Commuters walk the Green Line at Beechwood Luas to Dublin city centre as the Luas-Transdev dispute continues.
Turned out nice, in fairness.
Yesterday: Playing Fast And Luas
Previously: I Keep A Close Watch On This Heart Of Mine
Solution to the ‘rolling’ strike action:
Dundrum – Stephen’s Green in 4 mins (20 mins if you stop for traffic, there are no breaks, so, eh, good luck with that)
That’s a good idea!
“Drivers recently rejected an offer from Transdev of a 10pc pay rise.
The other three grades of workers at the company have agreed a deal worth 13pc.
But drivers claim they have narrowed the gap between their demands and what the company agreed in a Workplace Relations Commission deal they rejected.
The commission package equalled 18pc over 33 months.
The drivers are demanding a 22.5pc pay rise by 2019. They say a 26.5pc figure Transdev says they are demanding includes an increase of 4pc they are seeking in their bonus.
They say the 22.5pc demand would equal just over 4.5pc a year for each year of the five-year Transdev contract, which began in 2014”
So they’re looking for between 22.5-26.5% increase over five years (the first two backdated), at a time when Irish inflation has been pretty much zero and not expected to rise significantly any time soon. This would bring (in 2019) entry level driver pay (after induction periods) to c.€44k, plus a bonus of up to €3k. Senior drivers would earn almost €51.7k plus a bonus of €3.3k.
Indo story below. Transdev payscales here.
Thanks for some clear cut figures Owen, and their sources too :)
Unbelievable! This whole fiasco is mental! Unreasonable would be putting it mildly on behalf of the drivers.
Moyest, I thought it was 10%, no?
Didn’t you say it was 50%?
I did, and I was much closer than you ;)
Yet again, Moyest cunningly responds to every single comment other than the one that contradicts his bullpoo.
A personal vendetta against an anonymous commentator on an Internet blog. Thays not at all and embarrassing look for you.
I was merely concerned that may have overlooked Owen’s well-researched and thought-provoking comment.
Your troll buddy’s laughable comment was dealt with below. 10% over 3 years is what I said. That you and Owen think 22% over *5* years somehow “discredits” what I said is actually really really funny and the fact you’d bring up what I said weeks ago suggests a troubling obsession with me in your head.
Any measurement of inflation that doesn’t acknowledge a rent increase of 10% in Dublin is not a very helpful measurement. The cost of living in Dublin has risen dramatically in the last 2 years.
It didnt ackowledge the 25% fall in rents in 2009-2012 either. Pretty sure we weren’t saying how our cost of living had dramatically improved.
Yes, but certainly nobody got any pay rises during that period. Now that rents have increased to 2009 levels (greater, actually), and look set to continue increasing, isn’t negotiating a pay rise over the coming years that would address an increased cost of living a kind of normal and necessary thing? Or would you prefer them to be frozen in perpetuity?
No. but if u were paid XXX in 2009, and rent went down 25%, then obviously your cost of living decreased. But that was because of other negative factors in the economy, and not everyone gained from that etc. So we didn’t see it as a good thing necessarily or argue for 25% pay decreases. Likewise, rents in Dublin have indeed gone up, but (a) not everyone is hit by that, (b) if rent goes up 10% your cost of living probably goes up by 3-4% and (c) is there other things coming down in price that may offset that (petrol, income tax, mortgage rates). So i’m just saying you can’t look at rents in isolation.
but there are a lot of other increases and new charges since 2009 that means people have less money in their pocket. Also lotsof people have had pay cuts or lost their jobs in that time
I don’t disagree, but neither can you look at inflation rates in isolation!
well, inflation rates aren’t perfect, but they are at least supposed to give a good idea of how the overall ‘basket’ costs have changed. The problem with inflation is that the CSO basket may not represent YOUR standard basket of goods and services that you buy every month.
drivers should be sacked and replaced. It’s a low skilled job that doesn’t deserve the salary they are on currently
No. Unless you want to to any dispute with an employer can result in you being sacked. I don’t particularly agree or disagree with the LUAS drivers dispute but I respect their right to strike.
Just like the Gipper and the Air Traffic Controllers.
I would hope that they are training up new drivers right now?
Everyone, come join the hatred of our fellow citizens in their industrial dispute with a foreign owned multinational!
The spirit of 1916 replaced by the spirit of the employers of 1913.
Hate the unskilled!
Deny them opportunity to better the lives of their children!
Wallow in your self satisfied professional job!
Forget where your parents came from!
Loyalty to the employer over loyalty to your fellow citizens!
Read the Irish Independent!
Watch the Late Late Show!
Blame the poor for being poor!
I’m alright Jack so I don’t care about you!
I know. Working class people with a path to a reasonable standard of living. The very idea! I did journalism/graphic design/English in college which makes me better than them so no way they should not more money than me because everything is about me. They’ll probably just spend it on tattoos or gambling or pints like all working class people.
I think you’re channelling your own insecurities there. No one has said journalism/graphic design/English should be paid more, that i am aware of. Doctors, yes medical professionals with 5yrs+ training, are being used as an example. You should go see one for your problems.
Only you would trivialise mental illness to personally attack someone. Classy move.
being insecure is a mental illness? I thought it was just down to low self esteem. either that or you are admitting you actually do have mental problems? In which case you have my sympathy and support.
Anyways, what happened to the drivers looking for 10% pay increases? Sure the Waltons 40% of all US wealth could cover that handily, right?
And not a hint of irony.
So no response to either of your 10% or 40% claims then? We’ll just assume you made them up out of thin air and they have no credibility. Much like your good self.
Who’s we? You do whatever makes you feel better you strange little man. Nobody is going to notice.
Brilliant. You’ll neither explain, support or withdraw your previous wild claims. You’ll just pretend it never happened and hope people forget, throwing in the standard insults to create a diversion. You are a professional clown well worthy of a 22.5% pay increase (plus bonus).
For the record;
I’m trying to talk about the thread topic. Owen wants to talk about me. I think I can leave it there.
The thread topic involves a 22.5% pay claim (with an additional 4% covered via bonus increase) which you have previously claimed was only a 10% pay claim. Did this 10% pay claim ever exist?
Yep. http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/luas-strikes-easter-sunday-monday-7629128 10% over email years which is exactly what I said. I’m embarrassed I’ve humoured you this long so well done on that. Top notch trolling skills on your part.
Well Moyestie, Jack O’Connor should probably double check his figures. This is from the actual SIPTU officer involved….
“Siptu divisional organiser Owen Reidy insisted drivers were not looking for the WRC deal to be re-tabled.
“There’s no foundation in it – it’s completely false,” he said.
Where we’re at is 26.5% – which is still over the WRC proposals… No one has asked about less.”
He told the Irish Times: “There is no truth in this story. Drivers were offered 18.7 per cent, which they rejected, and have moderated that to 22.5 per cent over five years.”
One’s outer life passes in a solitude haunted by the masks of others; one’s inner life passes in a solitude hounded by the masks of oneself.
I’ve found most arguments are either “sure it’s only pushing a lever” which is nonsense, anyone’s job can be boiled down to “sure it’s only insert-trivial-task-here” or “but the nurses and gardai”, which, fine yeah, they should be on a lot more money but that doesn’t really have anything to do with a dispute between two other unrelated parties.
‘but that doesn’t really have anything to do with a dispute between two other unrelated parties.’
Of course it does. Salaries are effectively linked & each of these three groups (nurses, guards, Luas drivers) are being paid by the public. The reasonable level of a salary is all about how much other groups of workers are being paid.
Wage moderation is important in a small, open economy whatever one thinks about global inequality.
“I did journalism/graphic design/English in college which makes me better than them”
Yep.. that about sums up the last comment left on yesterday’s post about this.
Here’s what your man there says –
As a Graphic Designer I find it ludicrous that they’re being so petty. They’re paid enough and it’s a simple as that. They’re acting like pathetic children who’ve just been told they can’t play football on the green because they have to do their homework.
I’m two years out of college, I have a masters degree and two years professional experience. I earn 25K euro. After rent and bills it’s not an awful lot to be honest, i’d kill to even get their starting salary!
Why didn’t I leave school and land a job as Luas driver. I would have been better off and stress free. Luas drivers need a dose of reality.”
There you have it now.. He’s on 25k, and he has a masters..
That’s perfect…….almost TOO perfect. It’s exactly what I’m talking about. He has a degree so if he’s on 25k, the great unwashed should be on eff all as well.
There you go… great stuff altogether.
A masters and not two brain cells to rub together.
“I’m two years out of college, I have a masters degree and two years professional experience. I earn 25K euro”
Sounds like he’s a rubbish designer. I’d love to know what MA he did.
He should be on €35K start minimum. I reckon he’s just a dumb bottom.
You’re right – once you have self-identified with an in-group, never apply a critical evaluation to any of their actions ever!!
Yes because judging the payscale in one specific private company with your own entirely unrelated industry is “critical thinking”.
That’s nothing to do with anything I said; I was referring to the knee-jerk response of “striking workers = good, management = bad” in any industrial dispute, without weighing up the merits of each side’s argument.
(or the opposite, of course)
It had everything to do with what you said. Good God. I was sarcastically summarising through most prevent thought process from the anti strikers. My point was what you think is critical thinking is just whining from people with a very high sense of self importance.
They could just get rid of the trams altogether and turn it into single direction cycle lanes (left and right) and a bollarded off pedestrian walkway in the centre. It’d be quite nice.
Except for old people/people in wheelchairs and the like.
The lads in wheelchairs could bring a rope and lasso a passing cyclist.
I hate it when they do that. Especially on the hills.
Any Luas change for the poor drivers…..thanks bud!
Nice day for a walk, though. In fairness. Does you good to get some fresh air.
Groundhog day in the comment section.
The main problem with the users of the Green Line is what the walking the line fashion will be. What to wear on the walk in just in case my photo ends up in the paper, hmmm.
Maybe Roisin Ingle will write some trivial pointless rubbish about that in the Irish Times weekend.
The people in the comment section.