Time To Talk About Rent

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A Daft ad in May

On Wednesday, October 22, at 6pm.

A Banter discussion at Wigwam on Abbey Street Middle, Dublin 1, will focus on the cost of rent  today.

The panel will include Eithne Shortall (The Sunday Times Home Hunter column), Sive Bresnihan (Dublin Tenants Association), Lorcan Sirr (Dublin Institute of Technology) and Mandy Meredith (Associate Director, Sherry Fitgerald Lettings)

Banter writes:

Back in October 2013, Banter held a discussion about housing in the capital. After the boom and the bust, we thought back then that it was as bad as it could get and the struggle to find an affordable house to rent or buy seemed harder than ever.

Fastforward three years and the situation now is worse than ever before. Last week, figures from the Residential Tenancies Board showed that the cost of renting a home in the capital is now at an all-time high and that the average monthly cost of renting in Dublin in June 2016 was €113 higher than a year ago.

Rents are also increasing outside Dublin so there’s no escape. Add in record numbers of homeless families and you’ve a story which doesn’t appear to be getting any better, no matter what the Government promise or plan.

This Banter discussion will focus on the situation which exists in the city right now as regards renting, the possible solutions which could be introduced, the perpetual reluctance by the relevant authorities to do anything about this, the unwillingness to tackle social housing and how the current intransigence could play out.

FIGHT!

Banter: Generation Rent

The Only Way Is Essex

56 thoughts on “Time To Talk About Rent

  1. The Real Jane

    Let me be the first to say, private property I can do what I want no standards should apply hard working victims of political correctness and sjw who all want everyone to live in my house rent free well I say no I can do what I want with my private property. Also, hard working.

      1. Cool_Hand_Lucan

        Ayan Rand something something free will Josef Stalin something something keeping Dublin’s distinctive skyline.

    1. blueswannabe

      Yada yada, no magic solution bla bla, committee looking into… yada yada action plan 2020.. bla bla rent controls make matters worse.

    2. Caroline™

      Can I just make it clear, PTRB is a joke getting for free what hardworking PAYE paid full whack for entitlement culture can’t afford children don’t have them sacrifices made functioning market repossessions where’s my bailout Joe

  2. mamma roma

    seriously, with the levels of personal indebtedness in this country you want to take away from landlords the only way to keep up with their mortgages? and who do you think these landlords are going to vote for? I’m no landlord but any serious steps to force rents down are going to be fought hard by everyone with houses to rent and influence, ie, the guys who make the laws. good luck.

  3. Eamonn Clancy

    Get all offices out of Merrion Square and environs, that whole quarter is dead after 6pm and on weekends.

  4. Peter Dempsey

    Obviously landlords are “problematic” and uncool and evil. I get that. But what about someone who wants to own a property in live in themselves. Is that ok or is also “theft”.

    1. scottser

      grand as long as you don’t pay your mortgage then you can get the land league in to argue your case about what constitutes theft. be sure to throw the pictures of your eviction up here for scrutiny and comment – use of filters will be met with severe finger-wagging.

    2. Martin Heavy-Guy

      Why does this question come up every time there is a post on Broadsheet about property?

      My point of view is this (opinion, not law): If you are buying a house and expecting someone else to pay the full whack of your mortgage, then you are lucky enough to be earning enough money to afford a house (and have the bank say yes), and the people you’re renting it to are unlucky enough to not be able to afford to own a house. So seeing as you will both (a) own a property and (b) have someone else pay for it, then I guess that is theft, if theft equates to manipulating people worse off than yourself into paying for something that you now own.

      For those few landlords who seem to be able to unstick their greedy fingers from that golden chalice and are willing to offer rent at lower than the price of their mortgage and pay for the piece of property that they have bought, I guess that’s not theft technically; it’s more like free market Capitalism.

  5. Anomanomanom

    Typical moaners on here. The homeless crisis we have is bad, but lets be honest the figures are not true. People in houses are on the list as homeless because its not their house, that makes no sense. And the rent is high, ridiculously high we all know that. But basically tough. If you want to rent privately then pay the rent. Or stay where you lived for most of your life and save a deposit and buy.

      1. Anomanomanom

        It is tough, it was tough for me when I was renting. So I saved and got a mortgage. I know its harder to get one now. But what do people want, hand outs. Surely people had homes growing up, did they not save anything or did they just leave home the minute they got a job.

        1. 15 cent

          anon is hands down the worst commenter on broadsheet. his/her view is always directly based on her own exact experiences, and never takes other peoples situations into account. how can the advice to everyone paying high rent (approx 1m people) be “live at home and save to buy” .. all the different people, all their different situations .. are all meant to follow that advice? straight up stupid. no one should ever interact with anon, its pointless. anon doesnt not understand anything outside his/her own remit. and as ive seen in the past, people who try to carefully explain to her, are met with stone ignorance and an unwillingness to understand.

          1. Anomanomanom

            Well thats simple not true, if you are on here as long as I have been then you’ll know on more than one occasion after “civilised” debate I’ve taken people’s points, pointed out that parts I was wrong and happily changed my view point. Your problem is, I don’t like people who bitch and moan yet do nothing to improve their lot and expect (not need) social welfare help, and you seemed to think thats a bad thing.

          2. 15 cent

            anon, you were more general about it, i dont know why you think its acceptable for landlords to be raising their rent by 100s of euro for no reason or improvements of living, and expect everyone to put up or shut up.

          3. Anomanomanom

            Like I said many times before because they can. Im realistic about things, morally its not right but until its illegal iv no problem with. During the crash rent dropped in my apartments from €900+ to the lowest I seen €600 a month. It was great when everybody could say screw you its cheaper 5 mins away. Now its the other way around. Again I know its morally wrong but blame the government not the owners.

          4. Martin Heavy-Guy

            “Or stay where you lived for most of your life and save a deposit and buy.” – I can’t stay, the rent has increased and I can’t afford it.

            “Surely people had homes growing up, did they not save anything or did they just leave home the minute they got a job”: I grew up in rural Ireland. There are no jobs where I grew up. I could move home and go on the dole, but couldn’t save anything, so couldn’t get that mortgage anyway.

            “I don’t like people who bitch and moan yet do nothing to improve their lot”: I don’t bitch or moan. I have picked up and moved wherever I could find work, constantly, all my life. And with my upcoming rent increase in Dublin I think that is the final nail in the coffin for this city because I simply can’t afford to live here anymore. I don’t have a permanent work contract (fixed term) and a bank wouldn’t look at me for a mortgage, even if I did want to buy.

            “morally its not right but until its illegal iv no problem with”: So you will just follow the law blindly, even when it is against your own belief systems? Then how would you enact social change? How would you expect laws to change? If people don’t complain, then the law stays the same, people keep getting turfed out of their homes. The law changes because people highlight flaws in it. You might call it complaining, but this is social change. If it wasn’t for the greed of landlords (if they did what is morally right) then this would not even be an issue.

            Take this or leave it. Your situation is different from mine. If my parents could keep me in the house all my adult life while I saved maybe I would see it the same way as you. But I would hope that I could maintain some sort of social conscience instead.

    1. scottser

      if I may?
      homeless accommodation is one form of ‘social housing support’ provided by a local authority. a family with issues outside of simply housing might well be placed in a temporary accommodation to focus on skills required to maintain a tenancy with the assistance of visiting supports. you’d be amazed at the amount of people who simply have no conception of what ‘a home’ is. There are also numerous typologies defining homelessness, so those who are without security of tenure (sofa-surfing) are deemed homeless but not necessarily requiring emergency accommodation.
      as for the ‘tough luck’ stance taken by you regarding rent prices, government inaction has meant that the rental sector is now expected to cope with numbers and household types that it shouldn’t have to. The state needs more social housing, not higher rents or stay with mammy.

      1. Anomanomanom

        I agree with everything you said. My stance of Tough is simply based on one thing, its not the owners problem that the government does not build houses. One of the problems I see all the time is, you have a corpo house with a family of 4 or 5 in it. Kids grow up move out and parents/parent is still in a huge house when they don’t need it. The other thing is people €35,000+ a year in corpo housing. Move these people out to smaller places and moved them out altogether when their salary hits a level that social housing is not needed.

        1. The Real Jane

          So you think you should work for everything but also the primary incentive you’re giving people in social housing to work hard to improve their lives is that they might lose their homes? Well, as a social policy it lacks incentive.

          1. Anomanomanom

            See that’s the problem you hit the nail right on the head with your thinking, people need Incentives. I wanted to improve my life because why would you not. Its simple really if you get the leg up of the government by providing what you need till you can stably support all your needs then have the decency to other stand( for example) the corpo house your in is not yours for life.

          2. The Real Jane

            So if you’re poor – or not even poor, just not rich enough to be able to buy on the market – you can’t have a permanent home? That’s pretty tough. I mean, if you were saying that you could take out a corpo mortgage to buy your house above a certain income level, I might say, yeah, that makes sense. But to turf you out as soon as you start to earn a notional amount (which may not even enable you to buy in specific market conditions)?

            I think that’s harsh to the point of inhuman, particularly for people with growing families.

          3. Anomanomanom

            Well a fair system would have to be worked out. I wouldn’t say just “get out now”. Lets be honest there will never be enough housing in dublin city, people will have to commute. Which is another awful problem with our ridiculous transport system.

        2. scottser

          there is indeed an argument that states that an assessment of housing need for social housing, which is done when you first apply, should continue on through any tenancy. so, if you need a 3 bed with your family and the kids move on after 20 years then you and the missis realistically have only a 1 bed need. this makes sense only if there are a stock of 1 beds locally to move them into and that’s the real issue here: housing is planned over a long term by civil servants but is resourced by ministers, senators and councillors with a short-term focus. I don’t know where you live anom, but I bet if you went into your local authority offices and checked their development plans they change as often as you change your jocks depending on the shade of government in power. someone above stated that housing is too important to be left to the market. I tells ya, it’s too important to be left to the clowns in government.

  6. Peter Dempsey

    Ok I will ask again. Does the Irish left (many of whom post here and on Rabble) approve of people owning one property that they live in themselves? i.e NOT a landlord

    1. The Real Jane

      Yes. I do not approve of second houses in beauty spots which lie vacant for most of the year and price people who want to live locally out of the market. I do not think that getting a mortgage for a second property to let entitles you to charge any amount regardless of the social consequences. I think that housing is too important and too essential to be left to the vagaries of the market.

      I don’t really approve of buy to let mortgages for individuals, to be honest. Too often they are based on pie in the sky expectations of the rental market and are not professionally or competently managed.

  7. kellma

    Even from an evil capitalist point of view, something has to be done here. Why will companies come here and employ people when those people can’t afford to live here. Wages will keep driving up until it is no longer attractive to be based here. The government need to get their finger out….

  8. kellma

    The government don’t like being decisive or putting their personal career goals behind the good of the country….

  9. 15 cent

    there needs to be regulation. there never will be. we have a gov. who flat out dont care about this issue and have no plans to change it. its a situation that enables greed. any of my friends who were getting a good deal on their rent, have been turfed out in favour of wealthy families.

  10. Junkface

    I am emmigrating. I’ve had it with this backwards country. Everything is overpriced, car insurance, health insurance, tax, politics is corrupt, rent is obscene, you need to earn about 100K to even get a mortgage, crime is getting worse.
    Irish Governments are INCAPABLE of planning and UNWILLING at problem solving.

    1. The Real Jane

      I’ve yet to hear of the country that doesn’t have similar complaints, in fairness. I’m not listening to loonline right now, but I’m sure Joe has been humming in agreement with aul fellas who know just how to run all the transport companies.

      It’s a curious thing that everyone knows exactly how to run everything – except the people doing it.

      1. Junkface

        Some countries have one or two or maybe three of these problems at a time, but Ireland, IRELAND HAS ALL OF THEM! ALL AT THE SAME TIME! AND EXTORTIONATE COSTS IS AT THE TOP OF THE LIST!
        This place puts unbelievable pressures on working adults. Its unacceptable

  11. Christopher

    I live in Dublin 1 and would welcome some gentrification but it will never happen even though rents are skyrocketing. The main reason rents have gone up here are “foreign language students” who will happily pay €600 per month to share a room in D1 (ever who is renting pokey little 2 beds in the ghetto for over €2000 a month?). The other end of the scale is that the nice apartments are rented out on AirBnb or sometimes its a combination of both where the “foreign language students” are renting out their second room (check out the listings- it’s very obvious the ones that are subletting illegally) to pay for the rent while they work in our bars and cafes.

    I have lived in D1 for 2 years and it’s getting depressing- there is no sense of community. I can guarantee the hipsters in WigWam wont be discussing THAT.

  12. Peter Dempsey

    Jane. My question isn’t about second homes or investment properties though. Is it ok for somebody to buy a house with the intention of living there themselves? Scottser’s answer is noted thanks.

    1. Martin Heavy-Guy

      I really don’t understand this question though. Are you asking Broadsheet readers for validation in buying a house? I’m sure everyone on here has a different opinion about whether this is OK.

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