Daniel asks:
It just occurred to me how many of my friends (and myself…) can’t vote in the referendum because we’re not Irish citizens. Polish, English, Lithuanians and everyone else. According to 2011 census over half a million people. Many of which are here for years and planning to stay.
Makes me wonder if it’s time to review the system as well. Particularly for citizens of EU countries which would have no any other reason to get citizenship. Living, working and paying taxes in Ireland for the past 11 years, civil partner to an Irish citizen, and planning on staying here for good, I think I earned my right to vote?
(Sam Boal/Photocall Ireland)
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Become a citizen.
That’s another €1k.
Just to clarify: that’s how much application cost. The only real benefit would be right to vote. I also believe I’d need to give up polish citizenship to do that. At the same time I’m entitled to vote in Poland which is crazy bearing in mind I’ve no idea about polish politics or problems of people who actually live there.
Become a citizen.
Had 11years to save.
Yikes – I probably wouldn’t pay that, either.
Still, think about – we have a referendum here about every 3 or four years on average, so if you plan on living another 40 years, that works out at the bargain price of only… €100 per referendum.
Nah, I probably wouldn’t bother.
€55 in France
Surely Irish citizens should be required to change an Irish constitution. Full stop. Nothing too controversial in that, I would have thought.
Only Irish citizens can change the constitution AND vote for President.
British can vote in all other elections.
EU can vote in local and European elections.
Non-Eu can vote in Local elections.
I guess that the rationale behind it is that changing the Constitution is a big deal, hence only allowing citizens to vote on it. If you plan on staying here for good, why not become a citizen?
“Poop, or get off the pot”, as I understand the expression goes…
You can earn it already. Simply become a naturalised citizen.
To the best of my knowledge everyone pays €175 registration fee then €950 if the application is accepted. These fees cannot be waived. Brian, can you link to information which contradicts this?
You can have mine if you like, just let me know which way you want to vote. (Not the presidential age one, I’m voting no on that. The other one.)
don’t be mad, we want your moneis, none of your crazy progressive ideas. mind you Poles and Lithuanians by and large are more far more conservative than the average paddy so maybe best to leave it ‘au
Even though I’m an Irish citizen, because I live in London I’m not entitled to vote at home. Yet as soon as I had my first address here in the the UK I was welcome to vote over here without having to give up my Irish citizenship. Seems like the sensible way to do it.
In fairness, I’m fairly certain that Daniel would be allowed to vote in every other type of vote other than referendum.
Nope. He can only vote in local and European elections:
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/moving_country/moving_to_ireland/introduction_to_the_irish_system/right_to_vote.html#l862a3
UK citizens resident here can vote in the General Election here too. EU citizens can vote in European elections and local elections and all residents may vote in local elections. But only Irish citizens resident here can vote for the President or in a referendum vote.
I think I’ve got that right.
Yes, you have. As a British citizen (who has lived here a loooong time) I can vote in everything except referenda and Presidential elections because both of those are connected to the constitution, and only citizens can have any say on something constitutional. As someone who would give my eye teeth to vote in this referendum, I can completely see the rationale for these rules, and I don’t think they should be changed. What does need changing is the €1000 fee for taking out Irish citizenship. I qualify ten times over, and talk about doing it every few years. But despite being lucky enough to have a job and a decent salary, I also have a mortgage and the usual costs, and I never quite seem to able to spare €1000. And for people who earn less than I do, I would imagine it’s often not even worth considering as a cost. I understand that there are administrative costs to processing and checking applications, but €1000 does seem prohibitively high. I have no idea how it compares to other citizenship application costs (the UK, for example?), but I do wonder if it needs to be quite so high.
It used to be €160 I believe, and process was taking 24 months. They reformed it around 2010 if I remember correctly, it’s (only) 6 months now but cost in total just short of €1000… But that’s nothing, my English friends, couple, with 2 kids no way could throw away €2k between them just for sake of voting… They’re here just over 8 years now.
True that; passport costs €80, surely it involves more-or-less the same degree of paperwork?
yes, I would imagine it is about the same workload, especially as the onus to provide proof of residency etc is on the applicant and is really quite onerous (which is also OK with me, I’m happy to fill out the forms and provide the payslips, utility bills etc). Checking the paperwork I provide surely couldn’t cost €1000?
$680 in the U.S.
that’s about half the cost (currency fluctuations allowing)!!
+ 3 years in the military
Do You Want To Know More ! ?
AU$260 for Aussie citizenship, that is about eu187.
I would think that if someone has permanent residency (say after five years), they’re living under the laws made by those we vote in, and under the constitution we sometimes vote to amend. I’d say they have a right to vote.
Emigrants who’ve left the country and don’t have to face the consequences of their vote, no. Dar liom, anyway.
The constitution should only be decided by citizens.
DEY TOOK OUR JEERRBS
“Many of which are here for years and planning to stay”
Yep – you become a Citizen, it cost €900. End of. Its Ireland’s Constitution, not Europe’s.
I hate the phrase “end of.”It always seems like an attempt to shut down discussion, which it generally is
I think if you plan on staying in Ireland you should definitely become a citizen. The question I would have is why does it cost 1,000 euro?
I’ll sell you my vote for €90, but you have to tell me what way you’re voting first. A NO has an additional moral cost.
“Yep – you become a Citizen, it cost €900. End of”
No, it cost’s €175 + €950 = €1,125.
I think there’s a word in Russian for that; tuffshitski.
I imagine that it costs c.€1,000 because they actually want to cover their admin costs.
I thought the British were subjects, not citizens?!
Under the 1981 British Nationality Act, the usual category of British nationality is British Citizenship.
Subject status still exists in a relatively rare cases where people born in Ireland and India before independence were able to claim a degree of British nationality provided they worked for the state in some capacity.
To further confuse things, British Citizens are still Subjects of the Crown, but in a vague, unwritten constitutional sense that no longer has any legal application.
Duh.
“It just occurred to me how many of my friends (and myself…) can’t vote in the referendum because we’re not Irish* citizens.”
*Insert country of choice: Zimbabwe, Japan, Brazil, etc.
LIkewise, why can’t I vote in Polish, Lithuanian, Estonia referendums?
I doubt many irish who emigrated would want to give up their irish nationality as they are proud of it. Likewise for immigrants to thid country. As a non irish citizen living in Ireland for 10 years with an irish spouse and children born here, ive paid my taxes, contributed to the state, helped to pay off the debt through my taxes as has every irish tax paying citizen here. But despite the constitution, I believe I should be able to decide on matters affecting the country I live in without having to give up my nationality. Does the outcome not affect me as much as an irish citizen?
Simple.. constitution is for citizens, so become a citizen.. if you’ve been here for 11 years, stop whinging about the €950 charge and pay it if it’s so important to you.. It works out at 23 p per day
welcome new Irish citizen … heres your €60,000 share of the debt and let the gouging begin
1000eu is a bit steep. Shouldn’t the country be encouraging people to become citizens?
If you are Irish, or from the British “Commonwealth”, and were on the electoral roll in Australia before 1984, you can vote in Aussie elections and referenda.
http://www.aec.gov.au/enrolling_to_vote/british_subjects.htm
I wasn’t aware of the Irish people getting the right until I read that page.
“Ireland is not a British Commonwealth country but is to be treated as such.”
So, you can be in OZ for 32 years or more, not bother to become a citizen, and still vote in Aussie elections and referenda.
I think the bigger issue is Irish citizens abroad can’t vote on constitutional issues.
Why is it an issue? I live abroad and I don’t have a problem with it.
Well for ye. I also live abroad and I do. I think most people who are abroad and can’t make it home to take part in the upcoming referendum on Gay marriage (most young, most liberal and most in favour of equal marriage rights for all) would like to have their voice on their countries future heard. It’s especially bad when Ireland is one of the few countries in the Europe who don’t let their citizens vote when abroad.
You can still volunteer to help out with canvassing and fundraising for a YES vote even if you’re not an irish citizen! Check out the marriage equality website for maps and diary of events.
What makes you think they want to vote yes?