A big day for Bodger, in fairness.

More as we get it.

Surveillance memo could be declassified Friday (Fox News)




The House Intelligence Committee has released the memo outlining alleged abuses of secret surveillance by the FBI and Justice Department in the Trump-Russia investigation.

Key points:

* The Steele dossier formed an essential part of the initial and all three renewal FISA applications against Carter Page.

* Andrew McCabe confirmed that no FISA warrant would have been sought from the FISA Court without the Steele dossier information.

* The political origins of the Steele dossier were known to senior DOJ and FBI officials, but excluded from the FISA applications.

* DOJ official Bruce Ohr met with Steele beginning in the summer of 2016 and relayed to DOJ information about Steele’s bias. Steele told Ohr that he, Steele, was desperate that Donald Trump not get elected president and was passionate about him not becoming president.

House Intelligence memo released: What it says (Washington Examiner)

Sponsored Link

245 thoughts on “Imminent

    1. ABigJuicyOrange

      So we should take it instead from a frothing left-wing stable like Vox? Ezra Klein suffers from a particularly nasty strain of Trump Derangement Syndrome.

      Face it, there is no sober, sane commentary on issues like this in the MSM. That ship has sailed.

      1. f_lawless

        I agree. Trying to impress upon us that Vox magazine is a calm voice of ipartial reason just makes you look naive.
        Sponsored by Goldman Sachs, it’s track record has revealed – as this article puts it – “a disturbing decline for what began in 2014 as a promising new media outlet—a transformation into a source for neoliberal, pro-corporate propaganda disguised as left wing punditry, just two years after its inception.”
        Just reading the Vox article, these quotes read to me as obvious strawman attempts to frame the debate:
        “The memo, in essence, raises this question: Is there an anti-Trump bias at the FBI, and if so, does it justify placing the historically independent bureau under Trump’s personal control?”
        “But this particular method of abuse would require an implausibly vast conspiracy..”

  1. ben

    Critical takeaway:

    “Nunes released information in such a manner as to make it look like Trump’s claims of being persecuted by law enforcement were true — and did so after secretly getting the information from the Trump White House. The situation proved to be such an embarrassment that Nunes was forced to recuse himself from the intelligence committee’s investigation into Russia for eight months during a House ethics investigation into his conduct.”

    Bodger knows this, everyone at Broadsheet should know it, but they persist in peddling raving fascist conspiracy theories. The reason they are doing this is left as an exercise for the reader.

    1. Donald

      yeah ben, Clintons paying for the golden shower dossier is all good

      This Strzok guy is up to his neck, even if you think the “dossier” is cherry picked, you dont go letting a crook off the hook and create evidence because you dont like someone

      “House investigators told Fox News they have long regarded Strzok as a key figure in the chain of events when the bureau, in 2016, received the infamous anti-Trump “dossier” and launched a counterintelligence investigation into Russian meddling in the election that ultimately came to encompass FISA surveillance of a Trump campaign associate.

      The “dossier” was a compendium of salacious and largely unverified allegations about then-candidate Trump and others around him that was compiled by the opposition research firm Fusion GPS. The firm’s bank records, obtained by House investigators, revealed that the project was funded by the Clinton campaign and the Democratic National Committee”


      “A former top counterintelligence expert at the FBI, now at the center of a political uproar for exchanging private messages that appeared to mock President Donald Trump, changed a key phrase in former FBI Director James Comey’s description of how former secretary of state Hillary Clinton handled classified information, according to US officials familiar with the matter.

      Electronic records show Peter Strzok, who led the investigation of Hillary Clinton’s private email server as the No. 2 official in the counterintelligence division, changed Comey’s earlier draft language describing Clinton’s actions as “grossly negligent” to “extremely careless,” the sources said.
      The drafting process was a team effort, CNN is told, with a handful of people reviewing the language as edits were made, according to another US official familiar with the matter

      The shift from “grossly negligent” to “extremely careless,” which may appear pedestrian at first glance, reflected a decision by the FBI that could have had potentially significant legal implications, as the federal law governing the mishandling of classified material establishes criminal penalties for “gross negligence.”


      1. Nigel

        Critical takeaway – your revulsion for Obama and Clinton have sent you running into the loving arms of the people who gave us the build-up to the war in Iraq. If they can’t be trusted to handle intelligence, who can?

        1. f_lawless

          Nigel, you’re like a broken record. It was Bill Clinton’s administration that, in the year 1999 alone, spent $1BN dropping bombs in Iraq; bombing at an average of 3 times a week – the most sustained bombing campaign since Vietnam.
          It was Bill Clinton’s UN ambassador, Madeline Albright, who declared “we think it was worth it” when asked about the deaths of over half a million Iraqi children under the age of 5 due to sanctions in the 90s. The US could have vetoed those UN sanctions but Clinton himself declared “the sanctions will be there until the end of time or as long as he [Hussein] lasts”.
          Then you had Obama escalating the war in Afghanistan selling it to the public as the way to bring peace. Look at the state of it now.
          Hilary Clinton aggressively pushed for NATO’s invasion of Libya which has left it a failed state in chaos.
          How long are you going to cling to the misguided notion that the Democratic party are the good guys with a superior moral authority over the GOP?

          1. Nigel

            Did you just whatabout the Iraq War? Everything you say is true. The Democrats are still morally superior to the GOP by a mile. It’s just that it’s a really, really low bar.

          2. Nigel

            Yeah the disparity between the strength of the cases behind the respective ‘gates goes to prove my point.

          3. f_lawless

            not since their embrace of neo-liberal / neo-con policies…the difference isn’t all that much really IMO

          4. Sentient Won

            Denial ain’t just a river in Egypt Nigel. Your Trump-Russia collusion fantasy is dead. Accept it now; It will be easier for you in the long run.

            (or keep listening to the pigeons – I really don’t care)

            BTW, here’s a map of where those who voted for Trump live. Why don’t you write them with your pigeon stories.


          5. Sentient Won

            Terrible attempt at distraction Nigel. The Nunes memo is based on an actual investigation by a congressional intelligence committee as well as input from the Inspector General and his 1.2 million documents collected (not some low grade copypasta from a 4ch LARP).

            Why did Muller just ask for General Flynn’s sentencing to be postponed?

            Future proves past.

            Try again.

          6. Nigel

            Yeah and what’s the upshot? The Steele Dossier yielded actionable intelligence! Shot in the foot, dude. Right in the foot. Both feet. Ouch.

          7. Sentient Won

            “actionable intelligence” ?


            Lies and deceit.


            Future proves past.

            Where’s Comey? Where’s McCabe? Where’s Rice? Where’s Rosenstein?


          8. realPolithicks

            “The Nunes memo is based on an actual investigation by a congressional intelligence committee”

            This is a totally partisan committee the chair of which, devin nunes was part of the trump campaign and the presidential transition team.

          9. Nigel

            By the measure of starting catastrophic wars in Iraq and Afghanistan based on fabricated evidence and hysterical jingoism.

    2. realPolithicks

      Devin Nunes was part of trumps election campaign and also helped to lead his presidential transition team, hardly an honest or disinterested broker.

  2. The Old Boy


    – Six metres of Hungarian crushed velvet curtain material
    – Four rock salmon and a ha’pence of chips
    – Cab for a Mr. Redgrave picking up from 14 Arnos Grove (Ring top bell)

          1. Andyourpointiswhatexactly?

            A child’s got more bones than a grown up’s got

            It’s a Pavlovian reaction, though I dunno how I know it.

          2. Yep

            And that’s a natural law! Them bones, them bones need calcium.

            Glad it still lingers in someone else’s brain.

    1. Bodger

      Woke Bae, for 18 months we have been fed a narrative by the mainstream media abroad and here – The Irish Times, Independent, RTÉ in particular, that is about to be demonstrated as entirely false. And that’s just the start.

      1. wellness

        Do you drink on the job, Bodger? My imaginary friend wants to know. He can see the things you are thinking in your head.

    2. f_lawless

      did you just beam down from another planet? The ever increasing toxicity of US politics has huge consequences for the rest of the world too. The overbearing influence of the military–industrial complex leading to perpetual wars in places like the Middle East. – causing the world’s worst refugee crisis since World War II.
      Not to mention the out of control surveillance arm of the state- spying on European leaders, collecting the private online data of all EU citizens, etc

    3. f_lawless

      Woke Bae

      “why do people like bodger get so excited by potential conspiracies in the states?”

      did you just beam down from another planet? The ever increasing toxicity of US politics has huge consequences for the rest of the world too. The overbearing influence of the military–industrial complex leading to perpetual wars in places like the Middle East. – causing the world’s worst refugee crisis since World War II.
      Not to mention the out of control surveillance arm of the state- spying on European leaders, collecting the private online data of all EU citizens, etc,etc

      1. Nigel

        Which is why these conspiracy theories are encouraged and fomented, to sow confusion and disaffection and redirect energy and attention. That’s my conspiracy theory anyway.

  3. johnny

    gosh Irish born media darling Sam’s fingers all over this,hopefully it wont affect her numerous media/academic gigs.

    POLLAK: Let me ask you this: there were some reports over the last year, and we actually were part of reporting this, that there were a number of individuals in the Obama administration who had requested the unmasking of the identities of Americans who were swept up in foreign wiretaps. And Samantha Power, the former ambassador to the United Nations, who doesn’t really have a national security function, had conducted a large number of these unmasking requests. Are we going to learn more about that? Are we going to see into the operation of the outgoing administration and why they did what they did?

    GOSAR: Joel, I’m going to be very careful. I’m not an attorney, but if you don’t think that Fast and Furious, if you don’t think that Benghazi, for the lack of accountability, if you don’t think the IRS and the unmasking are tied together with the weaponization of our Department of Justice and political advocates, think again.


        1. Clampers Outside!

          You are now a Nazi Johnny because you posted a link to Breitbart.

          It’s the law of Nigel, and a few others.

          There’s nothing anyone can do unfortunately, them’s the rules.

          1. Nigel

            Don’t be silly. Approvingly posting a link to Breitbart doesn’t make you a Nazi. More likely just a white supremacist, but not necessarily a Nazi.

          2. johnny

            Irish media coverage off Sam:

            The Power world view in which she equated the Irish famine to Ebola,in a eh rousing-(hysterical/neurotic)-speech at Barry Andrews now embattled Goal Charity.

            “This is mad,” she said, imploring private companies and institutions to tackle “one of the worst health crises the world has ever seen.”


            More than 21 months on from the first confirmed case recorded on 23 March 2014, 11,315 people have been reported as having died from the disease in six countries; Liberia, Guinea, Sierra Leone, Nigeria, the US and Mali. The total number of reported cases is about 28,637.

            Altogether, about a million people in Ireland are reliably estimated to have died of starvation and epidemic disease between 1846 and 1851, and some two million emigrated in a period of a little more than a decade (1845-55).

          3. realPolithicks

            The usual nonsense from Clampers. Of course you are not a nazi if you read breitbart, but you are getting your information from an organization that promotes organizations that push white supremacy/nationalism, race hatred and in particular anti-semitism. So if you’re cool with that, then fire away.

          4. Clampers Outside!

            LOL! Whoooosssh realpolitick!

            And sure, if memory serves, weren’t you part of the mob on here shouting Nazi or at least accusing people of being alt-right for just linking to the like of Baitbarf…

            …ah well, good to see u copped on a bit

          5. realPolithicks

            “You reckon Israeli’s are anti Semitic, not sure you understand too well either..”

            I don’t know what you’re smoking today but you should lay off its addling your brain.

          6. jusayinlike

            You just said breitbart, which is Israeli, promotes anti semitisim..

            See your previous comment..

          7. realPolithicks

            “And sure, if memory serves, weren’t you part of the mob on here shouting Nazi or at least accusing people of being alt-right for just linking to the like of Baitbarf…”

            Obviously memory doesn’t serve there clampers, but sure no harm you guys make most of this BS up anyway so just add this to it. Also there are no mobs on here, just people giving their point of view.

  4. Jimmey_russell

    lol what kind of idiots think there could be a conspiracy drumpfers are so braindead they think conspiracies are real it’s not the movies ffs I bet they think wrestling is real too

    1. Sentient Won


      It’s makes a pretty clear case there was a real life conspiracy (funded by the Clintons) to present unverified information to a court in order to obtain and renew a FISA warrant to spy on the Trump campaign.

      And this is only the beginning, the real damage is yet to come.

        1. Sentient Won

          From the Memo you’re afraid to read:

          1. …corroboration of the Steele dossier was in its “infancy”…

          2. …only minimally corroborated…

          3. …”salacious and unverified”…

          1. Nigel

            What a convincing selection of context-free fragments! Hey, do you think corroboration of the Nunes memo is in its infancy?

  5. Frilly Nation : The Rupture is real

    I’ve had a Mehall Martin Damascus moment all of my own lately

    There is just too much qualified information to ignore and laugh off

    I’m one ah’ them now
    A Bodgette

      1. Frilly Nation : The Rupture is real

        That sounds like sum’ting consenting grownups do
        I’m not ruling it out mind

        But lemme ask Fluffy what it is first

  6. Donker

    The Republicans are always touting a big reveal that will change everything. It’s just stage managed bait to keep a specific loony, conspiracy hungry section of their base frothing at the mouth.
    Libya, pizzagate, Uranium, the earth changing reveals are always imminent but never actually arrive.

    1. some old queen

      Exactly. About 500 people have a copy of it already and yet,not one leak. The Dems will push back saying it is bits taken out of context to present Trump in a good light and nothing will change.

      1. realPolithicks

        The trump campaign’s involvement with the Russian government is currently being investigated by a highly respected non partisan independent prosecutor appointed by the republicans…but don’t let the facts get in the way of another one of your rants.

      2. Nigel

        How weird is it to be SO cynical you actually think Trump HAS to be innocent? That’s like going through cynicism and reaching child-like naivete again. Maybe Mueller turns up nothing, but to act as if it’s a foregone conclusion? Bizarre.

        1. realPolithicks

          Bizarre is the exact word to describe it, although I think there is fair amount of Clinton hatred involved too

        2. Clampers Outside!

          I don’t think “Trump HAS to be innocent”. So far, the Russia thing has delivered nothing, that’s a fact, and CNN producers were recorded saying so. Until the investigation is complete, I’ll reserve judgement on that issue.

          – – –

          By the way, the “Trump HAS to be…” Islam exclent example of ” so what you’re saying is…”.

          Well done, gave me a giggle :)

          1. Nigel

            If you meant to say that the investigation has not been concluded yet so we can’t judge its findings yet, perhaps you shouldn’t have said ‘the DNC’s big Russia reveal is it then… a big nothing…’ because it isn’t the DNC, there hasn’t been a reveal, but there have in fact been arrests and charges and revelations. Don’t blame me for taking you up wrong when you type something and then claim to actually have meant to say the opposite.

          2. edalicious

            The idea that the dossier was paid for by the Democrats is pretty shaky though since a lot of the info in he dossier was collected while Fusion and by extension Steele were working for the GOP. Also, Steele was working for Fusion, not for the Dems, and it seems to be the case that he wouldn’t necessarily know who he was collecting the information for.

          3. Nigel

            Who paid for the dossier is a red herring anyway. The information was good enough to get a warrant using a system that the republicans love enough to have renewed abut a month ago.

          4. Sentient Won

            But if the FBI/DOJ deceived the court is that too or red herring?

            Or is it “Fruit of the Poisonous Tree”.

        1. Nigel

          Not especially, though neither has his integrity been successfully challenged. I have genetally lost what little faith I ever had in most US politcal institutions. But it’ll be a cold day in hell before I believe a single word that comes out of the evil gobs of the GOP and I pity the fools who do.

          1. Sentient Won

            So you take your talking points from the Democrats and mainstream media entities like CNN, the New York Times, the Guardian maybe?.

  7. italia'90

    How long has Nunes had this explosive memo?
    Why has he not declassified it before now? He’s had more than enough time.
    He has form on this kind of bs.

  8. Nigel

    Does that Fox News update suggest that the memo somehow implicates Trump? Is ‘worse than Watergate’ in reference to the alleged content of the memo, or the alleged use of the memo as an attack on the FBI in order to shield Trump from investigation?

          1. Nigel

            That’s not really a thing that anything means. C’mon. ‘Reverse ferret.’ What’s it actually supposed to mean?

      1. realPolithicks

        You know Bodger I can’t decide if you’re serious about this stuff or if you’re just yanking everyone’s chain. I’m starting to think its the latter because otherwise you don’t make any sense whatsoever.

  9. realPolithicks

    ” showing Americans just how the agency was weaponized by the Obama officials/DNC/HRC to target political adversaries.”

    Is this the same FBI whose director released a memo days before the election which contributed to Clinton losing the election?

      1. Not Gerry Adams

        @jusayinlike it’s not the fact that it was released – it’s Fox News (and Bodger) editorialising this as anything other than partisan hackery by Nunes and the White House.

  10. Nigel

    Haven’t read the memo, so just going by what devoted memoists above think are the key points:

    * The Steele dossier formed an essential part of the initial and all three renewal FISA applications against Carter Page.

    Was the information used from the dossier independently verified or corroborated? (Seems to me if it wasn’t, that would be the headline news, and quite rightly so.)

    * Andrew McCabe confirmed that no FISA warrant would have been sought from the FISA Court without the Steele dossier information.

    Was the information independently verified or corroborated?

    * The political origins of the Steele dossier were known to senior DOJ and FBI officials, but excluded from the FISA applications.

    Is that important if the information is independently verified or corroborated? (I imagine that’s a purely legal question which could be drily debated for years by scholars and judges, so I’m assuming Republicans are screaming that it’s THE MOST IMPORTANT THING!)

    * DOJ official Bruce Ohr met with Steele beginning in the summer of 2016 and relayed to DOJ information about Steele’s bias. Steele told Ohr that he, Steele, was desperate that Donald Trump not get elected president and was passionate about him not becoming president.

    Does this matter, if the information was independently verified or corroborated?

    Not really that explosive is it? If fully borne out, a couple of cases might get dismissed on (gasp!) technical grounds!

    1. Sentient Won

      Why wouldn’t you read the memo? Afraid of primary sources? Or did the pigeons tell you not to?

      1. Nigel

        As a kind of exercise in engaging with memo boosters entirely on their presentation of the memo. Is there more to it than that?

        1. Sentient Won

          Read it yourself and make your own mind up.

          (Unless you’re still too scared of those pigeons.)

  11. Frilly Nation : The Rupture is real

    Well tis main stream now
    Even the RTE theatre players on the 9 o’clock have led with it

  12. DeKloot

    Jeepers. Sizzling stuff. All that evidence. All that proof….. Hah! This is gonna backfire spectacularly on the Republicans.

          1. DeKloot

            Mark Tercek is a buddy of mine y’know…

            But no. Trump National Committee. Cos that’s what it is now.

          2. realPolithicks

            If things stay as they currently are the Democrats may gain control of the house of representatives in November, they hopefully would be able to put some restaints on these out of control republican.

  13. Random Bloke

    This is by far the funniest post ever on Broadsheet.ie.
    You don’t need to read the comments. I know I didn’t.

    Bodger the Truth-Dodger is clutching at proverbial straws, pointing at squirrels, or butterflies, or something… Hillary…anything. No holds barred.

    This is Right Wing Propaganda in it’s most pathetic form.
    Embrace it for what it is. It’s funny.
    As I said to my mate Dan the other day, it’s desperation.

    It WILL get funnier.
    Trust me.
    You won’t be laughing.

    It’s not the start.
    It’s not the end.
    It’s just a hiccup.

    You’d have to be blind to not see it.

    1. Random Bloke

      …Who needs correction, eh?

      We’re all Lefty Sychophants, ammirite?
      He doesn’t delete stuff he doesn’t like…

      Who’s with me?



  14. Stan

    The house is falling in…on top of itself.
    The insect posse will be crushed, remembered only collectively for their lack of spine and not by individual names.
    Alex Jones is their King. Bodgerface is his conduit.
    The truth is NOT ‘out there’. It’s staring you right in the face. Bodger. Everybody.

    This is going to be as messy as anyone wants it to be.
    It’s going to end well.
    All the really stupid people are going to look stupid, but hey…

    Democracy Baby!
    – When you suck at it too hard… Ask your Mother why she put you on bottles.
    Don’t just go on the Internet looking for mates. Any mate you find is probably a fat hairy bloke who sucks too… and that’s only if you’re lucky.

    1. Stan

      Your Ma asked me to delete that last message.
      She says she wants nothing to do with this.

      She’s right.
      She lies back and thinks of Ireland.

      I told her that we all do Mrs Blenkinsop, we all do.

      1. Stan

        I swear, if I get deleted for pretending I’m in a sexual relationship with the fictitious Mother of a pseudonymous unfunny clown…
        I swear…

        Only messing.
        Fire away.

  15. Stan

    Anyone who thinks this isn’t going to explode BEFORE the end of March hasn’t been paying full attention.
    Trump is a puppet for Putin.
    Trump is a puppet for the GOP.
    – Those strings are tangled and Republicans cannot unknot them.
    – This attempt is pathetic, yet true to form.

    It’s Mueller time.
    Fat-free, no sugar…just sweet. And justice.

    Let’s go…

  16. Listrade

    I think this marks the final “I’m done with this poo.” Not just here, but in general. Time to check out until this circus stops and people can use their brains again.

    But hey, I’m just not seeing the big picture, I’m no seeing what’s out there. I’m blinkered. I’m partisan. I should get over Clinton losing. You know what. I don’t care. If you’re falling for all this conspiracy crap, then go for it. Waste your life and your integrity on it. Just try not to hurt anyone else with it as you do it.

    Just for the record. Nunes hasn’t even read the FISA application. He said so. That’s kinda a big deal. But you also know that the FISA application won’t be released so we’ll never know what else was in it. You also know that nobody has ever tried to deny that the Steele Dossier was partisan and funded by the democrats.

    That’s precisely why it was never covered until Buzzfeed published it, they knew it was partisan.

    So did the FBI, They never denied it. You know that. You know too that parts of the dossier have proven to be reliable as they were confirmed by British and Australian secret service independent of the dossier. Sure, the golden shower is just speculation, but the dossier says that.

    You also know that there would be no Mueller if Trump hadn’t fired Comey. IT HIS OWN EFFING FAULT. If Flynn hadn’t lied about meetings. If Sessions hadn’t lied. If Trump Jr hadn’t have been trying to impress his dad and organised that stupid meeting in Trump Tower and if Kushner hadn’t gone along with it, none of this would matter. But they did. They lied. Comey knew it and was digging into Kushner. He got nervous, Ivanka got nervous and told daddy to fire Comey. He did and all this he brought on himself.

    But no. Trump’s a genius playing 4D chess bringing down a deep state piece by piece. Keep telling yourself that. I’m done, you’re too far gone for this to be fun anymore.

    Here’s my prediction, for what it’s worth. There was no collusion on the election. Flynn and the rest were just doing what greedy stupid people do: looking for ways to make themselves richer. Trump Jr and Kushner were just really really stupid kids playing at politics and messed up really bad. That might be collusion of some sorts. But the Mueller thing will be obstruction. And that’s undeniable.

    That’s not the play of a genius, that’s the play of someone who’s always had things go his way because he’s an entitlend rich kid. The type this place used to be againet.

    Over and out.

    1. Sentient Won

      Believe what you like, but consider this: why has Mueller asked for General Flynn’s sentencing hearing to be postponed?

    2. Bodger

      Listrade, I hope you will be back soon. Please don’t let my views stop you from coming here. I would be very sorry if that was the case.

      My opinion does not represent a Broadsheet position by any stretch and, as you can see, most of the commenters are in agreement with you.

      For me, this is a non partisan issue (I was a Bernie supporter, then Jill Stein).

      1. Nigel

        This is a completely and utterly and irrefutably a partisan issue. It’s just that you’re getting played. When elections roll around again all you Sanders and Stein supporters will be attacking the usual flawed and imperfect Dem nominees and candidates with every bit of ammunition the Republicans hand you, doing their work for them, just like you did in 2016, just like you’re doing now.

        1. f_lawless

          Nigel – the real heart of it is not actually a partisan issue at all. The heart of the matter is the overreach of the surveillance apparatus of the state which is open to abuse for political gain.
          I’m pasting a comment here from someone over on The Intercept who can express it better than I could:
          “no matter which version of reality you subscribe to the FISA court is the problem! If you think the Republicans are using the intelligence apparatus for political gain then the compartmentalization and opaqueness of the FISA courts is giving them the cover they need to abuse the system for political purposes.

          If you believe that the democrats are using the intelligence apparatus for political motives then again, the opaqueness of the FISA court is the very thing enabling that abuse.

          Either way the FISA court and the opportunity to leverage the Domestic Mass Surveillance apparatus for political espionage is the heart of the problem. Thats why this is such a crucial opportunity to make a bipartisan effort to reign in the national security state and revise these gross violations of our 4th amendment. BUT as long as the mainstream media is dividing and conquering with race baiting and identify politics they can keep us from working together at the very moment their throat is exposed. As long as we are devolving into name calling and partisan rancor, they have already won.”

          1. Nigel

            I assume the race-baiting and identity politics refers to the resurgent white nationalism that propelled a dodgy businessman to the presidency on a wave of xenophobia, who now has to be protected from the criminal and security apparatus of the state by the same party who have been the most passionate promoters of the criminal and security arms of the state, but only up to point where they come under its scrutiny, with the notable exception of their enthusiasm for a federal investigation into their own political rival just before the 2016 election. I agree.

            Invocations of both sides and bipartisanship are disingenuous at best when one side controls all sections of the government and are simultaneously bolstering security overreach while undermining it’s independence and oversight by feeding red meat like this memo to the paranoia and hatred of their base.

      2. realPolithicks

        “My opinion does not represent a Broadsheet position by any stretch and, as you can see, most of the commenters are in agreement with you.”

        To be honest Bodger you posting this kind of stuff on Broadsheet does a great disservice to what is an otherwise excellent site. The fact that you then comment on it yourself just makes it worse and you lose total credibility as a result. The kind of conspiracy theory nonsense which you present as fact is what is destroying the credibility of the MSM but perhaps thats what you are hopeing to acheive.

    3. Sentient Won

      Believe what you must but also consider this: why did Mueller ask for General Flynn’s sentencing hearing to be postponed?

    1. Nigel

      Plus the ICE is turning into an American Gestapo and environmental protections are being trashed and public lands are being carved up for oil and mineral exploration.

      1. edalicious

        And don’t forget massive tax cuts for the wealthy. Add that to the massive flaming turd bonfire.

        1. Nigel

          Talking up a ‘limited conflict’ to give North Korea a bloody nose, just to show them who’s boss and give Reps a boost in the November elections is particularly awesome.

    2. f_lawless

      What sort of thing? Corporate media muddying the waters with junk articles like that? Gender identity is obviously a complex issue. Whether one agrees or disagrees with it, trans gender activism is in essence a radial form of social re-engineering so it’s inevitable that there’s going to be some kind of backlash against it. Trying to claim that it’s all down to Trump’s election is ridiculous..

      1. Nigel

        Well we have been told repeatedly that Trump was inflicted on us because we had the temerity to say out loud that things like racism, sexism, homophobia and transphobia were bad and we didn’t like them. Aside from the obvious gaslighting (‘it’s your fault we elected Trump!’) the success of and support of someone like that seems obviously a kind of attempted renormalisation of views that we had hoped were on the way out, at least in some parts of the world.

        1. f_lawless

          who told you? Seems to me that you’ve gotten lost somewhere amongst the manufactured narratives of Corporate Media Land. Are you really trying paint the millions of Americans that didn’t vote for Clinton as being driven by a wave of “racism, sexism, homophobia and transphobia”? I think that’s both very condescending and divisive.

          I know I’m diverging from Bodger’s original post, but on the subject of transgender activism, I came across this article recently which made for some very interesting reading, although I’ve a feeling It might be too far outside your acceptable boundaries for you to digest with an open mind ;) The fact it was written by a transgender person makes it all the more curious.

          1. Nigel

            Well they voted for a man who wanted to build a wall to keep out Mexicans, demonised illegal immigrants, promised to ban Muslims, was recorded boasting of grabbing women by the genitalia and was accused multiple times of sexual assault, once with an underage girl. Since then he’s tried to ban trans people from the military and supported an accused pedophile running for the senate. You tell me that they were voting for. Or is it condescending and divisive just to notice and comment?

            Next time you accuse someone else of being condescending while deploying phrases like ‘you’ve gotten lost somewhere amongst the manufactured narratives of Corporate Media Land’ or It ‘might be too far outside your acceptable boundaries for you to digest with an open mind’ feel free to go feck yourself with your own patronising hypocrisy.

          2. f_lawless

            fair point Nigel, apologies for being disrespectful.
            As for the 2016 election, I think you have to consider that 44% of those eligible to vote didn’t do so – a 20 year low in voter turnout. Surely you’d agree that the viewpoints of those people would have to be taken into account if you really wanted to get a comprehensive take on what Americans are thinking?
            Whereas the number of voters for the GOP has stayed roughly the same over the last 3 elections (around the 60M mark), the most significant statistic is that the Dems have seen a steady decline in votes starting with Obama’s second term, and culminating with Clinton’s run. Here’s a graph of the stats:
            The most significant story here is the continuing decline in living standards of American citizens – half of whom live from paycheck to paycheck. Enough people that had voted Democrat eventually saw through Obama’s false promises of “change you can believe in” and Clinton wasn’t the candidate to persuade them otherwise.

          3. Nigel

            Hey it’s not either/or. They voted for a racist misogynist AND put a crooked multiple bankrupt in charge of their economy. Whatever they were thinking, it doesn’t flatter them.

  17. some old queen

    From debbiesideris on twitter.

    Anyone telling Americans 2 not trust & support our intelligence agencies should be questioned. What motive would an innocent person have in attacking them? What motive would a person being investigated BY our agencies have to attack them?

    So in summary:

    ‘Memo’ = https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCRZZC-DH7M


    1. Sentient Won

      What if that innocent person (your description) is being framed by rogue elements within the FBI/DOJ using a “salacious and unverified” dossier designed to undermine the result of a federal election?


          1. Sentient Won

            So you’re finally dropping the fake Trump-Russian collusion narrative (no traction after a year of effort) and now you’re spinning into “obstruction of justice”.

            Any evidence there Nigel or is this just another #Pigeon related talking point?

          2. Nigel

            Well that time he fired the director of the FBI to obstruct an investigation in collusion with Russia. That’s proof of obstruction.

          3. Sentient Won

            You mean Comey? The guy who signed off on an a falsified FISA application based on a “salacious and unverified” (his words) dossier?

            The guy who leaked classified memos to the press?

            The guy who told Trump he wasn’t under investigation?

            Firing someone for willful incompetence is now obstruction of justice?

            Try again.

          4. Nigel

            Trump literally said he fired him to make the Russia thing go away. Because otherwise you’re painting him as the very model of a Trump appointee, with the incompetence and the lying and the leaks, though your first point is wrong because the memo doesn’t show the application was falsified in any way. But no this is based on what Trump said and did.

          5. Sentient Won

            You have no link Nigel.

            Your statement is unverified.

            You’re making stuff up to suit your agenda.

            Do you work for the FBI? Fusion GPS? The DNC?

            Never mind. I don’t care. You’re a fabulist of the most banal character.

          6. some old queen

            Oh please. Why is it that those who come on this site promoting this nonsense change their name every time?

    2. f_lawless

      Only a naive, uninformed American would implicitly trust the FBI. As detailed by Human Rights Watch, the FBI have been guilty of entrapment in many high profile domestic terrorism cases over the last decade or so. In some cases even “creating terrorists out of law-abiding individuals by conducting sting operations that facilitated or invented the target’s willingness to act.”

      1. Nigel

        Only a naive uninformed silly-billy would think the enormous flaws of the FBI were reason to trust the GOP, once boosters of law-enforcement and national security, suddenly turning on them to protect Trump.

        1. f_lawless

          Hmm I’m not sure exactly if that comment was aimed at me or not as I certainly never trusted the GOP and have never stated otherwise.. Again, the central point I wanted to make is that both parties are guilty of voting to give the surveillance apparatus of the state overreaching powers and that both are guilty of abusing that apparatus for partisan political gain

          1. Nigel

            You get very mealy-mouthed when you retreat to simple-minded non-specific both-sideisms. It’s not that you’re wrong, it’s just that you’re like a politician retreating behind safe general platitudes, passing them of as wisdom and insight.

    1. bisted

      …over 200 comments…wow…I know little and care less about all these intriques…all I know is that the US people rejected crooked Hillary and there are a lot of innocent people alive today that would not have been were she given a licence for her blood lust…

  18. spudnick

    I’m not sure which of bisted, jusayinlike or f_lawless is that odd abductor-in-training at the Irexit conference the other day pictured in the Irish Times with his red MAGA hat.

    1. f_lawless

      translation: “I’ve nothing intelligent to add to the debate so I’ll compensate by posting a meaningless putdown to boost my own ego a bit”!

        1. Nigel

          jusayinlike, I am so sorry this explosive memo that was going to blow the Obama/Clinton conspiracy out of the water turned out to be Fake Nunes.

      1. spudnick

        There simply is nothing intelligent to add to your so-called “debate”. It’s just a pity, because none of the the of three you are objectively stupid, yet here you are wasting your time being /r/iamverysmart.

  19. some old queen

    The thing about national intelligence organisations is that by the nature of their work, they are involved in some very dirty and underhand activities. All sides can probably hold up instances of wrongdoing but it won’t make a blind bit of difference.

    And there is no point banging on about Hillary because she is gone. She is not the president. Nobody wanted Trump, including Trump, but is the sorry state of affairs. The FBI are concerned because he is a paranoid megalomaniac and to them, national security comes before everything and everyone. That is their job.

    This bull poo will probably continue until the midterms where hopefully the Dems will have mobilised enough of their base to send home a clear message. In the meantime, be aware that the evidence of a ‘conspiracy’ points to hostile foreign powers and that sometimes, things are exactly as they appear.

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