47 thoughts on “Yes And No

    1. ABM

      It’s the first fact-based, intellectual discussion I’ve heard of in the entire campaign.

      Everything else I’ve seen and heard is based on rhetoric and appeals to emotion.

      I hope they get to have their discussion in peace. Just what would Newman think of the UCD of today?

      Senator Ronan Mullen hasn’t even so much as a parking ticket to him name, yet he’s a basically a national hate figure. He can’t even give his views at an event in his own constituency without having to have An Garda Siochana on call.

      1. The People's Hero

        You wouldn’t recognise a ‘fact’ if it slapped you on the arse and called you Nancy….

      2. bisted

        ‘…Senator Ronan Mullen hasn’t even so much as a parking ticket to him name…’ aren’t cancellation of parking tickets and penalty points Oireachtas perks?

      3. scottser

        ‘He can’t even give his views at an event in his own constituency without having to have An Garda Siochana on call.’

        that’s cos his views are pretty hateful, intrusive, hypocritical and backward.

      4. DT

        You’re right in one sense: the Yes campaign has centered on a lot of emotional arguments. There are a lot of sound rational arguments to vote Yes also, but the campaign has focused predominantly on emotional messaging – why can’t 2 people who love each other get married, etc.

        In previous referenda it’s generally been the other way around: the conservative Catholic side tend to use highly emotive angles – Hello Divorce, GoodBye Daddy, Don’t Kill Innocent Babies, etc. – while the ‘Yes’ side are left making more nuanced, rational arguments.

        Generally, more emotional messaging works best, but the difficulty for the No side is that there is really no compelling emotional angle at all for them in this campaign. ‘All kids deserve a mother and father’ is incredibly lame.

        There’s still a rump of people (about 30%) who’ll vote No regardless. But the soft Yes/No people (probably about 40%) are not being given any compelling argument, rational or emotional, to vote No. Because, try as you might to manufacture one, there is no compelling reason to vote No.

      5. Rob

        ABM, I agree that this referendum should be discussed but as you can see from the replies you got some people just don’t want any discussion.

        1. Bob

          There’s discussion and there’s openly lying to the public and evading the actual subject by muddying the water in an attempt to confuse the voters. Not really sure why usurping the democratic process should be promoted or defended.

          1. Ppads

            Spot on. The issue of children is completely separate and has been already been legislated for. Rather than openly stating that gay people should still be sitting at the back of the bus they are asking people to vote on an issue that does not exist. That is at best disingenuous and will be challenged.

      6. Jane

        So you’ve time travelled to later on tonight and this is an accurate field report? Care to summarise the arguments for those of us who are stuck in the present?

      7. Starina

        How exactly is “This may be your only chance to hear the NO side” unemotional? It sounds like alarmist scare-mongering to me.

      1. Drogg

        From the poster “Acknowledging UCD’s position as a key centre for debate and learning” so they are giving a soapbox to two men who actively deny evidence and use falsifications to emphasise their points while having no one to contradict them.

      1. newsjustin

        Yeah, it’s a seminar. I think they might be secretly trying to get people to vote No. Shocking.

    1. The People's Hero

      Lovely! Opus Dei…. God’s way of permitting men to beat the crap out of themselves, their wives and their kids….

      Another group of wangdoodles the world could do without…

    1. Don Pidgeoni

      I know right? I can’t even think how the no side would be human rights? No one is forcing you to vote yes if you dont agree

    1. Grace

      Yeh Bobster you stick it to the man and vote no!
      Don’t bother your head at all about the message that would send to someone like me, who would love to get married to my girlfriend of 8 years

      Sure isnt it all some Government/liberal/Labour party conspiracy anyway??

      No seriously, vote yes:)

      1. Martín Mothúcháin

        I think you should probably wait until your girlfriend’s 18 before you marry her. ;-P

        Seriously though, vote yes. End of.

    2. Starina

      the level of kafkaesque twisted logic used by the no side is really astounding sometimes.

    3. NICE anne (dammit)

      Vote no if that is what your conscience dictates.

      Vote no if you believe that sections of Irish society deserve to be marginalised.

      Vote no if you believe that who you legally love should dictate what you can and cannot do with your life.

      Vote no if you want Ireland to be seen a peasant filled backwater of impressionable little islanders afraid of the big spook in the sky.

      Vote no if you hate the idea of Ireland been seen as a modern progressive inclusive society who is proud of, and loves all her citizens equally.

      For some or all of those reasons, vote No if you must. Just be ready to be unable to look your LGBT friends, colleagues, children and relatives in the eye as they one day wonder who could have been so uncaring as to want to deny them their equality and basic civil rights once upon a time.

  1. Ppads

    Stick six children together of different races abilities and backgrounds and they see none of it, they just see each other. The day that every Irish adult sees two hands joined together in love before their owner’s gender is when equality has really been achieved. Maybe it is about the children after all?
    Vote Yes.

  2. Owen

    Did anybody go to this? What was the human rights case for no? Im curious if there was any worthwhile comment in it or just thr usual crap.

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