Pro-choice supporters in Dublin last October
Abortion Support Network, which was founded in 2009 and is based in England, helps Irish women pay for their trips to England or Wales—via donations from supporters—and finds them accommodation, if necessary.
Mara Clarke, director of ASN, says the organization hears stories from Irish women who were initially unaware of the group’s existence and who had tried to terminate their pregnancies.
“We are told, ‘I’ve been Googling ways to self-abort,'” Clarke says. “We had a woman who went out and bought heroin; she’s not a drug user, but she thought it might cause a miscarriage. We had a mother of four who said, ‘I’m trying to think of ways to crash my car so I miscarry but don’t die.’
“Women tell us they have drunk bleach and floor cleaner or swallowed packets of birth control pills and a bottle of spirits. We always tell the women not to do it and that they should let us give them the money.”
In Catholic Ireland, Battle Lines Drawn Over Abortion As Election Looms (Newsweek, Mirren Gida)
Previously: Illegal Abortion In Ireland
Leah Farrell/Rollingnews
Saddening….. the IONA Institute and all its hideous members should be pushed off a short peer with low tide.
And I need spelling lessons… ‘pier’
no clamps, you’re spot on. into the see with both noble gentry and catholic bigots!!
sea, goddam it!
Both of you in the c
There are an awful lot of Catholic bigots in sees.
what about non catholic bigots like me (assuming a pro-life person is a bigot now…)
don’t we get consideration?
or is it just the catholics?
that depends. do you have a peerage?
You are a bigot if you are pro life. No assumption. Just fact.
Get a fupping grip Cathy …
Lord Mandelson?
Ah yes, because a group of people have different opinions to you so you argue that they shouldn’t have a voice. *KEYBOARD WARRIOR SWOON*
Seriously, fascist much?
Excuse me, where did I say they cannot speak? And would you mind please, put down the megaphone….. and you even squeezed in a Godwin…. bless…. *cuddles*
Whether you like it or not, IONA have every right to exist, much the same as GLEN, even tobacco lobbyists have a right to form a lobby group. This is a democracy. If you don’t like somebody else’s opinion that’s a pity but they have a right to express it; they have a right to form a lobby group; they have a right to raise funding; they have a right to lobby government and they have a right to use the media to disseminate their message. I know this shocks the little bubble you’ve created for yourself but you really need to get out more.
His question; where did I say they cannot speak?
Your answer; Whether you like it or not, IONA have every right to exist
You just stick to a script, don’t you.
He expressed the wish that they would drown. Umm … again … this is TOO easy.
Could ye both go be the same as each other somewhere else?
@MIKEYFEX OK you got me, I am in fact Moyestwithexcitement, Clampers and Helen Lovejoy.
I am so lonely because IRL I have no friends. Hold me?
“He expressed the wish that they would drown. Umm … again”
And, of course, you took that literally. This really *is* too easy.
“And, of course, you took that literally. This really *is* too easy.”
OH MY GOD YOU USED QUOTATION MARKS YOU MUST HAVE A PROBLEM WITH FREE SPEECH.
this country has a serious hatred of women, by refusing them the right to choose.
only certain people dav. guess what colour shirts they wear? can you? can you guess?
ably led by blushirts, but this hatred transcends party lines.
It’s all gone plaid man !
Yeah, the State’s hatred of women spans generation after generation, Magdalene Laundries, the treatment of Cynthia Owens, the victims of that Butcher in the Lourdes in Drogheda, Savita, Miss Y, the list continues.
It makes you sick.
Thank God, St Paddy civilised us, wha’?
Free Abortions Now! For Everybody!!
No! Let’s bury our heads in the sand instead so we can feel better!
If that’s their CHOICE, yes.
Thats the Spirit Zuppy!!
What was the name of that panda from The Den? Was it just Panda?
Are you thinking of Ted?
Possibly. I actually can’t remember. This saddens me.
Cheer up, you are.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_The_Den_cast_members#Ted
Hooray! What an emotional rollercoaster that was.
Raspberry leaf is meant to cause abortions naturally, if taken early enough, I remember reading once. Take it later and it will strengthen the womb. It can be taken as a tea.
don’t forget the top tips about clothes hangers
Call the Midwife (the Mammy wanted to watch it, I swear) did a great story about this last week – ended badly as one might expect
I am an unashamed fan of Call the Midwife, Don, and you should be too, even if the Thalidomide storyline is a bit clunky. It does make you think this country would have been a lot nicer if we had protestant nuns instead.
OK. I will be.
Can I make a confession? I cry at least once during every single one. It’s a lovely lovely women-centric show, of which we have very few, even if it does gloss over things slightly. It’s tops.
I own a Call the Midwife box set. So there.
The docker with leukemia really winded me the other week.
All right, I wept like child.
I hear ya, I was in pieces Old Boy, complete pieces! Not so much pulling on your heart strings and ripping open your chest and cutting them one by one…
*sniffs*
Well this was unexpected.
Three more crying chairs to aisle five !
@Bertie – not if you watch it it’s not
@Clampers – bring tissues and some tea and biscuits yeah?
And a duvet.
Defo duvets meadow, defo
Women should be able to make their own choices, its as simple as that.
No it isn’t.
Women should *not* be able to make their own choices?
Nope. I couldn’t decide if I wanted to birth the dying child inside me at 18 or if I wanted an abortion so I could recover and sit my LC and continue with life without that trauma.
Pffft. That sounds like an easy decision; like choosing what to wear in the morning. I bet you wish you could have loads of abortions.
Hmmm, I see you have literacy problems. I said ‘it’ isn’t as in ‘it’ isn’t that simple.
Did you vote yes to equality last year? Was it because you did not want to deny gay people the opportunity to get married? Because equality means equal opportunities, doesn’t it? So tell me, what is more important than the opportunity to live?
If you really believe in equality you should be campaigning for the equality of those who have no voice at all and whose opportunity to life will be taken away without any consideration of what they deserve, and what they are entitled to.
“I said ‘it’ isn’t as in ‘it’ isn’t that simple.”
Uh huh. The ‘it’ being the post you replied to saying women should have their own choice. Good lad.
“If you really believe in equality you should be campaigning for the equality of those who have no voice at all and whose opportunity to life will be taken away without any consideration of what they deserve, and what they are entitled to.”
That’s straight up marketing copy. I’d nearly bet on you being in IONA or Youth Defence.
Your assumption that a logical argument you disagree with must be professionally or ‘think-tank’ produced says a tragic amount about you.
Not in Iona, not in Youth Defence, and I assume this is an anti-Catholic thing on your part so I’ll blow your mind: I don’t even go to mass – you really should get out more and look at Broadsheet less. You might experience something new.
“Your assumption that a logical argument you disagree with must be professionally or ‘think-tank’ produced says a tragic amount about you.”
Thanks. I’m *exceedingly* smart. Fair play for recognising that.
“I assume this is an anti-Catholic thing on your part”
Obviously you’re wrong but that’s the media training you got from Iona; portray your ‘opponent’ as an oppressor.
“I don’t even go to mass”
So you’re a born again?
Thanks I had a good chuckle at that – I love to engage with irate people on the internet and watch them go.
Fancy a date, sweetheart? You can pay, because, you know I’m all into women’s lib. By lib I mean libido! xx
Yikes. We’ve got a live one, lads.
Also, I’m not a woman. I have noticed how all the creepy weirdos who oppose abortion will make disparaging comments about women though.
“Also, I’m not a woman. I have noticed how all the creepy weirdos who oppose abortion will make disparaging comments about women though.”
You are taking the moral high ground, YOU MUST BE IN IONA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
“You are taking the moral high ground, YOU MUST BE IN IONA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!”
I didn’t think it would be *that* easy to get you to project. So you think you’re taking the moral high ground. Of course you do. Slogan chanting zombies always do because they lack the basic smarts needed to form a coherent argument.
See we can all take quotations out of context and then come up with a sensationalised response.
Now, what are you doing on Thursday, big boy? xx
“Slogan chanting zombies always do because they lack the basic smarts needed to form a coherent argument.”
BRAINS BRAINS BRAINS BRAINS
You’re the one chanting a trendy slogan without giving any coherent justification for it.
Hopefully listening to you tell me all about how icky women are, you charmer.
“You’re the one chanting a trendy slogan without giving any coherent justification for it.”
I need to justify giving women a choice? Ok, mate. I can see why you’re trying your luck with men now.
Seriously, this is too easy. Unlike the issue of abortion which is far more complex than the pithy simplistic ‘choice’ slogan you are hiding behind.
Answer me this straight up: what about the opportunities of the child in the womb? Do they not deserve a chance of life? Where’s their choice?
Disliking or even hating all that “Iona” and “Youth Defence” stand for does not make one an anti-Catholic. Neither group has an official voice given to them by the Catholic people of Ireland or the RCC. To suggest that they represent all Catholics on this island is a complete nonsense.
David Quinn of IONA himself said that they were a multi-denominational body. I know that’s bullcarp, but that’s what the fuppwit said.
They are both self appointed lobby groups who often jar with the official line of the RCC and El Papa. So, having a good go at either IONA or YD is not the same as someone who is anti-Catholic.
“Seriously, this is too easy.”
Isn’t it?
“Unlike the issue of abortion which is far more complex than the pithy simplistic ‘choice’ slogan you are hiding behind.”
Maybe to religious sheep like yourself.
“what about the opportunities of the child in the womb?”
You mean foetus.
“Do they not deserve a chance of life?”
Sure. Do I deserve a better paying job? Also sure. Does that it mean it should happen just because I deserve it? No. Reality doesn’t work like that. Honestly, you religious wackos live in a fantasy.
“Where’s their choice?”
They get it when they reach sentience and ability to survive without a host body.
@Clampers re-write that because I have no clue what you are talking about.
@moyest seriously stop with the quotations I know what I said. Speaking of which, like I said earlier, I am not religious; so stop assuming that I am. It is possible to be anti-abortion and not believe in God. Your argument makes no sense – if it is taken to its full conclusion then we should be able to kill children until the point that they are able to fend for themselves. Are you a reincarnated Spartan by any chance? I say that only in jest and I am explaining that I am saying that in jest because I am worried that you’ll start assuming that I adhere to ancient Greek mythology. PRAISE ZEUS! Cough. Cough. Also, referring to women as host bodies? WOW. Anyway, rock on there keyboard warrior – but watch the blood pressure sweetheart – you may prove a wasted life yourself – see having a callous disregard for someone else’s life is pretty sh1tty isn’t it? xx
“It is possible to be anti-abortion and not believe in God.”
It’s also possible to lie on the internet about your belief in God to give your clearly religious argument more credibility.
“if it is taken to its full conclusion then we should be able to kill children until the point that they are able to fend for themselves.”
No, that’s not the full conclusion of it at all. It’s actually funny that you’d think that. Religious folks like yourself don’t do logic very well though so I forgive you.
“Also, referring to women as host bodies? WOW.”
I know, yeah. That’s what your mates in IONA think of women. Sick, isn’t it.
“you may prove a wasted life yourself – see having a callous disregard for someone else’s life is pretty sh1tty isn’t it?”
We’re not all emotionally unstable simpletons who take the words of an anonymous internet poster to heart. Evidently, you do. My condolences. Maybe message boards aren’t for you. I hope you stay though.
Yawn.
Hold on, I’ll save you the need to reply.
“Yawn” YOU SEE YOU ARE IN IONA AND YOU ARE RELIGIOUS.
If the mother decides they do. The mother makes the choice.
Good man. Give your tiny little brain a rest.
“Good man. Give your tiny little brain a rest.”
OH MY GOD THE BIBLE MENTIONS THE WORD “LITTLE” AND ZOMBIES LIKE “BRAINS” YOU MUST BE RELIGIOUS AND A ZOMBIE!!!!!!!
It looks like I’ve broken you. Thanks for feeding my ego.
“It looks like I’ve broken you. Thanks for feeding my ego.” You haven’t broken me, you’ve aroused me..
Yes it is.
Next.
Ok, you want to guarantee a right to life to a foetus that you cannot guarantee will progress to and through childbirth.
The foetus is not alive by objective measures until it can survive birth, so this trimester you have a living being, prior to that what you have is the equivalent of a brain dead person on life support. And we terminate life support for brain dead folk all the time.
What’s the difference?
You always think you’ve heard the worst stories imaginable, but they just keep coming.
Repeal the poxy 8th ASAP.
I subscribe to the ASN’s monthly email. This is what cases they dealt with only last month:
“In January, we heard from 84 people, which is 12 more than our previous busiest month. This included resolution of two of the worst cases ASN has ever dealt with. One involved a homeless woman who was pregnant as result of rape, needed a visa to travel, had serious mental health issues and had no access to internet, email or funds. The other involved one of the most horrific cases of domestic abuse we’ve ever encountered and a client with numerous issues including needing to come to England twice and a medical complication that resulted in a hospital stay. Both of these cases required additional help from organisations that were putting themselves at risk by helping women obtain abortions, calling in favours from people who could help with logistics such as printing up flight confirmations, wiring funds to pay for a visa, prepaying bus tickets and taxis, hours of calls, countless texts and tears on both sides of the phone.
Additional clients heard from in January included:
A woman whose last pregnancy was medically complicated to the point where she almost died, and yet was denied a termination on medical grounds.
A woman who travelled to England for an early medical abortion to find herself still pregnant several weeks later. While the clinic offered her a free surgical procedure if she was able to travel back before she was 14 weeks pregnant, she had spent all her money on her first trip. ASN covered the cost of her flights.
“I am pregnant after a sexual attack by an ex-boyfriend who left me with this and a number of injuries. I am scared and I really can’t afford the treatment but I really need to have an abortion. I have included my mobile number but I would prefer an email response as I’m wary of people hearing.”
A woman who had managed to come up with most of what she needed to pay for the travel and procedure, and needed ASN to top up her funds. (Side note – We LOVE it when this happens; one phone call and everything’s sorted)
A single mother scraping by who was able to save £120 from her benefits. A medical issue meant she was not able to receive treatment so had to travel back to England a second time, incurring additional childcare and travel costs. We were able to cover the difference.
“I found out I am 13 weeks yesterday did not know I was so far on, I am desperate need for abortion as I am very depressed about this situation. I have a baby already and have just finally got rid of my abusive controlling partner and cannot continue with this pregnancy.”
Several women who were undecided about having an abortion but wanting advice about their options. We signposted them to the ifpa, NIFPA, Dublin Well Woman centre and FemPlus for unbiased information about their options and told them to get back in touch if they decided on abortion and needed financial help.
A single mother who couldn’t tell her anti-abortion family about this pregnancy due to the shame they heaped upon her for having her existing child (damned if you do . . . )
A woman who was prevented from travelling over as planned as her partner took away her passport and her travel tickets to keep her from having the abortion.
A woman who was told by an (oh so helpful) doctor at a hospital that a scan showed her to be “8-12 weeks” pregnant”
This was only in the last month, now.
Thanks for posting this, though it was a difficult read. I’m off to subscribe to their mailing list and make a donation.
The debate shouldn’t even be happening for crying out loud. The abortions are still taking place as they always have just with the added stress and stigma the law pressed on women.
It’s a disgrace. Right to choose simple as that.
Great comments.
+1
No, no, no… if we ship them abroad it’s not our problem and then we can hold our heads high and say…… ‘no abortion here we send it across the water instead’.
loads of things still take place – just cos they do . It isn’t a reason to legalise them
although i like this crowd (all opposed to them) no sneaking about like other crowds looking for abortion in extreme circumstances when they really want full access to clinics in ireland . They are honest what they want . I can respect that if not agree
So, just to get this straight. You’d rather criminalise women than give them access to medical procedures they need?
Stories like this just reinforce one thing: It doesn’t matter if abortion is legal or not, women will have an abortion if they don’t want to be pregnant. Restricting access to abortion makes women who don’t want to be pregnant take extreme steps to rectify the situation. In the US before abortion became legal they had septicemia wards adjacent to the maternity wards in hospital, dealing with the women who’d had botched back-alley abortions.
And while women who are able to afford to travel have an option, other women – who don’t have the money, or access to the handfuil of sources which can legally give the information on how to travel are left to take these desperate measures.
Lorcan, your posts on this subject are top notch. They are thoughtful, concise, and extremely coherent. The arguments you use are reasonable and well informed. I am always relieved when I see a post from you. Pro-life lobbyists cannot effectively argue with the facts you present.
Plus 100
I really appreciate the kind words, guys. If you’re in Dublin and interested in getting involved, the Abortion Rights Campaign’s next open meeting is on Monday in Outhouse on Capel Street at 7PM. There’s also regional groups affiliated with ARC in each province, with more and more local groups forming and coming on board all the time.
The flippancy of some of the comments on this post made my stomach turn. It’s clearly, still a man’s world. Women’s health is affected by pregnancy, which can potentially endanger at least two lives. Circumstances of conception are invariably unpredictable, as are the consequences of carrying to full term. Every woman who has ever conceived, either willingly/unwillingly/expectedly/unexpectedly – their future lives flashes in front of them, “Dying in Reverse”. It’s a woman’s choice. It’s not a religious choice, and how dare religions, or any religiously funded institutions intrude on any woman’s health and her health choices.
Are the 13th and 14th amendments not sufficient?
the 13th and 14th amendments aren’t suffiicient at all.
While information on travelling is now available, it’s only legally availbable from specific sources. As you can see from the testimonials above, many of these women had no idea how to go about travelling to the UK or Europe.
Also, travelling isn’t good enough, because it means that only the women who can afford to travel can get an abortion. If you’re poor, or in an abusive relationship or similar circumstances, or an asylum seeker – tough. And if you try and have an abortion if you can’t travel, you’re a criminal liable for 14 years in prison.
Finally, travelling allows Ireland as a society to keep sweeping abortion under the rug. Instead of facing up to the fact that 10 or more women travel outside the country per day for abortions, that thousands of ‘abortion pills’ are intercepted by customs each year, we shy away from this. We make the women who do travel or try to smuggle in pills or do more drastic things into pariahs who are afraid to even talk about a basic medical procedure for fear of being ostracised. The number of people I know who only told me their abortion stories after they discovered I was actively pro-choice is staggering.