States Of Tension [Updated]


State of play in remaining swing states in the US Presidential Election as of 10.25pm


US Democrat Presidential candidate Joe Biden maintains his lead over US President Donald Trump as counting and, amid claims of massive voter fraud, lawsuits continue.

More as we get it.

Trump wins greater access to Philly mail ballot center; counting continues as Biden gains (PBS)

US election 2020: Biden holds lead over Trump in tense wait for results – live updates (Guardian)

Earlier: Dan Boyle: Donald Ducked

Yesterday: It’s A Mudslide

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116 thoughts on “States Of Tension [Updated]

  1. Johnny

    Trump-214 electoral votes-to reach 270,needs win all four remaining battlegrounds: Pennsylvania, North Carolina, Georgia and Nevada.
    Biden-264-one battleground state away — any will do — from becoming president.

    1. Barry the Hatchet

      It does still seem possible that Trump may prevail in Arizona. That would complicate the maths, although Biden’s route would still be a lot easier than Trump’s.

      1. Johnny

        Joe should take Nevada,probably Pa possibly Ga.
        Should be called by noon today,congrats President Biden.
        The last two one term presidents,Bush and Carter tried stay relevant,Americans quickly forget losers in politics and why.
        These are his last moments on the national stage,up him,how he is remembered,no one is supporting his latest nonsense.
        He’s goes quietly.

          1. Rosette of Sirius

            You’ve been at that nonsense for the past four or five years, yet here we all are waiting with bated breath for the ‘big reveal’.

          2. Nigel

            I get the sense that Qanon has become too ridiculous even for Bodger (and Pat Mustard?) But I could be wrong – that’s the advantage of being ambiguously ironic.

  2. Nigel

    Project Veritas? Really? This counts as cruel mockery of Republicans’ easily exploited conspiracy mind-set, you know.

    1. ian-oh

      They have spent the last few years on so many ‘imminent arrests’ and ‘evidence of criminality from the previous administration’ that now, after calling wolf so often, they could be right and nobody would really believe them.

      If Twitter accounts supporting Trump were to be believed, Bill Barr was literally just days away from indicting Obama, Clinton and James Comey to name a few.

      I’d be fairly sure there has been small scale fraud on both sides, but enough to overturn an election? Doubtful. I also think that Dems should hold onto their seats because despite the numbers, anything can happen. It’s likely Biden will take it but its not a given. I’ve seen too many elections be snatched away at the last moment to be sure of anything.

      1. Nigel

        The degree to which Trump’s support and increased turnout is conspiracy-driven should not be discounted, and needs to be analysed, but as everyone lines up to telll Biden what he did wrong and castigate him for being divisive, I suspect it’ll be mostly left unexamined by the mainstream. I’m not just talking about Qanon, though that’s at its core, but look at the response to Trump’s declarations of fraud and subsequent demonstrations to stop counting here, keep counting there – they respond to whatever signals he puts out instantly, with no regard for evidence or consistency. Biden’s success in (hopefully) overcoming that enormous bubble of malleable reality is actually a formidable acheivement.

        1. Daisy Chainsaw

          The whole Qanon scam was invented by a man called Jim Watkins who lives in the Philippines.

          1. ian-oh

            While you should never judge someone on their appearances, he does look like he enjoys Civil war re-enactments.

            On the confederate side, of course.

          2. SOQ

            @ Ian

            3 facts

            1. Post voting is renown for fraud because it is easy to do.
            2. Post voting is widespread this time because of CoVid-19.
            3. Post voting traditionally favours Democrat candidates.

            Now given all above- if it turns out that audits reveal widespread fraud- what then?

          3. Nigel

            1. No it’s not.
            2. Only among Biden voters, because Trump decided to ignore covid while campaigning, lied about post-voting being prone to fraud, and deliberately sabotaged the postal service.
            3. Because Trump ignored covid while campaigning and his followers were okay with that.

            The major fraud is the lies about voter fraud used to supress, block and disenfranchise Biden voters. No need to speculate about it, either, as you do about something for which there is no evidence, it happened right out there in the open for everyne to see.

          4. realPolithicks

            @soq, talking through your rear end as usual, is there a conspiracy theory you haven’t glommed onto yet.

          5. SOQ

            Common sense should tell you that where someone does not have to appear in person- faking their identity is much easier.

            Lets wait and see eh? There is at least three states where legal action is occurring- time will tell.

          6. Daisy Chainsaw

            So you have no facts or even dubious links to back up your statement?

            Let’s wait and see if your “common sense” is right and actual provable facts and figures aren’t. The states have robust, tested laws when it comes to votes cast and counted.

          7. Nigel

            No, Trump tells you this, and you are credulously repeating it. Actual experience has shown that it does not. These legal actions are attempts to disenfranchise voters.

          8. SOQ

            Mail in balloting in the US has happened on this scale before. This is not absentee ballots- it is mail in voting which is different.

            Votes mailed out to everyone on a voter list when is well known those list are inaccurate.

            People who should get them don’t get them and people who do get them may not be the right people- maybe something like replacing the previous occupants.

            There is no way that is anywhere near as secure as someone turning up at a station with ID. As for evidence- until this election, such an experiment has never been tried before so there will be none one way or another.

          9. Cian

            In all the times I’ve voted in Ireland I’ve *never* been asked for ID.

            If the US is similar they are as open to poll-voting fraud as we are.

            Oh, and the requirement in the US for government issued photo ID is a way to suppress certain types of voter.

            “The folks who are disproportionately impacted by these ID laws are those who do not have a current driver’s license in their states,” Unger told Insider. “And who are they? They are communities of color…they are students and other young people, they are older adults who are no longer driving if they ever did. They are voters with disabilities. They’re low-income individuals and they’re women, because some states require an exact match between the name on your ID and the name by which you’re registered to vote.”

          10. realPolithicks

            There is no difference between mail in and absentee voting, also the amount of voter fraud in the US is negligible.

          11. Nigel

            You are speculating heavily with no evidence, a ton of assumptions, and, I think, no clear understanding of how the process of mail-in voting works.

          12. SOQ

            Yes there is- you need an excuse for absentee voting, but typically only under certain circumstances. You must apply for an absentee ballot which is then accessed on merit.

            That process confirms the contact details of the applicant.

            With mail in some states have just threw out application forms to everyone- wide open for fraud.

          13. Nigel

            For one thing the rules are different in different states.
            For another, mail-in voting has been used in the US since the Civil War.

          14. SOQ

            We can argue about this until the cows come home but if those audits in 2-3 states throw up major irregularities then that is when the poo hits the fan.

            Time will tell.

          15. Nigel

            In states that require voter id, driver license offices were closed down in minority areas in the run-up to this election, along with all the voting stations in minority areas that were closed. Imagine what the vote might have been without these efforts? Voter supression is real, opressive and targeted at minorities. Your mail-vote fraud only exists as Trump disinformation.

            Yeah, SOQ – if, if, if, if, if

          16. Junkface


            You use common sense for mail in voting issues related to massive fraud (completely unproven), yet wearing a mask to prevent coughing germs into the air is beyond your common sense parameters??

        2. ian-oh

          @SOQ – Sorry, I don’t engage with people who randomly call me a homophobe for no other reason than you got annoyed during a discussion. Feel free to reply to me, don’t expect me to come back to you again. Unless you’d like to withdraw the comment, but I expect you won’t.



          1. ian-oh

            OK, now we know your post will relate to your triggering by use of the word ‘syndrome’ can you explain why it triggers you Pat or did you, as I suspect, just exhale hydrogen, carbon dioxide, and methane combined with hydrogen sulphide out the wrong opening?

            Answers on a recyclable piece of corrugated card that says ‘irrelevance personified’ please!



          2. ian-oh

            You clearly have something to say and chose this forum to hash it out.

            So go on, take a seat, get comfy and lets talk about why you feel the need to project your triggering by the word syndrome onto others?

            I must admit, its not something I have heard of before, so please, tell me the first time you experienced this triggering by use of that word (sorry, I should probably stop using it until we can get you calmed down) and we can take it from there.

            How did hearing it make you feel? Sad? Lonely?

            What would you like to say to the word? Don’t hold back, it will be cathartic.

          3. ian-oh

            Ah poor Pat, not up for it anymore?

            Is it the one key at a time typing that hobbles ye?


            Explains the one line sharting I suppose.

          4. ian-oh

            Chuckle, thanks for the confirmation.

            I suggest Mavis Beacon, she’ll sort you right out. One way or the other.

          5. Pat Mustard

            Chuckles indeed, thanks for confirming your self righteous hypocrisy.

            I suggest Dr Phil, he’ll sort you right out. One way or the other.

          1. Daisy Chainsaw

            Trump has never been gracious in victory, so he’s going to be a complete pishy little bitch in defeat.

  3. Rosette of Sirius

    I’ve said it before, Trump will raze his country to the ground to save his bacon. He’s ruined otherwise. So here he goes. Can’t help feeling tense about the fallout for the rest of us….

    1. newsjustin

      I think (hope) it’ll be a bit of a damp squib. He will shout and roar for a week or two, but gradually all doors will begin to close for him as the individual States correctly verify and approve their results. All his enablers and side-kicks will melt away and stop returning his calls.

      He may become a bizarre relic faster than you think.

      1. scottser

        spot on newsjustin. i think the more everyone buys in to this narrative of riots and civil unrest if trump loses, the more it just eggs trump on. if everyone just chilled out, he would become yesterday’s man without too much fuss. he shares much with pennywise the clown in that regard.

    2. Johnny

      The executive branch,after today when the election is called for Biden,no longer reports to Trump he’s a lame duck,with 100,000 cases yesterday.

      In time,not that long,he will be investigated and charged,the full extent of his graft and malfeasance will emerge,making him a pariah,the R’s used this useful idiot who has now ruined his and his family’s life.

      But now is not the time for that,Mitch has two years until he loses complete control the senate,that’s if he even holds it.

      Congratulations to the president in waiting,the first female and African American,Vice President.

        1. Johnny

          AJC-atlanta journal-est now 51,000 untallied absentee ballots in Georgia, most “concentrated in highly populated areas, led by Fulton County in Atlanta and Chatham County in Savannah”-in other words Biden votes.
          Biden needs 18,500 to catch up,Ga should be called today around noon, with Biden announced shorty after as the winner and president.

          1. johnny

            right now:
            there are 61,367 absentee ballots yet to be counted in GA (as of 915 am). Trump leads by about 18,500 votes.

            Bryan 3,000
            Burke 494
            Chatham 17,000
            Cobb 700
            Floyd 682
            Forsyth 4,713
            Fulton 11,200
            Harris county 3,641
            Laurens 1797
            Putnam 1552
            Sumter 1202
            Taylor 456
            Gwinnett — maybe as many as 7338

            Chatham Co. is home to Savannah-solid D.
            Fulton covers much of ATL-solid D.
            Gwinnett used to be R-but,but Hillary won it in 2016.

            on track for noon.

      1. Rosette of Sirius

        Was talking about that last week with a buddy – the Nixon/Ford pardon. I think that’s quite likely and will make for great pantomime….. Will also get him out of handing the keys over to Biden when he pitched up to the White House on inauguration day. His ego would implode if he had to do that.

        1. Cian

          “After Ford left the White House in 1977, he privately justified his pardon of Nixon by carrying in his wallet a portion of the text of Burdick v. United States, a 1915 U.S. Supreme Court decision that suggests that a pardon carries an imputation of guilt and that acceptance carries a confession of guilt.”

          1. johnny

            your confusing immunity,with somewhat limited presidential pardon powers,he can’t grant himself immunity,certainly not for ‘crimes’ not even charged,no one is above the law.
            but some dishes are best served cold,he will go through some things.
            most people in states are facing a bleak winter,unemployment claims back up,50% bars/clubs/pubs in NY will close for good,no broadway,no football,no holidays.
            people are sick, tired and broke,but he will pay he just will.

    3. Len

      He will not

      If voter fraud is going on then ?

      He will concede but a fuse has been lit

      And like impeachment and stirring the pot as another tactic to remove him it’s a dangerous tactic
      When the people wake up realizing more of the same that led to trump it’s going to be anarchy

      Big problems ahead and with a gun culture a unreformed Democrat party and the rascism that has existed for decades god love them karma is a bitch

      1. SOQ

        Postal voter fraud always goes on but the difference is this time- the potential for it was so much greater.

        If the claim that 7WI wards in Wisconsin have reported more votes the registered voters for example- then that must be investigated.

        I kind of wonder why they could not have had a secret water mark on them- then a machine could easily sort between the real and fakes.

        1. Nigel

          No it doean’t.
          Claims aren’t evidence, and claims should be treated with skepticism absent evidence.
          Because mail-in voter fraud is statistically insignificant.

          1. bisted

            …how did you manage to jump on that bandwagon…you, better than most must know that where voter fraud exists, it cancels itself out…sure there was always a full turnout from the City Cemetery in your native Belfast…

        2. v AKA Frilly Keane

          Actually Same’Oh

          I did a bitta’ve piece about Postal Ballots in the States on
          just after the Primaries actually

          And introduced Paul Pate, Secretary of State of Iowa, and a Republican
          Who took it upon himself to post a ballot out to every registered Voter in Iowa and the response was so overwhelming and accurate
          The State Republicans wanted him sacked – didn’t happen but they were attempting some changes to Postal Ballot rules

          I also provided statistics on Postal Votes and Fraud
          from two different sources
          One from each side – kinda think

          Upshot it the incidences of fraud was so minimal it was laughable that it could be suggested by Trump, and his side’s set of data recorded even less incidents

          anyway, here, from around 1.06

          Seriously, its a good story. About 10 minutes
          Marco is on it so it won’t be to painful for you.

    4. Nigel

      He does have quite an array of legal and financial difficulties piled up waiting to keep him occupied, along with no doubt quite a few congressional hearings on a variety of subjects to do with assorted improprieties while in office.

  4. Charger Salmons

    I do afford myself a wry smile when I see politicians on this side of the pond decrying Trump for wanting to use the Supreme Court to overturn the election result.
    Especially when those same politicians are the ones who applauded Gina Miller et al in their attempts to use the Supreme Court to overturn a legitimate referendum result.

    1. Nigel

      She didn’t stack the court with partisans and openly declare her intention to get them to decide the outcome before the voting had even started, though, and declare victory, and then fraud, and then stop the counting, and then keep counting. Other than that, and, presumably some minor but important differences between legal ssytems, no difference between the two whatsoever.

      1. Charger Salmons

        She didn’t need to stack the court.
        It was already overwhelmingly full of Remainers like most of the Civil Service and Media who aided and abetted her attempts to undermine democracy.
        It made the eventual outcome all the more sweet as a nut.

        Heh x 17.4 million

        1. Nigel

          So what you’re saying is they treated it fairly and legally despite being attacked and demonised. More than we expect from the people you approve of.

          1. Charger Salmons

            If you think that’s what I’m saying you’re deluded.
            But I’m sure you’re very familiar with that accusation on here by now …

  5. V aka Frilly Keane

    All this aside lads
    One way or another

    Donald Trump is still President until the next inauguration

    I’d be more inclined to focus on what he gets up to between now and then

    American Election Officials
    And party observers n’the like
    Would do well to come over here
    And learn from our own Returning Officers
    How we run our own Count Centres
    And from the 0000s of Tallies up and down the Country

    Does elections better than we do
    Hon’ Ireland

    1. Redundant Proofreaders Society

      The one aspect of Irish count centres they may reject instantly is the candidate-on-the-shoulders thing. Especially considering age and weight.

      1. v AKA Frilly Keane

        Well I can tell you for sure
        One Returning Officer rings the Campaign Directors/ Agents of each of the Candidates in the two Constituencies she declares
        and warns them that there is to be no yahooing and heckling when she’s at the mic
        or giving instructions
        and there’s to be no hoisting up onto shoulders and the like after the respective declarations

        Same for the manners to be demonstrated around the spoilt and uncertain votes table

        No messing, probably makes everyone wipe their feet before entering the hall too

  6. Eoin

    So Biden, according to the current vote count, has had more votes than any other candidate in US election history. He’s beat Obamas record by hundreds of thousands. Also some states have had turn outs of 89%. Highest turnout ever? Anyone else smell a rat? The US establishment appears to be going to great lengths to keep Trump out of his second term.

    1. realPolithicks

      Its not that complicated my conspiracy theory wielding friend, currently Biden has approx 73 million votes and trump has approx 69 million so what is actually happening is that the majority of voters do not want trump (the very same as happened in 2016 btw) the difference this time around is that Biden is winning enough electoral college votes to be ahead of trump at the moment.

  7. seanydelight

    Is Trump’s alleged rape of a journalist outside statute of limitations? Why only a suit for defamation?
    No criminal probe, or is it under investigation?

          1. Charlie

            Show me where he is guilty of the “rape” you claim. Prove you’re not the moany/spoofer/chancer I believe you to be. Thanks in advance.

          2. Charlie

            I’m still waiting. Tap, tap tap…Keep digging that hole echoman. Prove he raped. Thanks in advance.

          3. Charlie

            Tap, tap, tap. I’m still waiting. Remove that large chip from your shoulder and you’ll find it easier. Thanks in advance.

  8. GiggidyGoo

    Feck sake. Nick will be fuming that this is getting more posts that winning his €25 voucher.
    Might I suggest the next voucher competition is the most cringeworthy election song. (I’m thinking Alan Kelly’s myself)

    1. johnny

      -looking very,very good in Nevada(biden up over 11,000 now) and Ga.
      -no one sees any path for trump now.

      1. johnny

        Nevada is going get called any moment giving Biden the presidency-hope like Az. Fox calls it-Et tu Brute:)
        note-two senate runoffs in Ga,in Jan to determine control.
        blue wave indeed.

  9. johnny

    for me The Boss said it best,this is why i voted biden,congrats Joe-im going skin up a nice big fat spliff and go mountain biking for few hours,its almost 70 and sunny in mountains,when i return i expect President Biden.

    “There’s no art in this White House. There’s no literature, no poetry, no music. There are no pets in this White House. No loyal man’s best friend, no Socks the family cat, no kids’ science fairs. No time when the president takes off his blue suit, red tie uniform and becomes human. Except when he puts on his white shirt and khaki pants uniform, and hides from the American people to play golf. There are no images of the first family enjoying themselves together in a moment of relaxation. No Obamas on the beach in Hawaii moments or Bushes fishing in Kennebunkport. No Reagans on horseback. No Kennedys playing touch football on the Cape. Where’d that country go? Where did all the fun, the joy, and the expression of love and happiness go? We used to be the country that did the ice bucket challenge and raised millions for charity. We used to have a president who calmed and soothed the nation instead of dividing it. And a first lady who planted a garden instead of ripping one out. We are rudderless and joyless. We have lost the cultural aspects of society that make America great. We have lost our mojo, our fun, our happiness, our cheering on of others, the shared experience of humanity that makes it all worth it. The challenges and the triumphs that we shared and celebrated, the unique can-do spirit that America has always been known for. We are lost. We’ve lost so much in so short a time. On November 3rd, vote them out.”

  10. Nigel

    Trump’s lawsuits aren’t going well:
    ‘the only problems with trump’s suit, according to the judge, is that it was based on hearsay, brought the wrong party to court, couldn’t give names of any of the ppl or locations they said broke the law and the relief sought is unavailable because the counting is over.’

  11. Lilly

    Looking at the pair of them last night, Trumpelstiltskin and Biden… in a country so vast wouldn’t you think they’d manage to pull a JFK 2.0 out of the hat.

  12. Nigel

    Steve Bannon has called for beheadings, Donald Trump jnr has called for Total War,. Doanld Trump has declared victory. Goodnight.

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