71 thoughts on “Saturday’s Papers

    1. Suppurated @ Birth

      This mask thing is becoming a joke. No, seriously. Can anybody think of a person, woman, man, camera or TV that would be improved by a mask? My mind is a complete blank.

      1. SOQ

        Well in the case of England- the shops are saying that for fear of litigation they can’t enforce it, and the police have said they won’t enforce it, so it either happens voluntarily- or it doesn’t at all.

        Here, O’Neil is saying the about turn around is based on new science except there is just a few small studies where even they call for more research before drawing conclusions.

        Any yet, what appears to be an anonymous cabal advising government have decided that they know best. Even WHO have admitted there has been political lobbying so the question is- by whom and why?

        1. Vanessanelle

          To create mass confusion
          Division and fear
          Also fatigue – principally at this stage
          To the point that people in their millions will just agree to anything that puts an end to all the bulls motions they’ve been telling us since January

          1. SOQ

            Loaded terminology granted but if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck etc- hiding behind FOI is just not good enough.

            They stuck symptomatic people into nursing homes and then refused to test them despite having the full knowledge that CoVid-19 was most dangerous to elderly people- who made that decision? Who decided to keep the airports wide open with no checks while the public were under near house arrest?

            Labeling such as conspiracy theories is just a disingenuous way of dismissing what are very valid questions.

          2. sidhe

            that’s a fair point, I’ll grant you, and there needs to be some accountability for the decisions made – especially regarding nursing homes. many lives lost needlessly there.

            but I think the hiding behind FOI is the usual political self interest coming out and nothing more. it wouldn’t surprise me in the least to see those names released, or rather leaked, at a later date when it’s politically advantageous to someone or other.

          3. SOQ

            Sure- forcing people to wear masks, which will cause distress to some, with no scientific basis, is all done in good faith is it?

        2. class wario

          can you point out where shops have said they won’t be doing it for fear of litigation? shops have previously been sued for accusing people of shoplifting in heavy handed ways but most over here would still take action on site if you were suspected of doing so. Similarly, a cursory google search suggests the UK police rep body has said they don’t have the numbers to enforce this universally. There is no suggestion that this isn’t being done because they don’t think it’s properly enforceable. Shops don’t want the hassle of it, especially when it’ll be the low wage floor workers who’ll get landed with it. I think you posted a ‘legal opinion’ the other day of some counsel who had their own view on it and have seemingly run with the idea that the law is totally unenforceable and started recontextualising everything in light of it

          1. class wario

            a lot of fairly spurious reasoning in there and the guy in question even admits there is plenty of space for disagreement. do you have anything to back up the assertion that shops aren’t enforcing it because of potential litigation other than a twitter thread by a man with sub-10k followers? seems like a disproportionate influence.

            i would also point to the continued disingenuous use of/reference to headlines about the police not enforcing it, which is elaborated upon in each case by reference to a lack of resources

          2. class wario

            in any case, i feel like this is only a thing because masks have become this massive political/conspiracy point and the chances of it being light-touch enforced as a result of high public buy-in is basically dead in the UK because of the former. i’d say there’s more than a few who are more than a bit peeved that they won’t get to loudly declare their ‘mental anguish’ because they’ve been asked to put on a mask

          3. SOQ

            Sainsburys tweet was-

            “We won’t be challenging customers without a mask when they enter or when they are in store since they may have a reason not to wear a mask. Karen”

            Karen was a nice touch.

            The police have no more business enforcing this law than the smoking ban. The only way it can be enforced it is to send out health officials to supermarkets but even they are legally on thin ice.

            It is a very clever virus you see- it knows the difference between pubs and shops.

        3. f_lawless

          I think it’s worth considering all this in the context of the ongoing geopolitical struggle between West and East. Western globalist elites are envious of the extreme level of technological surveillance the likes of China is able to utilise to monitor and control their population and believe they must introduce the same in order to remold western societies and keep pace. They see the pandemic as the perfect vehicle to do so.

          Not too long ago Tony Blair was interviewed on BBC advocating for “digital health passports” as means to combat the virus, saying that he saw their introduction as inevitable sooner or later. In May, the ‘Tony Blair Institute for Global Change’ announced that ‘Our teams are now working with governments around the world, helping them to keep their people safe during this pandemic’.( Is it possible they’re advising the Irish government too?)

          This is what may be coming in the not too distant future – you won’t be able to participate in society unless you opt in to this new heightened surveillance apparatus – all in the name of staying safe and protecting your health, of course. But underneath, what’s happening is another damaging attack on western liberal democracy as we know it.

          If it is the case, then I can’t see our feckless government do anything else but get swept along with the tide

          An interesting read (particularly section ‘4. Surveillance and Compliance’ ) – https://architectsforsocialhousing.co.uk/2020/06/11/the-science-and-law-of-refusing-to-wear-masks-texts-and-arguments-in-support-of-civil-disobedience/

    2. Charger Salmons

      So to confirm – there are just 10 people in hospital with C-19 across the entire Republic tonight with only 5 of those in ICU.
      And this is before widespread mask-wearing is enforced.
      Yet 313,000 people remain unemployed on PUP, a majority of the country’s pubs are shut until August 10th, the tourist and hospitality industry is dead in the water, quarantining of returning citizens and tourists is required and all but essential travel abroad is the official advice.
      Remember just 5 people in ICU.
      Who will all probably recover.
      And all of this is costing this country billions of Euros.
      It is total insanity being enforced by a pathetically-inept government.

  1. GiggidyGoo

    So, the Duper Junior Ministers get a new additional €16,000 top up. That’s Jack Chambers for instance. And Hildegard Naughton, and Pippa Hackett. https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/16000-pay-rise-for-super-junior-ministers-gets-dail-approval-1012238.html

    It’s “fairness” according to Daffy. “Finance Minister Paschal Donohoe said the increase should go ahead in the interest of fairness as junior ministers in the previous Government were on different pay scales.”

    Let’s see. €203 is the normal unemployment benefit. = 10,500 approx per annum.

    1. Vanessanelle

      And yet in the interest of fairness
      Didn’t occur to him when rewriting and signing off on entry new contracts for Teachers and Nurses
      Clerical Officers
      Hospital Consultants
      Help yerselves here lads

  2. Birdie

    The behaviour of the accused in the P.C. Harper case is shocking; laughing at the details of his death as his widow cried, falling asleep in court and smirking. Also apparently their associates planned to intimidate the jury.

  3. Suppurated @ Birth

    This mask thing is becoming a joke. No, seriously. Can anybody think of a person, woman, man, camera or TV that would be improved by a mask? (Apart from BOTV)

    My Fascist brown is turning grey, but I still get my comments published here.

  4. Charger Salmons

    I still find it remarkable that at the end of a week which started with the Taoiseach signing up to a deal which commits Ireland to becoming the 5th largest contributor to the EU budget no-one in the Irish media appears to know or care how much the multi-billion euro price tag will cost every individual in this country.
    Yet thousands demonstrated for months in protest at water rates which might have cost households one euro a day.
    Truly the EU has Ireland in the palm of its hand and can squeeze it as hard as it wishes whenever it likes without any fear of protest.
    And the media will obediently report it as a great victory for Irish diplomacy.
    Michael Collins must be spinning like a top in his grave.

    1. Charger Salmons

      You don’t believe me ?
      Check out the Twitter feeds of RTE’s Europe editor Tony Connelly or the Irish Times resident EU-boor Fintan O’Toole.
      Not a single word.
      The outcome of an EU summit dealing with the biggest economic crisis the organisation has ever faced and which lands Ireland on the hook for €16billion and the state broadcaster’s Europe editor doesn’t think it worthy of a mention ?
      His Twitter coverage of the summit ended the moment the reality of the outcome for Ireland became apparent.
      They’re laughing at you.

        1. Andrew

          Why is he a sad fool? He has a point. It is remarkable that there has been no comment or discussion of this in the Irish media. Don’t you think that’s a bit odd? Never mind if you are happy or not with the agreement, surely it merits some discussion?
          If you don’t think so, then it’s you who are the fool Charlie

          1. GiggidyGoo

            Yep. We ‘get’ €5bn from the fund, but have to put €16bn in. That’s Noonan-esque economics. And another €11bn gets added to our debt. At the stroke of a FFGer.

          2. Charlie

            I’m talking about his constant bashing of everything Irish, everything remotely Irish, yet pontificating about how great his life is in Engerland. He’s a total fool if the loneliest kind.

          3. Charlie

            You obviously havn’t read the bile he spouts here every day. If you have, then you’re clearly off the scale stupid.

      1. Formerly known as @ireland.com

        Troll Charage, Yuo might want to keep an eye on that Bozo bloke. He hasn’t quite grasped this virus thing. You could give him some advice.

      2. scottser

        So charger you’ve been making this point daily for the past two weeks. What have you done about it except come on here to piss and moan about how much better it is in the UK? Seriously, what are you doing about this monstrous conspiracy to bankrupt the nation and enslave its citizens?
        ‘You’re all mahf an no bleedin trahsers’ as the tans are wont to opine.

      1. Charger Salmons

        Mehole’s job as leader of a small country was to rubber stamp whatever France and Germany wanted.
        The UK used to be a valuable bulwark against the Franco-German aggrandisement but that’s gone now.
        The Dutch put up some resistance and managed to wrestle some compromises.
        But ultimately the French and Germans are running the show in Europe now.
        I just find it bizarre that the Irish media are going along with the pretence.
        Obviously they know which side of their bread is buttered …

          1. Charger Salmons

            I’ve been pointing it out on here for a year or two.
            Their coverage of Brexit was shockingly inept and one-sided.
            But over the years from Haughey through Bertie, the banking crisis and the bailout and now to Covid-19 the public have been grievously let down by the media.
            What’s worrying is that whatever you thought about Varadkar as Taoiseach at least you had the feeling he knew what he was talking about.
            Martin already looks dreadfully out of his depth.

      1. Formerly known as @ireland.com

        He is not the one I would be going with. They wear them in Taiwan. I would follow their example.

        1. SOQ

          There is a theory that people who were exposed to SARS-CoV-1 have a certain immunity to SARS-CoV-2 which would be the case in Asian countries like Taiwan. Dr. John Campbell explains it quite well in the first few minutes of this video.


          Who knows- it is probably a mixture of all sorts of factors as those countries have been through the mill before.

          But, a complete u turn on masks without any additional evidence would suggest some sort of pressure is being applied.

    1. Johnny Green

      he’s just a front man,a paid promoter,like trump was also after going broke,he will be flogging snake oil next.

      1. Johnny Green

        Only NAMA would get into bed with this dodgy yank hedge fund that just defaulted on over 3 Billion in debts-do they even have Google or bother with any due diligence.
        With any other state agency this level of default would preclude you from bidding-only NAMA would do this.
        This buyer’s stock is off 60% y-to-d, its chairman is subject of numerous investigations,quite possiblty facing criminal charges.

        NAMA should have been shut down years ago,its the greatest heist by FG ever, flogging Irish state assets to yank carpetbaggers for buttons in a panic.

        “The magnate’s Colony Capital has defaulted on $3.2 billion in loans backed by hotel and health care properties, according to a regulatory filing first reported by the Financial Times.”



        1. Tom Wong

          Is that not just how business is done over there Johnny? What are you doing living in such a corrupt poohole country anyway?

          1. Johnny Green

            oh im just traveling about for a few years,picking up some skills to pay the bills.
            had few years in Canada,just finishing up in NY,probably northern Cali or Berkshires for 2-3 years in Sept-after labor day.
            states treats carried interest or ‘points’ as CGT-capital gain-much lower tax rate then ordinary income-all my ‘income’ is participation or back end points.
            uk needs raise taxes is looking at changing how it treats carried interest,will impact the city-a lot yank hedge funds/pe shops will leave.

    2. Johnny Green

      Hang in here with me,in fairness its a sunny saturday and i have smoked,but here goes,tin foil hat time!

      Mick is just a small time two bit real estate hustler from dry heave South Carolina,who hitched his floundering political fortunes (and personal- he’s poor) to that car crash Trump/MAGNA ,which is now imploding.

      He’s looking at significant legal bills in the very near future,from his Chief Staff (acting) Days.

      Politically he’s finished,financially he’s very shaky,possibly insolvent with these liabilities,needs build up a war chest and fast,there is not much time,left ,needs cash in his few chips.

      “I was interested in not seeing the loan go into default,” Mulvaney said during a deposition taken in 2018.

      “Why was that?” Fonville’s attorney asked.

      “Political reasons,” Mulvaney said.

      “Doesn’t look good for somebody in politics to have a defaulted loan on his record?” the attorney asked.

      “Correct,” Mulvaney said.”


      Enter stage left Tom Barrack,who arranged Trumps inauguration and those parties,Mick is now special enjoy for Trump to NI-Tom is one Trumps BFF’s who has helped some x Trump people, have a soft landings,with essentially no show jobs.

      This site in Dublin owned by you guys the state, that NAMA is giving away in the midst of a world wide pandemic-who’s driving this crazy timeline-is one the most valuable urban sites in EU-with the ability to generate very large and lovely fees for lot and lots of x politicos /lobbyists/lawyers…..

      The Irish guy is simply a useful idiot-keep a close eye on Mick and Tom and NAMA !


  5. Johnny Green

    “Last August, two Muslim girls were attacked by a group of teenagers in Dublin, who kicked and stamped on them, ripped off one victim’s hijab and yelled racial and religious slurs.Local police said they didn’t believe the attack was a hate crime.”

    “Dami Babade, 22, said he and a female Chinese-born friend who is now an Irish national, were attacked by a group of men and women in Dublin. Passersby didn’t come to their aid, and a man in his car sounded the horn and shouted, “Get that black bastard,” said Mr. Babade, who runs a media startup.”

    …Irish statistics on hate crime reveal relatively few cases because the country is one of the few in the Western world without specific laws to prosecute attacks motivated by racial or religious hatred.


      1. Johnny Green

        always chilled-dont shoot the messenger:)

        “In the one hate crime on the statute books, prosecutors must prove someone publicly incited others to violence based on hatred. That sets a very high bar for prosecution, said Ivana Bacik, a professor of criminal law at Trinity College Dublin and a member of Ireland’s Senate.

        In the past 20 years, there have been 52 prosecutions using the act, with only three resulting in jail and one a fine. In England and Wales, there were 12,828 prosecutions under race-hate legislation in 2019 alone, over 75% of which resulted in conviction.”

    1. Vanessanelle

      I’ve come to realise lately that every argument, or falling out,
      Or difference of opinion, is about Shame and Shaming the other side

      Even our Politics

      Probably one for the late Frilly in fairness

  6. italia'90

    Such a pity that the “quarantine cordon sanitaire challenge”
    was ignored
    And the “ice bucket challenge” wasn’t.
    Still not too late to quarantine those who are sick. Properly.
    Wearing the mask might lead to gobshites acting with impunity.
    Like they usually do.
    Stay home if you are sick or have any symptoms.
    Go out if you are healthy but act cautiously and responsibly.
    Treat everyone you meet with respect.

  7. Rosette of Sirius

    Tell the truth and shame the devil… the only thing you’re really bothered with is that your boozer’s still closed….

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