mma

Charlie Ward (left) and Joao Carvalho during their bout in Dublin last Saturday

[Joao] Carvalho was taken to Beaumont for emergency surgery following the Total Extreme Fighting 1 event at the National Stadium in Dublin on Saturday night.

According to the Facebook page of Carvalho’s gym – Team Nobrega – he passed away at 9:35pm last night.

Charlie ‘The Hospital’ Ward scored a third round TKO victory over Joao Carvalho at the National Stadium.

MMA Fighter Joao Carvalho dies after event at the National Stadium (The Irish Sun)

91 thoughts on “Losing The Fight

  1. Bertie Blenkinsop

    I love boxing and I know all of the dangers associated with it but I just don’t see the attraction of MMA.

    Very sad for all involved, may he RIP.

    1. ahyeah

      Agree with this.

      I don’t like to be in agreement with Ray D’Arcy, but there’s a lot not right about MMA. Being permitted/required to administer 4 or 5 additional punches to the head after the fight has already clearly been won makes for pretty uncomfortable viewing.

      1. bertie blenkinsop

        Teams don’t go out on the pitch with the absolute intention of maiming and injuring their opponents.

        Well apart from Armagh, I’ll give you that one.

        1. MoyestWithExcitement

          Speaking of nordies, I reckon road racing is fupping insane. A *few* people have died doing that. Flying around the gaff on a bike at 120mph is seriously mental. Should that be out? F1? There are lots of sports and physical activities (good few deaths climbing everest like and I’m sure plenty of other mountains) that pose serious health risks the question is whether or not people should be free to do what they like. If someone wants to get punched in the face for a cheque, that’s up to them, I reckon.

  2. Panty Christ

    Dreadfully sad. A sport that allows an unconscious and defenceless opponent to be subjected to two or three more head impacts just to be sure of his submission is not a sport, it’s cruelty.

    1. Medium Sized C

      He wasn’t unconscious.
      Also the “sport” doesn’t allow that.
      The ref messed up… badly looking back at it.

      And It was a stoppage not a submission.

      1. MoyestWithExcitement

        +1 A boxing ref will let someone with a clear concussion continue. The moment you stop defending yourself intelligently in MMA, the match gets called. If people have no issue with boxing then they shouldn’t have with mma. It’s safer than boxing.

  3. Eamonn Clancy

    A horrible tragedy. But a cue, none the less, for MMA and McGregor haters to go apoplectic.

    1. Liam from Lixnaw

      MMA & McGregor’s biggest local champion, joe.ie, has no reference to this story at the moment. its on their sports offshoot however but not main blog – at this time

      1. Donger

        They’ll probably go with something along the lines of, “YOULL NEVER GUESS WHAT HAPPENED THIS MMA FIGHTER NEXT!”

  4. Polaroid Fluid

    ban this nonsense, it just appeals to the lowest scobies and simpletons the world over

  5. Owen

    The fight is on Youtube. I’m not putting up the link cause its effectively watching someone be killed.

    People will blame the ref for not stepping in. I think that is incorrect. If you can punch someone 9 times (all big right hands) to the back/side of his head, while he is on his hands and knees, then celebrate, the problem is not the ref.

    1. Medium Sized C

      He was out on his feet.
      He dropped badly when he was hit again.

      The ref should have stepped in when he went down.
      They have a responsibility to intervene when a fighter is unable to defend themselves, its kind of how the sport is supposed to work.

      1. Owen

        Nope. My point is that if you can beat someone like that and then celebrate without even momentarily stopping to think of the damage, to see if they are ok, or even looking at the ref….

        the problem is not the ref, its the sport and its participants.

          1. Medium Sized C

            Yes father.

            But in a few decades I will probably hate everybody who celebrates winning a sporting competition. Old age embitters us all…..

      2. ReproBertie

        Given how many fighters fight and lose every weekend without dying it’s how the sport works the overwhelming majority of times.

  6. Bort

    Jesus, the video is brutal. The was rocked and was out of it, he then was taken down and took another 6 punches to the side of the head, the rules need to be looked at and the ref has to shoulder a lot of the responsibility

  7. Jesus Wept

    Not making any excuses for the ref,but the fighter appears concsious even after ref steps in to stop fight.Lethal damage had already been delivered though unbenkownst to one or both fighters.Tragic.

    1. Frilly Keane

      I saw that too
      Maybe the lad was already carrying an injury and it wasn’t picked up

      Another thing, someone else mentioned it above, the behaviour of the victor is, at best, ( ’cause someone might be watching) unhealthy.

      I don’t follow the sport myself. But if there is anyone about here who does, could the comment on whether this pair were even a fair match?

  8. Eoin

    This is a bit worrying. I remember all the injuries sustained when I was a kid, trying to emulate the WWF wrestlers. The ‘sleeper hold’ would have been the big danger back then. Now the kids will be trying to emulate the likes of McGregor and his cage fighting peers. I can see this sport being banned or restricted to the point where it’s not interesting anymore. i’m sure there will be more fatalities.

      1. newsjustin

        WWF is like ballet compared to MMA.

        Boxing is more troublesome, but at least it’s fairly well regulated and has a modicum of respect.

        MMA is unvarnished thuggery.

      2. ReproBertie

        Nor has rugby, MotoGp, Formula One, soccer, cricket or cycling to name a few other sports where competitors died.

        1. newsjustin

          Is the aim of those sports in beat ones opponent into unconciousness or immobility? If not, that’s probably the answer.

          1. ReproBertie

            Well if those are your only criteria then boxing, judo, tae kwon do and kick boxing have not been banned.

            Of course a sport where committing violence is the aim tends to spend a lot of time training participants in how to avoid the same violence. Maybe the sports where people died but violence is not the aim should be the ones under most scrutiny.

        2. Medium Sized C

          Yep.

          Although there is a subset of sports where competitors have died by having violence done and the violence is a celebrated by the sport.
          So most you your additions get kind of pulled off the list.

          Rugby. You are on to something there.

  9. ForFecksSake

    I am shocked that a sport based on hurting your opponent has lead to someone’s death. The sport is just violence.

  10. Irlandesa

    I love boxing and Muay Thai and admire most martial arts, but MMA is just plain brawling. Nothing noble about hitting someone when they are already on the floor.

  11. oilmundo

    In the recent Irish documentary on the MMA scene in Ireland, one local fighter called ‘Johnny Jitsu’ (who runs a MMA gym and coaches fighters too) compared psyching himself up for a fight to getting ready for a fight outside the local chipper. That’s from the mouth of a participant and it just about sums up the level that this sport is at.

    1. Medium Sized C

      Yeah, he came across as a bit stupid.

      Which is funny.
      Because so do you with this stupid post.

      Seriously, you think one guy, who (as it happens) isn’t even that significant in the sport, is enough to judge a whole sport?

      Do you have any idea how many idiots play and coach football?

      1. oilmundo

        What does it matter if he is significant or not? It wouldn’t matter if it was McGregor or him, he is an MMA fighter.

        Idiots play every sport but it’s reasonable to suggest that most don’t treat their sport like a fight outside a chipper. I coach football, idiotically enough, and have met all sorts, but have yet to meet anyone who wants to wants to harm the players as their main aim.

        Maybe I was wrong to suggest it typifies the sport as it was just one quote from one fighter but the documentary featured a number of young fighters who seemed punch-drunk with stupidity and dubious motives. That said, the more balanced, sensible comments may well have ended up on the floor of the editing room.

        1. My Meaty Member

          the stupidity of this so-called ‘sport’ is only mirrored by the sheep-like and frankly, clearly post-op traumatised mindsight of those who claim to be fans of it, swept along like so many empty rattling oilcans in a tsunami of blissful ignorance.

          1. Medium Sized C

            You made it very hard to decipher your point… Which doesn’t actually make any sense.

          2. My Meaty Member

            It was too literate for you sweetie? Too much metaphor and allusion? Sorry I’ll dumb my comments down for you next time

    2. 15 cents

      theres loads of fighters like that. unsurprisingly, given the nature of the ‘sport’.. nick diaz said its not a sport, to him it’s just a straight up fight like on the street, and when he goes in there he wants to kill the other guy. his brother nate diaz said similar, also mentioned killing, and said hes not goin for points or anything, he just wants to kill the other guy. modern day gladiators.

      1. ReproBertie

        Between them the Diaz brothers have had 66 professional MMA fights. How many people have they killed in the octagon?

          1. ReproBertie

            Well the logic of your argument is pretty solid but let me counter with, oh yes it is.

          2. ReproBertie

            sport/spɔːt/

            noun
            1.an activity involving physical exertion and skill in which an individual or team competes against another or others for entertainment.

        1. ReproBertie

          What you see when you watch something is coloured by your own wants, needs and beliefs. That’s why two sets of supporters can believe the ref was biased towards the other team.

          1. ReproBertie

            No, you can’t. That’s the point. The observer effect means that the act of observing will influence the phenomenon being observed.That’s why no two witnesses see the same thing. Everything you see is coloured by your own prejudices and beliefs.

          2. rotide

            Reprobertie, that’s twice on this thread you have completely gazumped Mr T.

            I only wish i could upvote you.

          3. f_lawless

            @ ReproBertie
            “The observer effect means that the act of observing will influence the phenomenon being observed.That’s why no two witnesses see the same thing. Everything you see is coloured by your own prejudices and beliefs.”
            Science fail! I think you’ve conflated the “Observer Effect” with “Confirmation Bias”, a type of cognitive bias: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias
            Tell me, how would two sets of supporters watching a match on TV in a pub have any influence over the match being observed? Some kinda cosmic brainwaves?!

          4. ReproBertie

            No, it’s not a science fail. My comments on the fans watching football were in relation to perception being a mirror. My comments on the observer effect were in response to the later post on just being observant. I can see how I should have been clearer though.

          5. f_lawless

            I’m afraid it is as the Observer Effect is not “why no two witnesses see the same thing” as you stated. The Observer Effect in terms of social sciences refers to how people change their behavior when aware of being watched and is not applicable to either percieving UFC as homo-erotic or judging a ref to be biased after watching a football match.

          6. ReproBertie

            As I said, I should have been clearer. The last two sentences in the post where I mention the observer effect should be the other way round. No two witnesses see the same thing because perception is coloured by prejudices and beliefs, not by the observer effect.

            My clearly confusing post has two points:
            1) one cannot just be observant because one’s prejudices and beliefs colour perception of the thing being observed and
            2) one cannot just be observant because the act of observing alters the phenomenon being observed.

  12. Tish Mahorey

    MMA is for scumbags, plain and simple.

    Stop making excuses for it, stop pretending it’s a sport. It’s nothing but organised scumbag street fights for money.

    There’s no heros in this, no role models for young kids. McGregor shooting his mouth off about things he doesn’t understand isn’t something kids should look up to. It’s mindless nonsense.

      1. Tish Mahorey

        Take your hand out of your pants there, dreaming of some young wan dropping her chips.”Oh Michaela, you’re so chav…. oh….”

  13. DrainBamaged

    It won’t be banned and it’s a tremendous sport. It’s truly tragic what happened but given the hundreds of thousands of bouts thay have taken place since the inception of the sport, fatalities are extremely rare. Catastrophic injury is extremely rare.

    These are adults who are choosing to compete in this sport. They know full well the risks involved. If we start dictating what athletic endeavour trained adults want to compete then where will it stop.

    Do some of you realise you can win an mma fight without throwing a single strike? I was at a recent event in Dublin where the majority of fights ended in submission and came away very impressed with the referees. This isn’t the ufc where world titles are at stake, so there was no point to allowing any competitor who was clearly not going to win to take unecessary punishment. It’s just amazing the doublethink of Irish people. Any sport with collisions and potential for brain trauma are dangerous, but mma is the one that gets demonised despite having nowhere near as many deaths or injuries.

    1. Owen

      “They know full well the risks involved.” – I disagree. Only now are the long-term effects in the NFL and Rugby becoming apparent. They were not known 30 yrs ago, even 10yrs ago.

      And what about Dementia pugilistica in boxing. Go listen to any interview with Joe Frazer in his later years, even a young Meldrick Taylor. Then go listen to a Nate Diaz interview. Tell me you can’t see a pattern there.

      The effect of this from boxing are only now clearly apparent. Given boxing started with 8oz and progressed to 10oz, and 16oz in sparing. How quick will the effects occur in MMA fighters?

      So I disagree with you, nobody knows full well the risks at this stage. Hence there should be some level of control. Be is more glove padding, standing counts, or only submissions once on the ground. I don’t know the ideal, but something has to change.

      Its terrible that this man Joao passed away. It would be horrible for his family, team mates, even his opponent. But if it leads to a progressive conversation on preventing it again then his loss will not have been in vain.

      1. ReproBertie

        Standing counts allow people to take more damage so that’s a bad move.
        Adding padding to gloves adds weight to the strike and causes more damage so that’s a bad move.

      2. DrainBamaged

        Standing counts and padding only lead to more trauma. So you don’t really know, sounds like you’ve read a deadspin cte article.
        No, since the 2000’s death or catastrophic injury is incredibly rare. I’ll be open to a debate once horse racing is banned. Then it won’t seem like utter hypocritical bullshit.

        1. Owen

          Just to quote myself, “i don’t know the ideal, but something has to change.”

          So the only point you raised in the above is one I raised myself, that I’m not in the ideal position to know. You noted that “They know full well the risks involved.” Given you are only commenting on catastrophic problems you are painfully unaware of the actual problems in contact sport, particularly boxing, and by proxy MMA in time (Dementia pugilistica). This is my exact point….. they are not aware.

          Horse racing is a pointless comparison. Chronic vs catastrophic. Its like comparing a plane crash to cancer.

          1. DrainBamaged

            Nooooo. Dementia pugilistica is in fact a type of CTE, so your information is out of date. There was Thai boxer from the Blackrock gym on Hook today. He and his team-mates and gym members are all too aware of the risks yet this is what they love.
            There is no way to make MMA safer inside the cage. Can’t make the gloves bigger as that prevents effective grappling. Head gear adds to increased trauma. And also as the problem is in NFL, when you pad someone up totally they feel like a human wrecking ball and don’t think they can be hurt.

  14. Christopher

    Anyone who has ever paid a cent to watch this trash are partly responsible. The people who fight do this for money not because they love to get their heads punched and kicked in.

  15. Trust in the News

    A sport that allows a participant to sustain injuries and to die later, needs to
    be investigated and shut down at once and then banned…..what civilised
    society would tolerate it.

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