be compared.

        2. scundered

          It doesn’t work that way. Companies are supposed to reflect the breakdown of the local community generally and that’s a very protestant area, in exactly the same way you would expect to see high percentage of Catholics in nationalist areas. It just shows bigotry by the poster.

          1. some old queen

            The area is 68% registered as Protestant but eoin has obviously had some bad experiences while growing up in the north.

            As before- mine was after coming out while working in the HQ of the Council of Catholic Maintained Schools (CCMS), Holywood, Co.Down- disband immediately and- strictly no Halal or other religious beliefs allowed in the classroom.

  6. eoin

    6:3 to everyone’s favorite anti-unicornist, who has just sued journo and occasional contributor here, Bryan Wall.

    She’s represented by Kevin Winters crowd again. Seriously, Kevin. Tsk, tsk, tsk.

      1. some old queen

        Media platforms react to complaints- the more there is, the more likely they are to take action- although twitter can be very slow to respond.

    1. some old queen

      It’ is getting to the point where if you have not received a solicitor’s letter- you kind of feel left out- eh Bodger?

  7. eoin

    Shame to see Xpose axed by Virgin on TV3. It always seemed like a snappy and fun show, the business side of Zoolander, despite being thinly disguised marketing. Good luck to them, will anyone online pick it up?

    1. V

      Thinly disguised

      Ah now c’mon E
      Were you just too distracted by these gorgeous – in fairness they are, women to notice what the show was really at?

      Or how shabby the production budgets they had to work with

    2. rotide

      just dropping by to insert some facts here.

      Virgin decided that sport is thier main selling point and spending focus and as a result have been cutting back on all in house production since taking over. a few months ago they laid off a lot of the production staff responsible for their in house entertainment shows (stuff like Ireland’s Killers and top ten type of pundit shows)

      imported formats like gogglebox will survive but anything involving tv3 staff (bar the tonight show, which from a production point of view is basically the news) probably won’t.

      1. V

        So for a Rotide himself fact
        Virgin are focusing on Sport and The Tonight Show

        And will they be rebranding too Rotide

        Let’s see; Dave and Joe are gone, so is ManShed

        VirMen works for me

        And in fairness
        A Man Stuff type set up is in the right spot there on the Ballymount Road

  8. eoin

    Half way through Edward Snowden’s new book “Permanent Record” and it really is jaw dropping. At some time between 2005-2008 the US embassy staff in Geneva deliberated got a local bank employee “plastered” drunk and make him drive home, then called the cops on him. In Switzerland, drink driving is serious poo because the fine is linked to your salary and could be 10s of thousands. The USA offered to help the employee out financially, but he sussed he was set up and told them to fupp off. The employee was from Saudi Arabia and was returned home in disgrace, his career and life in tatters. What had the employee done wrong? Nothing, he just may have had access to banking records of people who were of interest to the US.

    Edward says US embassies are no more than spying outposts. Interesting, what are the spying on in Ireland? Shannon? Tech companies? The cloud and data centres?

    Edward also reveals a Swisscom (equivalent of Eir) handed over phone/internet records to the USA for bribes in Geneva.

    The book is #1 on Amazon despite the US govt trying to stop it. Available in Ireland at Waterstones for €16 (discounted). Get it while you can!

  9. eoin

    ” The European Environment Agency estimates that there were 1,180 premature deaths
    in Ireland in 2016 due to poor air quality”

    https://www.epa.ie/pubs/reports/air/quality/Air%20Quality%20In%20Ireland%202018.pdf

    Compare that with around 600 die through suicide, 150 through road deaths.

    Yet, FG is sitting on its hands with banning smoky coal. Like it’s sitting on its hands on new drilling licences. It’s like it says one thing, but acts in a way which is 180 degrees opposite.

  10. martco

    this latest episode of Brexit is amazing to watch
    all the jubilation over the court decision
    but the mission was accomplished weeks ago

    bojo is a distraction & will just continue to distract with the buffoonery whilst we all watch on operating by normal rules of play & expecting normal rules of play results

    Britain – the 51st state of the United States of Trump

    1. Verbatim

      Yeah, who would have thought the court would have made that decision, they will try everything to stay in the EU. It will drag on and on and eventually the ruling class will have their way. Are any of the betting offices taking bets that UK will NOT leave?

      1. Formerly Known As @ireland.com

        The court made the correct decision. When the 17.4 million Brexiteers can state that they all agreed on a single exit plan, then they can go. Another referendum with two real options, no fake red buses, no Russian involvement, etc., is the best option. It will be a mess no matter what as people are passionately divided.

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