Last night.

Meanwhile…

Um.

Anyone?

Exclusive: Irish FOI Data-Release Proves Hospitals Were Never Under Strain in 2020 (Freepress.ie)

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65 thoughts on “Acute Angle

    1. Jim

      this is totally unfair to call it clickbait. The numbers are compared to the three previous years, it is at least some investigation that our media wont do. If you can prove that capacity increased massively then you have something to say but until you do, it looks like hospitals were never under pressure as represented by politicians and media

      1. Aegis

        Its outlined in the Winter Plan. You just have to go read it. Please inform yourself.

        So yes, this is clickbait….no context, knowledge or background behind it. Its dishonest.

        1. Jim

          sorry thats nonsense. The winter plan? Why dont you give us proof how much beds have increased.

          And that still wouldnt address the fact that hospitals have been closed to people who need illness screening for a year, when this shows hospitals had capacity.

          It ignores the fact that the media and politicans said hospitals were at breaking point, and our lives have been on hold to ‘protect the health srvice’

          You have an ireland flag as your gravatar, do you not care about the Irish? The elderly people who had had a year of their lives robbed, isolated in care homes, or from their families and grandkids? Do you not care that the media nd politicians have been misrepresenting things? Do you not care about those Irish people that the article shows were sent home from a LITERALLY half empty Jameses hospital to die in nursing homes that had had all their staff removed because of hysteria?

          You clearly dont care, and care more about politics, or hanging onto your world view…or something i cant understand….

          1. Aegis

            You sound exactly like one of those nutters on politicalirish.com

            Every single talking point.

            The bloody data is out there. They published all the work they did to get ready, have more ICU beds, less trolleys, etc. I can’t help it if you are too lazy or too blinded to go find out.

          2. Jim

            wow. all i can assume is you disagree with their political views instead of looking at the issue itself. That you stand over disease screening being cancelled when theri own stats from the FOI for Covid-only deaths are 369 leaves me no room to discuss this with you. If you’re genuine i feel sorry for you, if you’re deliberately misleading people, shame on you

          3. K.Cavan

            It’s the world-view Jim. It’s understandable that people don’t want to face up to such an appalling vista, our politicians & the legacy media, at the behest of supra-national organisations who we’re supposed to regard as working to help all humanity, have been pursuing a policy that is clearly designed to turn a drama into a crisis & a crisis into a disaster, so they bury their heads in the sand & try to claim that an annual Winter Plan had an effect this year that it didn’t have every other year or even the utterly ludicrous notion that somehow the flu “just stayed away this year” because we washed our hands more often, anything but deal with the facts, which demolish their complicity theories.

          4. Aegis

            Jim, I *am* looking at the issue.

            There was a massive investment in hospital capacity, starting in September last year.

            You seem to want to ignore this, or you don’t understand it. So we used a percentage of THAT capacity. But thats a broad number that doesn’t capture just how many ICU and other critical care beds were used. And for infection control reasons, you can’t use every bed on a multi bed ward. Finally you are going to be limited by staff shortages and skill shortages, and many had to isolate after coming into close contact or even being infected by covid patients.

            You are living in some kind of la la land where you don’t know nearly anything enough to understand these numbers.

  1. Vinnie

    The account you’re amplifying there has some interesting factless views on vaccines, child trafficking, etc etc.

    1. Jim

      im pro safe vax. But i can separate one argument from another – is there some reason that you can’t? You can verify the numbers with the downloads, call up the HSE and ask them to confirm it, the details of the FOI people are all there. THeyve told you all year that the health service was at breaking point. This says it wasnt.

      Your attitude is akin to ignoring a fireman who tells you your house is on fire because you disagree with his stance on vaccines and climate change. Separating the two, treating issues separately and investigating their worth, is the key to a civilised society that makes progress.

  2. Murtles

    Same across the country that in the last year occupancy of A&E Departments have been down up to 60% in some places. It goes to show that the amount of time wasters and con jobbers that attend an A&E for non emergency conditions or just attend to get a record of attendance or a certificate so they can con their employer or insurance or something else.

    1. Daisy Chainsaw

      No pubs and clubs open so less drunken accidents and fights. Social distancing, hand hygiene and lockdown means less flu spreading. Why is that chilling?

      1. Jim

        think youre missing the point. Theyve shut down the country and destroyed half a million jobs because they said the health service was at breaking point

        1. Brother Barnabas

          let’s keep going with this line of thought, jim

          they said they had to shut down the country because otherwise cases would be so high that the health service would collapse under strain of numbers

          so they shut down the country

          so health service didnt collapse

          so you reckon this proves it wasnt necessary to shut down the country?

          question people should be asking is why was the health service so utterly incapable of coping with an increase in numbers – way less capable than any other health service in western europe – hence necessitating most severe lockdown anywhere. anyone who has ever voted for FF or FG bears responsibility for this.

          1. Tinytim

            Agreed BB. the action to close resulted in fewer urgent hospitalisation. Also delays in seeing non urgent at this time,to avoid what is deemed as unnecessary risk, results in less occupancy.

            The system itself was/is still under pressure. When my father had a stroke last month, living <2km from Wexford hospital we was collected by an ambulance dispatched from Thurles. Great paramedics, did their job great I have to say. Obviously no ambulance in wexford, Waterford, Kilkenny, south Dublin was available.
            ( I live in Ballyfermot typically <1hr30 door to door, I know Thurles is 2hrs )

            Maybe the question is ‘why was everything at such a high capacity in previous years?’
            If I was a hotelier running those occupancy percentages I would be happy. – was the HSE running at full capacity continuously because this is a choke point limiting through put of cases? Do they need more staff before more beds ( accepting some staff deal with day patients) ? Is the HSE actually extremely efficient and lean that it can be run with such a small tolerances? Is the government running/funding the HSE such that it needs to be as efficient as private business?

            Is there going to be a new better model for hospitals proposed, many smaller ones – such that if a single hospital is impacted by illness the others are not, will our model hospital, more expensive than the Burj Khalifa actually become immediately obsolete?!

            I have more questions than answers!

        2. delacaravanio

          The health service has been at breaking point for years. The reason they locked down is because intensive care was at breaking point. We have the fewest ICU beds per capital in the EU.

          1. Cian

            Nope. We are near the bottom, below average, but not worst.
            Portugal and Sweden are the bottom two.

  3. Johnny

    …given this govt has been accused by a Nobel prize winner of leprechaun math,regarding gross domestic product,a healthy level of skepticism is warranted.

  4. eoin

    There seems to be several sets of ‘facts’ for every single aspect of this pandemic. How can anyone make an informed decision?

    1. Rob_G

      I find a good rule of thumb is to listen to big international organisations whose name is made up of initials, and not listen to people on Twitter whose job is ‘Youtuber’, or ‘Bitcoin trader’.

  5. Cian

    The hospitals need to separate Covid from non-Covid patients. Which plays havoc with occupancy. You can be “full” but have empty beds.

    e.g. If you have two 6-bed wards, you put your Covid in one, non-Covid in the other…. if you have 6 Covid and 2 Non-Covid… then you cannot take any more Covid patients (even though there are 4 empty beds – because those beds are only suitable for Covid-negaive patients)

    1. Jim

      think youre missing the point. Theyve shut down the country and destroyed half a million jobs because they said the health service was at breaking point. There was room for those elderly people to stay too!

      1. Daisy Chainsaw

        Was there?

        Was there the staff to cover it?

        What part of the health service do you work in?

        1. Jim

          its in the stats in the FOI, have you even looked? James’s was at 48% the month they started putting covid sick elderly people back into nursing homes. If you don;t believe it call the FOI controller on the download to verify the figures, then call the mirror to confirm the 54 people were sent out of the hospital to nursing homes full of chronically ill elderly hospice people on their last legs, when all the staff had been evacuated and so many homes were on bare bones crews. Not to mention there was no nurses and doctors there like in, ya know, the hospital they had come from!

          DO you not think, if its such a deadly disease, they should have kept those people there until it was at least approaching full?

          How on earth can you stand over this?

          1. Cian

            Damned if you do, damned if you dont.

            The HSE saw what happened in Italy so were proactive and emptied the hospitals as much as they could to ensure there would be space for the Covid wave.
            This, mixed with a reduction in staff (anyone testing positive had to stay home), and necessary isolation of patents meant the hospitals could be full and sill have unoccupied beds.

            If they *had* run out of beds, people like you would be bitching about it and saying “they knew it was going to happen, why didn’t they empty the hospitals” and “why are they leaving all the vulnerable patients in hospitals full of Covid.”

  6. Karl

    Christ, BS is really becoming highly disingenuous to say the least, and veering sharply into conspiracy theory. You HAVE to be careful with who you link and what you put out.

    Do you not think that the huge reduction in flu spreading for 2020/21 counts as anything? Or the huge work done to reduce the covid numbers by the (incredibly tough, admittedly) lockdowns?

    Have an iota of sense.

    1. Jim

      think youre missing the point. Why were those elderly people sent to understaffed nursing homes to die if the hospitals had ample capacity to keep them. Take your blinkers off…did you even read the bloody article?

      1. Karl

        Err I did, you clearly didn’t.
        I agree that the elderly shouldn’t have been sent back to the homes. I also agree with an earlier commentator that the state of the health service is an incredible disaster, to say the least. But your comment doesn’t address what this post was talking about.

        The government need to be held to account for any mistakes made, but they locked down sooner to save lives, implemented financial supports and didn’t (in the words of another of your comments) suspend the entire constitution.

        The did however mess up the Christmas message, which led to this third wave. You can see the devastation this has wrought through illness and death. Imagine if we hadn’t been guidance by common sense health advice?

        1. Jim

          But they havent saved lives. Theyve cost thousands based on that article’s rudimentary deduction from a Doctor’s predictions from the US. Every day we accept a closed health service MORE people are having dangerous life threatening illnesses undiagnosed.

      1. Anti Bots

        Bring back SOQ for more click bait ploppy-poo. Oh and more articles on the Guards. More clickbait.

    1. Jim

      you people make me weep for the future of this country. The numbers are there in black and white, yet you spout words like ‘conspiracy theory’ instead of discussing the issue at hand. Utterly selfish, as long as you’re fine and not scared no worries eh? Be damned those people with chronic illnesses that kill tens of thousands every year. Sound

  7. TypeONegative

    Whats the angle here?; That medical and scientific professionals across the world overestimated the pandemic, and what? Now they’re all collectively keeping up some kind of pandemic charade just to save face?

    Or is the angle that governments worldwide are conspiring to put masks on the populations in order to gradually brainwash us poor ignorant sheeple? And us average Joes are wearing masks because we’re blind fools, and not because we’re generally reasonable humans who have made our own judgements of the situation and decided to follow prescribed precautions?

    Had a look at this dudes twitter acccount. Scrolled barely a page down and there’s a retweet denying climate change. And thats just the very first thing I saw, seems like a reputable fellow.
    Will you be denying climate change next Bodger?

    1. millie bobby brownie

      In other news:

      Earth Is Flat as a Pancake!
      We were utterly wrong, says RoundEarth CEO.

    2. Micko

      I think it’s full of complex angles TypeO

      Is the pandemic real? Yes of course.

      Have people died from covid? Yes of course

      Was it a massive overreaction soured on by scenes of Italian hospitals and people dropping dead in the streets in China? Perhaps – but no one is to blame.

      Have governments around the world used this opportunity to funnel million of dosh into bank accounts of themselves and friends? Absolutely- just look at the ministers in the UK giving contracts to mates and ROQU here.

      Is there a global billionaires list that have a great interest in keeping the pandemic going? Yes, lots of them have seen their balances rise (admittedly, some have seen them decline too)

      So, it’s complex. ;)

      Yes, people have died – but we’re getting close to the point of having to accept that some people will just die of Covid every year and we’re just going to have to live with it.

  8. Shitferbrains

    There seems to be a notion going the rounds in BS that the reader won’t look at the timeline of whatever Tweeting maniac is being pushed.

  9. Jim

    the angle is clear to me, we shouldnt be locked down and having our constitution suspended, and so many jobs destroyed, And if theres room in hospitals then all those numbers of people who were in hospitals for the three prior years should be getting treatment. Disease screening has been closed, meaning illnesses are being missed, and therefore are getting worse with each passing day. Unless you think COvid got rid of cancer, diabetes, and heart disease as well as the flu. Then all is fine

    1. millie bobby brownie

      Disease screening is absolutely not suspended, Jim.

      My mother in law was diagnosed with cancer and has been treated in the past 6 months, regardless of covid restrictions, and the high level of cases and deaths seen in the past 3 months.

      My daughter too has been seriously unwell since January and has been receiving treatment, again regardless of covid restrictions and the strain on our healthcare system.

      1. Micko

        Sorry to hear about your Mum in law and your daughter Millie.

        Hope they are both doing ok. :)

        1. millie bobby brownie

          Thanks Micko. Tough few months is all I’ll say. The wee miss is doing me proud, she’s handled her illness (a lifetime condition, we have been told) with unbelievable resilience and good cheer. I’m incredibly proud of her.

          Mammy in law is (fingers crossed) on the mend and will hopefully be in remission shortly.

  10. newsjustin

    Yeah. This is madness.

    All hospital beds are the same. All wards and hospitals are the same. Obviously there’s no emergency because I saw a ward closed in Listowel Community Hospital. If COVID was really a thing, there’d be 25 people crammed in there…on bunk beds.

    Clearly politicians, HSE, doctors, nurses, scientists are all in this together. I don’t know how, but they’re really, really benefitting from this fake emergency.

    1. Brother Barnabas

      occured to me that the nurses might be doing this for attention

      always really needy

    2. Jim

      the nurses now have handy lives. The gardai now have handy lives, policing a lockeddown society, no pubs open. The politicians now have handy lives – dont have to go to work, no hard questions asked ever of anyone. THe population on the PUP had handy lives, work from home in Jammies. THe civil service have handy lives, work from home no public interaction any more. There’s more but i wont bother as you wont see it.

      But there’s plenty of people benefiting from what is definitely a real emergency, and plenty of people who may not want to go back to the real world.

        1. Commenter #1

          This is a great question, I always enjoy hearing what people come up with in response.

  11. K.Cavan

    In 1980, we had 17,000 hospital beds. Go find out how many we now have, with a far higher population.

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