97 thoughts on “De Saturday Papers

  1. Inquisitor

    Irish Daily Mail are hoping staff take voluntary redundancies. The paper (according to ABC circulation) had circulation of 30,428 and ten years ago it had circulation of 52,144 (in 2009) that’s a considerable drop! Then they say so many people are looking at the Mail online but surely that’s the UK. Is the end nigh for Ireland. Pity seeing papers go down. The Irish Times is way down too: now c. 58k down from c. 114k

    1. eoin

      Yep, they’re looking to get rid of 35 from a total staff of 144. If there aren’t volunteers, there will be compulsory lay offs.

      The Irish operation made €1m net profit in 2017 and €2.5m the year before that.

      The paper was the top decliner in Ireland in 2018, down 20% in circulation (if you exclude their new policy of not giving away bulks, they were still down 12% comparing like-for-like full price sales).

      The attitude of their management and some journalists to truth and public duty was exposed last year at the Charleton Tribunal. I don’t know how they can show their faces in public since. As for “Ireland’s campaigning newspaper”, fupp off, it’s Lord Rothermere’s base (which translates as “al qaeda” in Arabic) in Ireland.

          1. Bodger

            Alison O’Reilly and Neil Michael have done brilliant work. Both daily and Sunday were very strong during the austerity years. FIGHT, etc.

          2. Emmerdale

            “Jobs”,Enda Kenny’s mantra.If the employee’s can’t make the paper work in this particular media age it’s not Topsy’s problem.

          3. Pee Pee

            @ andrew what?! aw i can’t believe they decided to close down that seal clubbing business

  2. Cú Chulainn

    It really is the time of bread and circus.. I suppose when you grow into adulthood in a particular epoch you think that’s how it goes. But, it’s constantly changing. Now it’s all about the show. History tells us that will end badly. Then again, doesn’t it all end badly.. there actually is no ‘news’ any more.. just spin on an event.. bread and circus..

    1. Cú Chulainn

      And after everything that’s happened in NÍ the telegraph leads with the poor soldiers who murdered the innocents, and how hard done by they are.. which the are.. because, who gave the order..?

      1. eoin

        It will be some St Patrick’s Day in Derry this year! 47 years for the killers of 14 Irish civilians to face justice. However, the way in which this is being leaked and stage managed is a little concerning.

        “Prosecutors in Northern Ireland will meet with victims’ families on March 14 before making the long-awaited announcement on whether former soldiers will stand trial.

        A press statement will be read out in the city at an event to which television news crews have been invited.”

        1. eoin

          One “source” told the Telegraph

          ” There are a host of charges they are looking at from murder to perjury. It seems a complete waste of energy and money to pursue troops almost 50 years on.”

          Another unnamed former sergeant said

          “I am in my late 70s. I am in God’s waiting room. There is not a lot they can do to me. They could put me in jail and at least I’ll get a bed and medical attention”

  3. eoin

    While the UK is begrudgingly making the killers of 14 Irish civilians face justice 47 years after Bloody Sunday (and the four soldiers that will be charged, “Lance Corporal F, Corporal P, Soldier R, and Soldier U” exclude the captain of the paras on the ground in Derry on that day in 1972. He’s been promoted and Queen Elizabeth has bestowed honours on him)

    in 2019, the journalists who exposed collusion by the Northern Ireland “security forces”, the old RUC and the British MI5 in the killing of six Irish civilians in a bar in the 1990s are being pursued on trumped up charges.

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/mar/02/police-treatment-no-stone-journalists-violates-media-freedoms?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

  4. eoin

    Final thoughts on the DOBvSBP

    “Kilcullen Kapital Partners, the owners of the paper, said it was happy to defend the case even though it predated its ownership because the issues raised were of importance to Irish media.”

    Didn’t the SBP have libel insurance and wouldn’t the SBP be compelled by the insurers to defend the case (or stump up the damages itself).

    Both Tom Lyons and Ian Kehoe left the SBP after Kilcullen took over. If neither of these decent, honest journalists – who weren’t being personally sued by DOB but turned up each day to defend their work regardless- saw a future at the SBP, what does that tell you about the current owner. There’s still a handful (or less) of decent journalists at the SBP but it’s a shadow of what it was a year ago.

    And lastly, one (maybe two) of the 11 jurors thought DOB should win. A 3-week hearing costing €1m (according to some) in our wee media market. Why is the Republic of Ireland still in the same libel backwater as Northern Ireland and why can’t we change our laws to bring them into line with England’s.

      1. eoin

        You’re too kind Frilly. Literally because I overlooked the fact it still took the jury several hours to reach a decision even after the judge allowed for a majority (minimum 9) verdict, which suggests, does it not, that three or more jurors were originally in favour of DOB, otherwise, it would have taken them 5 minutes to reach a decision after the judge told them he’d accept a (min 9) majority.

        That’s even more frightening.

        1. Frilly Keane

          I wouldn’t blame the Jury one bit for the time they took in deliberation
          And certainly not the 3

          The amount of sheer dirge
          He said She said dross they had to absorb
          And then select from to identify facts to allow them adjudicate

          It was a big ask
          At times it reminded me of the George Redmond trail

          The above might also explain the quality of Judge we have presiding on these type of actions

          Remember in this type of case
          There are no exciting witnesses
          Or gorey salacious exhibits
          There was no entertainment at all for them
          Just words and words and words

          Like how many of them wished they were down at the Mr Moonlight trail instead

          The Jury
          All of them
          Deserve medals
          As well as a month’s paid leave

          1. Lilly

            No way Frilly, give me a libel trial any day over blood-and-gore murder and bereft families. At least when jury duty is over, you wouldn’t be haunted by it.

    1. the bottler

      Libel laws will not change anytime soon here they protect the entitled class and are a bonanza for the legal eagles. Charlie Flanagan is a totally inept Justice Minister.

  5. eoin

    Trump apparently still hasn’t called the winner of the Nigerian presidential elections to congratulate him.

    In 2015, Obama called the winner (the same as the winner last week) on the day he won to congratulate him.

    Why hasn’t Trump been on the phone?

    Anything to do with the fact that Trump’s PR guys were supporting, for a reported $90,000 a month, the loser in last week’s elections? The loser is a shady businessman who was banned from travelling to the USA for several years but turned up in Washington six weeks ago along with Trump’s PR guy.

  6. Catherine costelloe

    The Metropolitan police have spent 11 :7 million investigating Madeline Mc Cann. Another year of funding until it’s “reached its conclusion”. Best of luck to them.

  7. Clampers Outside!

    44 year old transgender woman wins race competing against a field of women whose average age is 24…. nothing to see here, all is fair and equal on the competitive field of sports…. s/
    This story, brought to you by Debbie, a transgender woman who knows the meaning of “fairness”, in fairness.
    Go Debbie!
    https.com/DebbieHayton/status/1101794752884817920?s=19

      1. Clampers Outside!

        I reckon, it’d be a good time to go to the bookies… bet on a number of new Olympic records being broken in the 2010 women’s competitions.

        1. Ben Redmond

          Medicine can ‘change’ some features of female and male anatomy, but it cannot change basic metabolism. Hormones win out in athletics. Women’s athletics will face questions about physical equality.

          1. Clampers Outside!

            The IAAF who wrote the rules on transgender inclusion said that they simply don’t look at the unchangeable anatomical differences with regard to muscle and bone differences…

            ( I posted a link to the interview with the Dr from the IAAF who wrote the rules in a previous discussion on here )

      1. topsy

        Crazy stuff. Ultimately the general public will not accept this nonsense, or will female athletics. If one extends the logic of transgender people competing in womens events the outcomes would be farcical. What about transgender teams competing in womens team sports – rugby, football, basketball etc or individual sports such as tennis, rowing. The list is infinite. Utter stupidity.

    1. realPolithicks

      Well done clampers, thank you for spending your free time diligently scouring the interwebs for any obscure reference you can find to yet another “gender” related outrage. Your vigilence regarding this dangerous threat allows the rest of us to sleep safely in our beds at night, rest assured that you are doing gods work. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

      1. Clampers Outside!

        LOL, no diligence, nor souring required. Sorry to have clearly riled you into a spittle of sarcasm… ’tis most unfortunate, sure ’tis, sure it is.

        1. Nigel

          Yeah, Real, bit of transphobia is not hard to find. Chances of this issue getting sorted out in a calm and fair way are pretty much nil with this sort of amplification.

          1. realPolithicks

            I have to admit Nigel that I am genuinely baffled by peoples reactions (and not just clampers) on this issue, what are they afraid of?

          2. Clampers Outside!

            Maybe, just maybe seeing an issue with the growth in the near religious belief in ideological pseudo-science…. and the attempts by believers to silence those who disagree with all the claptrap.

          3. Nigel

            More than that, the focus on women’s sports when presumably it’s an issue for men’s sports too.

          4. Clampers Outside!

            Hahaha… don’t be silly, there are more issues in the women’s sports, and more examples, which is why they are discussed more. But hey, you go ahead and twist to make it look like a targeted thing, if that floats your boat…. pffft!

          5. Clampers Outside!

            Transphobia…. really Nigel, really? This find, an opinion of a transgendered person is…. transphobic.

            Well, OK…. is this you “cis-splaining” the situation now?
            s/

            You’re unreal pet, laughably un-bloody real…

          6. Clampers Outside!

            You do that, and contemplate whether calling transgender persons opinions transphobic is a reasonable position. Time we’ll spent, I’m sure.

          7. Nigel

            Watch out Clamps I heard trans chess players are cheating by declaring their kings and queens transsexual at strategic moments during their games! Only you can save chess from these evil schemes!

          8. Clampers Outside!

            Only you could come up with such, cop on with your assumed hysterics, thou dust project too much :0)

        2. realPolithicks

          I always enjoy your efforts to downplay what is clearly an obsession on your part, you seem oddly threatened by these “gender issues” and I would be interested to understand why that is.

          1. Clampers Outside!

            Ooooooh… “obsessed” is it, for having an interest…. please, calm down rP, you’re projecting pet.

          2. f_lawless

            It mightn’t have hit the collective consciousness in Ireland in the same way (yet?) but over in the States it seems to be more of a front line issue in both the tech industry and in many universities – which traditionally are predominantly left-leaning and progressive. Apparently in recent times a wave of radical left-wing ideology has been sweeping across those universities where acceptable speech is heavily policed; it’s causing the firing of lecturers, and often causing academics to self-censor for fear of recrimination.

            This is an interesting discussion with two evolutionary biologists on the topic of gender ideology. Both were fired from their positions after several years of lecturing, as their viewpoints were deemed no longer acceptable.
            According to one, “the attack on gender which seems to focus on trans people is not primarily being driven by trans people. It’s being driven by others who have an agenda and trans is the excuse to bully those of us who would say actually, biology trumps these other considerations…their agenda has to do with gaining the right to hard code solutions into the rules of civilisation without inviting comments from experts in relevant disciplines..I would say it’s motivated a desire for power although I can’t say for sure how this thing runs in the minds of those who are pushing this agenda. Their objective is to accumulate power and wield it in their own self interest”
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xU77FhkcZ8

          3. Clampers Outside!

            * eyeroll *

            Hyperbolic nonsense, because you’ve nothing worth to say…. pffft

          4. realPolithicks

            You can always tell that you’ve gotten clampers back up when he starts being condesending and calling people “pet or tulip” or whatever. The reason I used the word “obsessed” is because you return to this subject on a regular basis usually backing up your claims with a link to some obscure website or person that you couldn’t know about without researching the issue. Also your notion that because you found a trans person who agrees with your views then they are somehow vindicated is laughable at best. There’s plenty of crackpots on the interwebs and you can always find something that will back up an opinion no matter how nutty.

          5. Clampers Outside!

            LOL…. no backs up here rP.
            And your logic…
            “I never heard of ‘X’, so ‘X’ is obscure”

            Also…
            “having an interest in a topic means one is obsessed”

            …i say again…. Pffft!

          6. Clampers Outside!

            There are numerous trans persons I can point you to, but if I did that, you’d just avoid discussion and call me obsessed, as you have clearly demonstrated these past couple of comments.
            You’re being ridiculous rP, completely so.

          7. f_lawless

            “being nice to trans people”
            your definition of “being nice” includes the creation of an atmosphere where evolutionary biologists – who draw on the evidence of millions of years of evolution across various species, including humans ,to claim that, actually the evidence shows that its wrong to define gender as nothing more than a human social construct hat we can pick and choose –
            are being made live in fear for their livelihoods if they air their views?
            Scary, and/or willfully delusional.

          8. realPolithicks

            Come on clampers, thats just nonsense. You clearly have more than “an interest” in this subject and if “obsessed” is too strong a word then I apologize but as I’ve said in other comments on this thread I would really like to understand how this issue impacts you in the real world?

          9. Clampers Outside!

            Because celebrating sporting achievement is about fair play and good sporting behaviour, and competing with an anatomically male body in a sport category intended to include anatomically female bodies does not abide by such fair play and good sporting behaviour… or to use the oft expressed phrase on Broadsheet… “in fairness” like, I’m the interest of fairness.

          10. Clampers Outside!

            Further to that, remember that the IAAF has stated that they simply “don’t go there” with regard to the anatomical differences because those recognised and acknowledged differencea cannot be changed, and of course that is a big concern with regard to sporting “fairness”.

            The IAAF cannot equalise on that factor so they choose to ignore it.

            That’s neither sporting nor fair.

        3. Nigel

          I shouldn’t make fun.Trans people are vulnerable in all sorts of ways and idiots like you will eagerly jump on any trojan horse to attack them.

          1. Clampers Outside!

            Make fun… wtf…

            You’re the one calling transpersons’ opinions transphobic ya spanner.

          2. Clampers Outside!

            You avoid the points made, and resort to pathetic insults… you’re some tulip.

          3. Nigel

            Oh thank goodness you didn’t use derogatory female terms on me again! I couldn’t possibly withstand such scathing wit!

    1. eoin

      v. interesting Johnny. Won’t this section be unacceptable to Jeremy Corbyn (has he even read the document yet)

      With respect to commercial partnerships:
       Discourage actions that directly or indirectly prejudice or otherwise discourage commercial
      activity solely between the United States and Israel;
       Discourage politically motivated actions to boycott, divest from, and sanction Israel;
       Seek the elimination of politically motivated nontariff barriers on Israeli goods, services, or
      other commerce imposed on Israel; and
       Seek the elimination of state-sponsored unsanctioned foreign boycotts of Israel, or
      compliance with the Arab League Boycott of Israel.

  8. Janet, I ate my Avatar

    I’m probably going to get slated for this but if I was training for a sprint race with the competition of male muscle mass at the end of the day I wouldn’t have a hope.
    However I recognise that as a knee jerk, do hormones level the playing field ? As these transitions are relatively recent do we have the info really to base judgment on ? It’s an emotive minefield.
    Also no one puts themselves through those kind of changes for fashion, other cultures recognise different gender etc…
    I don’t know, I’m undecided about the sport issue and wish arguments could be heard without labelling people extremists ?
    The incoherence of this comment reflects my knowledge the subject

    1. Nigel

      It does need careful, sensitive discussion to find a fair way to ease people’s concerns. International athletics and the Olympics are run by honest and thoughtful bodies so I’m sure it’ll be fine and the trans athletes won’t come out the worst of it..

      1. Clampers Outside!

        But you still see nothing wrong with transwomen with their anatomical advantages competing in women’s sports… right…

        1. realPolithicks

          Why do you care about this so much, how does it impact you in the real world? This is a genuine question clampers, I’m not trying to be smart you clearly feel very strongly about this and I’m just curious why that is.

          1. Yep

            It could be the sadness and disappointment he feels for the numerous women who have spent their lives working so hard to excel in their chosen sport that seem to have been forgotten in this trans inclusivity move.

            You don’t feel bad for ’em?

          2. f_lawless

            here’s one for you – what if violent and dangerous male prisoners here in Ireland claim they that they now self identify as women and therefore have the right to be placed in women’s prisons. Wouldn’t we be denying them their human rights to prevent them? Presumably if you yourself aren’t going to end up in prison, should you care?

          3. Nigel

            Aren’t you using an unlikely outlier to potentially demonise genuine trans prisoners? Wasn’t there a hoax story on this theme being blared in the headlines and even here not so long ago? Anyone identifying as trans in prison is almost certainly way more at risk than anyone else.

          4. Clampers Outside!

            Really rP?

            Never supported, for example, a charity that works for something you’re not directly affected by? Really? I don’t believe it, in fairness.
            it’s a ridiculous question.

          5. Nigel

            I’m sure perfectly good solutions could be found if everyone stopped mimicking the bad old gay-scare days.

          6. Nigel

            They’re coming for your children they’re in your toilets and your women’s prisons they’re an insane pseudoscienctific ideology destroying freedom of speech and they’re ruining sport. Nope no scaremongering at all!

        2. Nigel

          Unless you’re telling me that men are deliberately undergoing gender reassignment to compete in female sports then no, I’m not too pushed about it. I’d like to see some sort of consensus emerge from within athletics before grabbing pitchforks

          1. Clampers Outside!

            I’m not telling you that, but it appears you are imagining an argument from that position.
            These athletes don’t have to change sex, we’re not talking transsexuals, we’re talking transgender which includes ‘gender self ID’, and the simple reduction in anatomically male bodies of the testosterone hormone levels to qualify as an “equal” competitor with anatomically female bodies.

    1. Martco

      ah lads, seriously? yiz are talking about the olympics here? the olympics. arguing about uneven playing fields in a setup riddled with playing fields about as even as something you’d see at the ploughing. IOC, FIFA, corrupt as fupp. who cares.
      go wacky races on the thing I say, let em take whatever drugs they want, retrofit robotic body parts & wearable tech innovations. imagine the commercials on that. trans arguments are a nonsense in the context of the intrinsically corrupt olympics, fs like.

  9. SOQ

    I genuinely have no idea how to read HR competency bullpoo then translate it into real life work experiences. It is just a box ticking exercise which leaves prepped up kids in jobs they have no idea how to do.

  10. SOQ

    I genuinely have no idea how to read HR competency bullpoo then translate it into real life work experiences. It is just a box ticking exercise which leaves prepped up kids in jobs they have no idea how to do.

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