Women Drivers And Me

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keithmillsMarriage referendum ‘No’ campaigner Keith Mills

Ciaran writes:

Keith Mills, one of the leading opponents of marriage equality was on the Matt Cooper show on TodayFM yesterday.
Mr Mills, who is gay, was defending the so-called conscience clause in which Christians taking a particular interpretation of the Bible might be allowed discriminate against gay people. The discussion moved on to garage owners refusing to sell petrol to women because they believe, on religious grounds, that women shouldn’t drive; e.g. hardline Muslims….

Matt Cooper: “So if somebody believes, – here is the example that I use, Keith – and we know this is a tenet of a particular interpretation of some world religions, of some of the largest religions in the world – if someone believes that it is against their religion to allow a woman to drive a car, do you think in Irish law their religious conviction should be allowed then to discriminate, to refuse to provide that woman with goods and services related to the driving of a car.”

Keith Mills:
“No, because…”

Cooper: “But why?”

Mills: “Because a man and a woman are equal.”

Cooper: “No, no, but that’s your view. You’re now disagreeing with the deeply held religious conviction of somebody who believes that a woman should not be permitted to drive a car and that’s their deeply held religious conviction.”

Mills: “As I said, it would vary depending on the circumstances.”

Cooper: “So it varies depending on what you believe, not on what other people believe.”

Mills: “I’ve outlined where I am on this thing. If they are the owners of a monopoly, and they are the only person that can provide petrol in a neighbourhood, then I think they……if on the other hand, 500 yards down the road, there’s another petrol station, you can go to that one.”

Listen here

Related: Why I’ll Be Voting No Even Though I’m Gay (Keith Mills, Independent.ie)

Pic Tony Gavin (Independent)

62 thoughts on “Women Drivers And Me

          1. Mikeyfex

            As a rule I do not to play anything involving knives with anyone who has been in contact with Mani in any way in the preceding 24 months.

          2. andyourpointiswhatexactly

            Ruh roh. Have I confused you with Mani? Or are you both her gentleman callers?

  1. Owen C

    I have some sympathy here for the conscience clause as it pertains to the provision of non regulated, freely available services, and how this differs from the provision of regulated or government provided/constrained services.

    Certain services are not freely available and the market cannot simply create the service if an existing provider does not want to offer it to certain segments of society. Other services could be set up very quickly and easily.

    Lets take a look at a few examples – bakery and petrol station vs a pub and doctors clinic. There is essentially no restriction on your ability to set up the first two examples, so having a conscience clause does not seem likely to restrict the provision of those services (by someone else) to segments of society. However, there is major restrictions and constraints on the ability to set up a pub or a doctors office, so they should be forced to provide their services to anyone seeking to use them.

    1. realPolithicks

      A conscience clause is nothing more than a license to discriminate against whatever you disagree with, and would be applied liberally by the many bigots out there.

    2. Derval

      @Owen C
      Civil Marriage is a Government-Provided service and Civil Marriage is what we are talking about here,
      so there is no place for a conscience clause in relation to this.
      Religions aren’t being asked to do anything.
      Anyone can set up a club and make a rule that says, eg. Men aren’t allowed to touch the hind legs of airedale terriers.

  2. Sadface

    Proving that we are all equal but Dick-heads are Dick-heads…
    This comment is never gonna make it on..

  3. Bluebeard

    Owners always reserve the right to make their services available. That is their right. If I knew a guy who humiliated his wife and treated her like a skivvy, I wouldn’t like him in my shop. Is that a matter of conscience? Surely i could tell him to go jump?

    1. gerard

      Yes you can, equality legislation only applies if you decide to refuse service on one of the following grounds: Gender, Civil Status, Family Status, Age, Race, Religion, Disability, Sexual Orientation, Membership of the Traveller community.

      So go ahead, feel free to refuse that wife beater…

    2. Panchis

      You can discriminate on a number of things. If you feel someone is a twit, you can refuse to serve them. However, there are a few things it is against the law to discriminate on – in Ireland these include:
      Gender, marital status, family status, sexual orientation, religion, age, disability, race or membership of the Traveller community.

      Here’s a quote from the Department of Justice website; on the current state of provision of goods and services:
      “Discrimination outside the workplace is prohibited by the Equal Status Acts 2000 to 2004. If you are trying to access goods or services and you feel you are discriminated against unlawfully, on any of the nine prohibited grounds, you can make a claim under these Acts.”

      The problem with the proposed ‘conscience clause’ is that it’s going to make it lawful to discriminate based on sexual orientation, which is utter rubbish, and a step backwards in the fight for equality.

  4. Ms Piggy

    So if, as a deeply committed racist, I decide I don’t want to serve people of colour in my business, that’s ok with this guy? Hmm, whites-only diners and public toilets, if only that had been tried somewhere…seriously, this ‘conscience clause’ debate is beyond ridiculous.

    1. Don Pidgeoni

      At least it takes very little for their logic to coming crashing down around their ears

    2. Nially

      That was put to him elsewhere in the interview; his response was basically “We’re not racist, and it’s appalling to suggest that our views our similar to those of racists”, with no further explanation.

  5. bisted

    …there are still two months to go to the referendum and this guy, David Quinn, Breda & Co will be coining it with their media appearances.

  6. Caroline

    These men-only filling stations will do very well, I believe. Why I can see them now. Just no-nonsense fuelling by a great bunch of lads – the men. Instead of wimmin taking all day with their limp-wristed efforts to squeeze the fuel nozzle, inevitably missing the round figure and then having to pay by card, which of course they won’t have out of their purse even though they’ve been queuing to pay for 10 minutes, UGH. Forget that, that sh*t is 500 yards down the road. From now on it’s wall-to-wall Yorkie displays and belay the chit-chat, my good fellow.

  7. Liam O'Connor

    I heard that interview and it was embarrassing to listen to. I have had my doubts about voting yes, I’m not so sure anymore if that’s the kind of person that’s advocating a No. Dark stuff advocating discrimination.

    1. Grace

      Jaysis, Liam don’t be put off voting yes on account of that moron. He is one of only a couple of confused gays advocating a no vote. Please listen instead to the thousands of gay people, myself included, calling for a yes vote -as this will make huge, positive and lasting change in our lives. In addition, no straight relationships will be harmed if this passes, nor will children suffer ANY negative consequences. What’s not to like??

      1. Talismania!

        +1. This is a weak attempt by the opposition at getting the Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt discussions going. Then he got shot down in flames.

  8. Frilly Keane

    Ha

    I’m loving this Vote No crowd

    I might have ta’send ’em a few bob so they can keep it up

  9. zackersetu

    WAIT A MINUTE!! Isn’t that the fella who isn’t going to be a actually voting anyway…cos he’s going to the Eurovision!!!

    Now I am a card carrying member of the gay community and in a civil partnership and will be getting married if passed…. and I LOVE the Eurovision (I know) but had I the apparent gall to campaign for a no vote and then actually Feic off to Austria when it comes to vote … I would say 3 things

    1) get off the airways you utter idiot.. you’re not voting…you do not have shred of integrity to stand on your soap box for something you aren’t even bothered to take part in.

    2) yay…. one less no vote!

    3) just because you are gay and don’t want to have equal rights does not make you an expert… it doesn’t give you a unique viewpoint…what it makes you is selfish. How dare you represent your community so shamefully. If you don’t want to marry then don’t, but don’t you dare stand in the way of those who want to feel equal in the country where they were born or live. If you want to feel like a second class citizen, I suggest you relocate to Uganda. Perhaps your particular self loathing might be well received there. It’s ridiculous; straight people who don’t want to get married do not feel the need to degrade their friends, family and neighbours in order to campaign for the abolition of marriage. They don’t have a stronger position because they are straight, they merely have an opinion and no other distinguishing factor to make their viewpoint any more relevant .You actually disgust me. You odious and based on this interview, you clearly bumbling buffoon!

      1. zackersetu

        ……………………………… (awkward silence) …………… (do I point out the fundamental misunderstanding the poster has regarding the concept of discrimination) ……….nah probably not worth it.) ……….. (awkward silence shall continue)

  10. Mr. T.

    Governments love reform like equal marriage and anti-discrimination legislation because it distracts the populace and makes them think they are getting a more free and fair society.

    But at the same time, they sneak through legislation like TTIP which benefits huge corporations and overrides democratic sovereign governments and ultimately weakens your voice and your vote and your ability to maintain good employment rights and conditions.

    So you can marry who you want but if you can’t pay for bills, private companies will dock your wages at source. And you’ll probably end up finding that half of the money you earn goes in various taxes and most of the rest to a small number of huge corporations.

    Don’t be fooled by the shiny shiny.

  11. Anne

    What a dumb bottom..

    This sort of simpleton shouldn’t be allowed on the radio.

    “because a man and woman are equal”.. Duh. Talk about missing the point.

  12. bobsyerauntie

    Keith needs to come to terms with self loathing, sham and internalized homophobia.
    He should read “The velvet rage” by Alan Downs, when he’s finished that he should then go to the gay identity section of his nearest large book shop and read some more. He should read loads of gay literature, fiction and non- fiction. When he has sufficiently informed himself on the origins of the gay man’s self hate, shame and oppression, he then might set forth upon a path of self-healing, compassion and happiness. If he finds some inner peace eventually, he then might not be so bothered with drenching his fellow gays with projections of his own shame, fear and neurosis.

  13. bobsyerauntie

    sorry typo!…

    Meant “Shame” Not “Sham” .. However the word sham is not entirely inappropriate, albeit it was a very obvious Freudian slip!

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