Greece Frightening

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Bank of Greece pleads with both sides to make a deal to avoid ‘uncontrollable crisis’ – live (Telegraph)

23 thoughts on “Greece Frightening

  1. Odis

    On the one hand the gambling debts of the (mostly) German banks have been passed on to the Greek citizen, which is immoral and wrong and a shocking and arrogant abuse of power.

    On the other hand, the Greeks want to remain in the Euro, but on there own terms. It seems to be requesting that the Euro regime accommodate them.

    The only honest course would be to leave the Euro and re-introduce the drachma.

    It’s time to **** or get off the pot.

      1. Norbet Cooper

        If they actually collected the 10 – 20bn estimated tax every year that goes astray through “The national sport” of under declaration and avoidance they would have less of a problem.

        FT reports that 5,000 Greeks declare earning more then 100,000 PA in a country of 11 million, while this might be at the lower end of the scale, the Greek Gov claims it’s never been higher then 15,000. Lets put this in perspective, in Ireland that figure is 129, 919 people for a pop of 4.5 million.

        1. scottser

          i hardly think we’re in a position to criticise the greeks when you see the scale of tax avoidance from our own millionaires.

          1. Norbet Cooper

            The majority of people here and in europe pay or have little choice what they owe. It should be noted that the top 6% of top earners in Ireland pay 43% of the tax take here, Greece can posture all it wants of been hard done by foreign vested interests, but unless they address endemic tax evasion efficiently they are sunk.

        2. Zarathustra

          It’s endemic, from the small local shopkeeper/ bar/ restaurant, right up to the government itself, although PASOK, under Andreas Papandreou, were the biggest culprits. Yet, if you mention the state of the health system or the lack of basic infrastructure particularly on the islands, in conversation, they blame Europe. Anyway, most of the people I knew who didn’t declare their taxes and pay proper wages really couldn’t see a problem with what they were doing, their mentality was that they were looking after No. 1 and as long as they could afford private health insurance and private lessons for their children, or, the latest Ducati/ Harley, that was all that mattered.

          1. Joe the Lion

            You must have felt right at home – that’s the rugby playing class here down to a tee

    1. Owen C

      what do u mean “passed on to the Greek citizens”? They were the ones that initially borrowed it. There is no passing on necessary.

      1. Odis

        That’s untrue Owen. Consider Ireland where say Anglo Irish bank borrowed lots of money from Europe to loan to property developers with private planes and houses on Shrewsbury Road.. That money was not lent to me you or, I would suggest any other Broadsheet commenter on here.

        It was lent to the likes Johnny Ronan and Sean Dunne. Yet we the citizens and taxpayers of Ireland are stuck with the debt. It is our “duty” to pay for the profligacy and stupidity of others.

        pro tip: Its not your debt unless you sign for it and are loaned the money.

    1. Delta Other Alphabet Numbers

      Stay well clear of bond markets and go into long/short strategies for equities. Anything in bonds has already lost up to 20% value int he past week or so. Interest rates increasing will only deplete them further.
      You’re better off in cash than bonds at the minute.

    2. ahjayzis

      They’re running a primary surplus – they’re spending more than their income due to debt repayments as a result of running a primary deficit beforehand – give ’em a ten year repayment holiday I say, until their surplus is enough to cover the debt repayments, or it’ll be in the red forever

      1. Rob_G

        That would be all well and good, but they are asking their Eurozone partners to lend them more money on basis of structural reforms which they never seem to carry out.

        Bit unfair of Greece to ask that countries like Portugal and Latvia, that are poorer than them and have had their own financial problems, bankroll their low-tax/high-spend govt.

  2. manolo

    There is a lot of accumulated wealth out there looking to make money out of their money, knowing that true wealth is produced, not speculated. In fact, there is far too much of that speculative money – pensions, national reserves, personal wealth – and not enough productivity to satisfy their appetite for more wealth.

    Maybe we are finally approaching a stand off between the ‘money reserve’ people (who make a living from speculating rather than producing) and society at large. They are scared, their long lasting system is being threatened. They know that the value of their wealth is dependent on society acknowledging it. Otherwise it is as good as poop.

  3. Mr. T.

    Ah look at you all, believing the last thing you read in a newspaper owned by a billionaire.

    None of you have first hand experience of the crisis. None of you know what it is to be Greek. None of you have an independently researched opinion.

    1. Odis

      I always read newspapars owned by billionaires when I’m grinding down the proletariat or thinking what I should invest my latest billion in.

      As for not being a Greek. I can’t help it if I was born of the Irish Aryan race, unlike some filthy South European peasant, who can’t be bothered paying his taxes.

      You need to pick some more olives Stavros!

    2. Rob_G

      “Ah look at you all, believing the last thing you read in a newspaper owned by a billionaire.”
      – not sure how that’s relevant?

      “None of you have first hand experience of the crisis.”
      – Irish people have lots of experience; we tightened our collective belts, reformed the public sector (well, a bit) and are now the fastest growing economy in the EU

      None of you know what it is to be Greek.
      – true, but Greece is actually looking to borrow money from Eurozone taxpayers (including Irish taxpayers – €300m to date), so we do have something at stake in this.

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