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Claire Byrne Live on RTÉ One last night

Anyone?

Watch Claire Byrne Live in full here

UPDATE:

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131 thoughts on “Unchallenged

    1. well

      900,000? On an island with a population of 4.5 million?
      You’d have to be a complete plank not to realize how ridiculous that statement is.
      Pretty certain one fifth of the population are no migrants.

      1. Captain Redbeard

        ‘pretty sure 1/5th of the population aren’t migrants’ They are, just the opposite direction.

      2. classter

        The 2011 census indicated that there were 412,975 white people not of White Irish or Irish Traveller ethnicity living in the Republic with Eastern Europeans comprising about half of these.

        So even if these figures are understated (it is often suggested that short term migrants are less likely, less willing to provide information to census takers) it would still be a lot less than 900k Eastern Europeans.

        Interestingly (for me) approx 15% of residents in the state have an ethnicity other than White Irish/Irish Traveller. That includes 1.6% ‘not staed’ and 0.9% ‘mixed background’.

          1. Dόn Pídgéόní

            Try again…

            My point was that him wanting to go to Sweden to get them fixed has in basis in fact, especially when he was trying to get to Canada!

          2. Paolo

            He and his wife shouldn’t have put his children on that boat. IT was reckless an unnecessary.

            Of course, he should not have felt that he had to do it in the first place but the one does not justify the other.

          3. Dόn Pídgéόní

            I don’t know Paolo, I don’t know the full situation and I’ve thankfully never been in the position to have to try. But silliness like he was going to Sweden to get new teeth don’t help.

          4. chicken

            Am sure if ISIS removed his teeth, then maybe he also feared for his family’s security and well-being.
            Not only wanting new teeth!!

    1. PaddyIrishMan

      Mainly from a Fine Gael councillor and the utterly delightful (and fine looking) journalist Mr Ian O’Doherty of the Irish Independent.

  1. Jonotti

    Anything coming about the violence and intimidation shown by the anti water charges knackers on Vincent Browne last night?

    1. SomeoneElse

      Oh look, another piddly Irish scandal, so let’s be outraged about that instead of being concerned by the International humanitarian disaster that’s on our doorstep.

    2. catherine

      Probably quite pointless to mention that according to eurostat 73% of the irish public are non-compliant regarding payment of IW charges, according to fg/lab 54% have not paid, so you are calling the majority of the people here knackers, a tad biased.

    1. classter

      It is a fair point, Tiddle.

      I disagree with the subject of those tweets #4 & #7 but they are subjective & it is clear that many agree. Saying that they are patently false just weakens the argument when most of the other tweets refer to ‘facts’ which genuinely are ‘patently false’.

      1. SomeoneElse

        You make no sense there.

        “They are subjective, and clear that many agree” So therefore you cannot discount them as false?

        Just because a bunch of people agree doesn’t make it so. There are many people in the Church of Scientology that believe that Lord Xenu ruled the Universe 10 billion years ago, but that’s quite obviously nonsense.

        1. classter

          OK, I’ll be more clear.

          #4 and #7 are subjective – an argument can be made that they are true, another that they are false.

          ‘Patently false’ suggests that there can be no reasonable argument, that it can easily be demonstrated as untrue (eg. 900k Polish peopkle living in the Republic).

    1. Jeb

      There’s always a petition to sign. Outraged middle class lefties love nothing better than signing a petition when they hear an opinion they dislike.

    1. Jimmy Ireland

      Within that document you linked it states there were 540,000 non-Irish nationals living in Ireland in 2011.

      1. cian

        And of those 540,000
        * 112,000 are from the UK about the same number as 2006
        * 244,000 are from ‘Eastern Europe’ double the number of 2006
        Is it possible that the number of ‘Eastern Europeans’ has doubled between 2011 and now? 500,00 of them? possible but unlikely.
        Oh, I’m including Czech and ‘other’ in these numbers.

  2. Just sayin'

    You could argue that those comments have support amongst a significant population in Ireland and that RTE was respecting their free speech. What annoyed me most was, in rebuttal, some woman talking about the irish having “big hearts”. It would’ve been better if she’d actually have some substantial arguments to rebut with. I wasn’t really interested in hearing about our medically-dangerous enlarged muscular organs.

    1. Lan

      You’re entitled to you’re own opinions but not to your own facts.

      You don’t need to “respect their free speech” if they’re either making stuff up or repeating stuff without evidence. You can call nonsense nonsense in this country

    2. Peadar

      It never ceases to amaze me how many people believe that someone disagreeing with what they have to say in some way infringes on their right to free speech

      1. MoyestWithExcitement

        “You could argue that those comments have support amongst a significant population in Ireland and that RTE was respecting their free speech.” No you fooping couldn’t. “Support” What the hell does that mean? If I could get “a significant population in Ireland” to “support” the “comment” that you, Just Sayin, are an illiterate degenerate with an unhealthy attraction to goats, would that make it ok for me to say it on TV as if it were fact? Would I be able to say “Just Sayin’ is an illiterate goatfupper” on TV because some clowns out there would “support” my “comments”?

    3. SomeoneElse

      So because the big hearts lady was wishy washy, you support the racist oponents that spout obvious nonsense?

  3. Augustus Gloop

    While all of those statements above are clearly bogus and designed to service an anti-immigration agenda, I’m not exactly sure how they constitute racism.

    Selfish, irrational and paranoid certainly….but none of them appear to be making any essentialist statements about race.

    If you want to win over dissenters, it’s hardly advisable to take this easy option. It only gives fuel to the fire that their opinion is being stifled by the “liberal elite” etc.

      1. Mikeyfex

        There’s another point missed moyest, in your keenness to be righteous. I’d reread the first line in the final paragraph of that comment again there.

        1. MoyestWithExcitement

          You mean the bit where he said we shouldn’t offend the racists in order to change their mind like any of us should give a poo about them? I did. Why?

          1. Paolo

            You are deliberately avoiding the glaringly obvious. The OP isn’t agreeing with the content of the tweets just pointing out that they are not, in themselves, racist.

    1. Lorcan Nagle

      “While all of those statements above are clearly bogus and designed to service an anti-immigration agenda, I’m not exactly sure how they constitute racism”

      What is an anti-immigrant policy, especially one targeting primarily people from the Middle East if not rascist?

      1. Augustus Gloop

        When it’s couched in economic/demographic arguments, as opposed to making broad-sweeping assumptions about the characteristics of a race, which can be characterised as a hate crime. Which is what racism is.

        For example: “There are now 900,000 migrants from Eastern Europe living in Ireland”

        This is no doubt absurd and is a below the belt statement intended to cause hysteria and panic. But how is it a racist statement exactly – as previously claimed?

        Or, more controversially this:

        “(Aylan Kurdi) dies because his father wanted to get his teeth fixed in Europe, he should be prosecuted for child abuse”

        How is that a racist statement? It’s outrageous, insensitive and I assume entirely inaccurate. But there’s nothing racist about it.

        1. rotide

          It’s already been covered here that it’s accurate. He did want to get his teeth fixed (because he lost them through torture). The child abuse thing is outrageous alright.

          1. Dόn Pídgéόní

            Really? Was he going to Sweden for the teeth or Canada for his family? A lot of misinformation and crossed stories going around about this. People don’t even get basic information like the family wasn’t in Turkey for 3 years. Can’t we all agree we know f*** all about it and shut up?

          2. MoyestWithExcitement

            But Dón, there are people with important emotional problems who need to judge others so they can feel better about themselves. How dare you ask them to think rationally.

    2. Jeb

      But people’s opinions are being stifled by a liberal elite. Elites like Gavin Titley are always slandering people and call them bigots if they try to have a debate on issues such as immigration.

  4. human

    And who will call out the lie that mass immigration will bring nothing only love joy and harmony for all

    1. ReproBertie

      We’ll leave that to the doomsaying xenophobes like yourself.

      I’m far too busy dealing with the fallout out from the cultural disaster that was the mass immigration of Eastern Europeans.

        1. ReproBertie

          I’d like to see your evidence that muslims didn’t integrate and that Eastern Europeans did. While you’re at it please explain the schrodingerian integration status of Eastern European muslims.

          1. MoyestWithExcitement

            “I’d like to see your evidence that muslims didn’t integrate and that Eastern Europeans did.”

            Eastern Europeans are white and wear jeans, Muslims are brown and sometimes grow moustacheless beards and wear Middle Eastern clothing. Of course, human is definitely, absolutely, 100% *not* a racist.

          2. Sam

            I wonder if it depends on whether or not they’d pause for the angelus… or turn their nose up at bacon and cabbage, just like those Jewish people that official Ireland was openly hostile towards, until certain events made it unfashionable to be openly hostile.

      1. classter

        @ReproBertie, I am in favour of pretty open entry for economic migrants as well as refugees.

        We should, however, be honest that there are implications or potential implications to this.

        It likely does reduce worker bargaining power in certain segments of the economy. There is the risk of tensions between existing Irish and new Irish as well as between various immigrant/refugee groups. There are challenges in terms of adopting/policing religious & cultural mores which can conflict with ‘our’ own. It does decision-making on certain topics more difficult when a significant segment of society may not share certain linguistic or cultural backgrounds.

        I’m fine with all this & I think the benefits can outweigh the negatives, Labelling anybody who disagrees or who even wants to discuss it an ‘xenophobe’ is not a sensible or fair way forward.

  5. Darragh Byrne

    For shame RTE. To me it is like letting Hitler on the day after the camps were found to excuse the holocaust without any hassle. Is Jeremy Paxman soft interviewing BNP Leaders on BBC or Jon Snow letting Katie Hopkins spread her hate unquestioned on Channel 4? It is not holding the middleground. It is not balanced journalism. It is letting the spiteful fringe groups shout down the decent people of this country with lies. For shame.

    1. Jeb

      Irish people who have legitimate concerns about letting Syrian immigrants into the country are now the same as Hitler? You are completely deluded Darragh.

  6. ahyeah

    The problem is that Claire Byrne should not be in the job that she is in. Simple as. She didn’t challenge it as she did not know any better. Shouts out a few questions prepared by RTE lackeys but does not drive a debate.

  7. Diddy

    Oh poor Gavin and those racist bully boys, you poor little latte sipping D6 living dandy.

    CBL is chaotic to be sure but so was the frontline. Doherty is some right winger but is massive Muslim immigration gonna be a benefit in 30 years? No

    1. weeeelllllllll

      ok, that assumption is simply flat out racist, it’s based on nothing other that you fear / perception of those who are ‘different’ as being of no benefit

    2. Peadar

      It’ll be a benefit to the Muslims fleeing war. Which is what a compassionate person should actually care about.

  8. shitferbrains

    His teeth were knocked out by Syrian Air Force Intelligence – run by Assads pysco brother – not ISIS. He sold his shop to bribe his way out of their grasp.

  9. Truth in the News

    The level of non Irish residents is well over 600 thousand and all were not
    counted in the last census, there is a urgent need to re-establish the proceedure
    of requiring all aliens to register every 3 months with the local Garda station where
    they reside, the Guards need to be made to compile proper figures, never mind relying on the Census every 5 years, when in a small country with a population of under 5 Million and the level of resident aliens well over 12%, and a loss of our
    youth in the region of over 200 thousand in the last 7 years, a proper policy needs
    to be put in place to control entry and residency, we are regarded as a soft touch
    internationally and if we are not carefull we end up as the minority, just look at
    the change from 2000 to the last census, its not in 1% shifts…its 150%
    We aren’t able to look after our own,we didn’t see Micheal D Higgins giving
    shelter to all those who got evicted from their houses in the last couple of years
    Its easy for Angela Merkel to open the flood gates, when we like fools bale our
    her banks, if we didn’t there would not be much welcome in Germany, the wall
    would be back up, and will in time once they feel the’ll be overrun.

    1. ReproBertie

      “The level of non Irish residents is well over 600 thousand and all were not counted in the last census”
      How do you know? If the figures in the census are incorrect where do you get your figures? The “real” census?

      1. cian

        I don’t think that illegal immigrants would fill in their details into a government census. So the official census will not include illegals in their counts. It is reasonable to suggest that there are more non-nationals.
        The census is 4 years old, so are there more or less non-nationals here now? ‘Truth in the News’ suggests that there are at least 10% more here now than self-reported in the 2011 census. It’s not an unreasonable suggestion (it may be wrong, but it’s not unreasonable).

      2. Truth in the News

        Read the Census Report and ask the CSO how many forms were delivered
        and returned, a significant amount of aliens did nor return or fill in census
        forms, we need to establish the original 3 month alien registration rule.

  10. Paolo

    I’m all for accommodating more Syrian refugees. We are not doing enough by any stretch but that does not mean that Aylan’s father is not to blame for the deaths of his family. There was no immediate life threatening danger to his family and yet he put them on an overcrowded boat with no safety equipment. He is not above criticism here simply because he is grieving for his family.

    1. MoyestWithExcitement

      Possibly a million refugees moving around and you want to focus on one so you can criticise him.

      1. Paolo

        No, I am criticising him for dragging his children into a dangerous situation when he was relatively safe in Turkey. You can dance around it all you like but it is a fact. His children were not in immediate danger until he put them on that boat.

        As I stated further up the thread, wealthy countries should have done something about this much sooner.

        1. The “West” should not have started destabilising wars in the middle east.
        2. ISIS should not have been tacitly encouraged by the US and UK in 2011
        3. ISIS should have been targeted much sooner
        4. Turkey and Jordan should not have been left to take responsibility for all of these refugees. Europe should have agreed a protocol for taking them, especially Britain and France.

        All of these things taken together do not excuse Aylan’s father for making a decision to put them on a dirigible in the mediterranean without life jackets when they were safe in Turkey.

        1. MoyestWithExcitement

          Ok, buddy. Everyone else will discuss the problem of a million displaced human beings fleeing a war zone with nothing but the clothes on their back. You keep focusing on one random refugee so you can criticise him as if it makes a difference to anything. You’re definitely not embarrassing yourself.

          1. MoyestWithExcitement

            Uh huh. Like I said, you just want to focus on one refugee in a conversation about a million people. Not the brightest, are you, petal?

          2. Anomanomanom

            Of course people need help. Real refugees need, anyone in Europe (Budapest) is no longer in danger. Yet thousands of refused to follow what little guide lines there are when trying to document them. Nobody ever answers the question of why they all want countries with great welfare. I’m all for hand refugees everything they need, not economic migrants.

          3. MoyestWithExcitement

            Cause Eastern Europe doesn’t have a well known problem with racism, after all. Maybe they want to go the countries with the most jobs? Did you ever think about that? Or is it just ‘brown foreigner = 3rd world peasant = opportunistic scrounger’ in your head?

          4. Anomanomanom

            Well that’s very racist, people like always afraid to say what their really thinking, so instead you word it as if it’s a question directed at me. Iv no problem with anyone coming here to work. But you seem to think anyone should be allowed just demand to come here. There has to be proper checks. They can’t just decide where they want to go. Do you think genuine refugees demand where to go, their first thought is safety.

          5. MoyestWithExcitement

            It’s always hilarious to see racists like yourself complain about foreigners and then demonstrate that you can barely speak English yourself. I never even implied that “anyone should just demand to come here”. You made that up in your head. That’s a straw man, my illiterate friend. It’s what idiots do when they realise their argument is totally irrational.

          6. Anomanomanom

            Your obviously new here, so for probably my 100th time IN NO WAY AM I CHECKING MY GRAMMAR on a glorified message board. So where to begin, never throw racism out in a genuine disagreement it shows your ignorance and inability to debate, the old trick of accusing the use of the strawman tactic again look above. And my favourite characteristic in a broadsheet commentator, I’ll insult you and some how that makes me better than.

          7. rotide

            In fairness to Paolo, this is a conversation about a list of tweets being called racists, not on the overall refugee crisis. So yeah, cop on to yourself Moyest.

          8. MoyestWithExcitement

            It’s a list of tweets with comments about the refugee crisis. Like the crazy person above notes, I’m new here so I can’t tell you if you’re serious or not. The conversation is about a million people fleeing war. What difference does the *alleged* behaviour of one refugee out of a million make to conversation? None. People will bring it up though so they can cast aspersions on the entire refugee movement. ‘This one refugee neglected his children so we must be suspicious of all refugees’. Only an idiot and a racist (albeit a racist with a severe lack of self awareness) thinks like that.

          9. ABM's Bloodied Underwear

            Don’t cop on, just piss off back to the journal or politics.ie

            Comments board of BS is full of trolls. I miss the good old days when people asked about Clampers’ welfare after he hadn’t posted for a few days, and when BS didn’t edit your posts without permission.

          10. Janet, I ate my avatar

            Yep the tone is definitely a lot less friendly. A microcosm of the macrocosm that seems to be Ireland judging by the xenophobic clap trap all to common right now across the board ?

        2. rotide

          New or not, you might have noticed there’s been one or two articles about this issue here. It’s constantly being discussed. Taking issue with one of the tweets and/or one of the people involved doesn’t mean you can’t have an opinion on the wider issue.

          1. MoyestWithExcitement

            Ok? I don’t think I ever said having an opinion on one facet mean you *can’t* have an opinion on the broader picture.

          2. rotide

            OK then, so it’s perfectly fine for Paolo to have an opinion on the broader picture AND ALSO HAVE AN OPINION ON ONE OF THE TWEETS PUBLISHED.

          3. MoyestWithExcitement

            When the conversation is about racism directed at a million people and Paolo wants to focus on one migrant out of a million instead of talking about the bigger picture, racism is afoot. CAPITAL LETTERS!!!

  11. Junkface

    Syrian people have had enough of War and living through fear from the Assad regime, then ISIS. They have all decided to move to rich European countries because you don’t have to live in fear so much, and human rights are respected, and there are obviously much more opportunities to earn economically . That’s why most of the refugees are not moving to Turkey, Jordan, Egypt, Saudi Arabia etc… they don’t want to live in fear anymore.

    There’s not one Islamic country they can go to that isn’t run by a military regime or religious dictatorship. This is the main problem in this part of the world. Hardline Islamist’s are the norm now. In Egypt in the 60’s, 70’s and 80’s women didn’t have to cover up. Islam did not dictate their society so much, but now everywhere in the region has swung in the opposite direction. Islam cannot live side by side with a modern world, evidently, unless a less strict version and more tolerant form of Islam becomes the norm. These things happen in cycles, it might take another 15 or 20 years though. I think the rich countries of the region should donate financially to the refugee crisis, if they have any empathy for their brothers and sisters of Islam.

    1. Paolo

      Most of the refugees ARE moving to Turkey and Jordan. 1.5 million of them. Turkey and Jordan are being left to clean up the mess that some European nations are directly responsible for.

      1. Anomanomanom

        Very true. Certain European countries caused a lot of this by meddling in other countries affairs.

      2. Junkface

        For how long though? When they see lots of Syrians moving to Germany and Sweden for more prosperity, they will want to join them.

      3. rotide

        Directly? I think not.

        You can argue all you want for the influence of the west in the genesis of ISIS, but the direct blame lands square on religious murderers door.

        Syrians and Iraqi’s are DIRECTLY responsible for the wave of migrants. The west is indirectly the cause of these groups existing.

        1. Bobby

          Eh.. the west is simply indirectly involved yeah? Here’s a really good tip, because sometimes comments on social media don’t cut it, get yourself a copy of Robert Fisk’s the great war for civilisation, the conquest of the middle east.

          ‘You can argue all you want for the influence of the west in the genesis of ISIS..’
          Half of Ireland has gone stupid.

        2. rotide

          I’m not for a second excusing the west’s actions.

          I’m also not for a second excusing the actions of murderers and thugs.

          But you go ahead and give them a pass. I’m sure it’s what fisk would have wanted

  12. Frilly Keane

    Here lads

    I’m trying to stay off this topic
    Largely because I’d prefer to take a goalies hurl to it instead of a moto g and decent signal

    So if I’m asking this in the wrong place
    Tough shit

    Have any of the refugees expressed a desire to come here
    Like why da’ ûck would they want ta

    School in shite
    Housing crisis
    Health Care not even fit for the Z Nation population
    A public service that have a global corruption ranking all on their own
    Public Transport that only works in high density urban locations
    Jobs for the boys only

    Come on
    WTF like

    1. dereviled

      There appears to be two schools of thought on the subject:
      a) They are desperate.
      or
      b) They are scroungers.
      Anybody on the middle ground will be skinned alive and their avatar worn as a hat.

      1. Frilly Keane

        Ah now c’mon
        I don’t mean my gaff isn’t a better spot for them than Syria
        Jesus no

        But at least in Spain, say,
        Better healthcare
        Better transport
        Better housing optionsoptions
        Cheaper everything

        Or like the lad trying to get to CanadaCanada
        No surprise
        Sur they’ve got vast amount of opportunities there
        All crying out for repopulation

    2. classter

      I know it feels like things are poo sometimes, Frilly, but objectively & relatively you are completely wrong.

      If you stand back, just a little bit, we have an excellent education system, long life expectancy, competent public service, fairly low population density, relatively low inequality.

      Far better than Spain on almost any metric you care to mention.

      Clearly we need improvements in many areas and there’s no reason we shouldn’t be demanding them & working towards them. Your hyperbole doesn’t serve any cause at all.

      1. Frilly Keane

        HyperBolix
        More like

        You will never convince me that a Family being bused to a holiday home in Leitrim, will have the same equal access and opportunity to grow, stay healthy, integrate, and develop into a future generation, as a Family settling in say, Halifax.

        Never

        And much as I promote rural Ireland, and echo their calls for investment and support to avoid any further depopulation, I’m not that blind.

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